Noles by The Numbers (Updated), Blogpoll Final Ballot, Daily Notes, and Wednesday Open Recruiting Thread
by Bud Elliott on Nov 19, 2008 3:58 PM EST
in FSU Football
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PrintInside, you'll find the weekly compliation of Nole Numbers, my final Blogpoll Ballot, daily notes and links. This is also Wednesday, which means we will ask and answer recruiting questions.
Please check out yesterday's thread. 0 comments and not many views on what is a huge piece chock full of info. I know it seems intimidating, but work your way through it and come away with a better understanding of Saturday's game. Plus, I'm still adding evaluations to the article.
Noles by the Numbers
| Source | National Ranking | ACC Ranking | SOS Ranking | ||
| Fremeau Effeciency Index | 13 | 5th | 39 (3rd hardest remaining) | Opponent Adjusted Offensive Efficiency: 18th | Opponent Adjusted Defensive Efficiency: 23th |
| The methodology behind the calculations are found http://bcftoys.blogspot.com/2006/10/efficiency-in-college-football.html, and this week's rankings are http://footballoutsiders.com/fei-ratings/fei-week-10-ratings (with full explanations) | These interesting strength of schedule rankings are explained http://footballoutsiders.com/fei-ratings/fei-week-6-ratings | Kicking Expectancy: 1st (by a huge margin) | Field Position Expectancy (measure of return and coverage teams): 100th! Egads! | ||
| Phil Steele | tied for 45th | 7th | 65th in Opponent Adhusted Pass Efficiency Defense | ||
| Dinnich, ESPN.com ACC Blogger | INC | ||||
| ACC SEC Blog | 7th | ||||
| Sagarin | 25 | 4th | 74th | 30th in Predictor Ratings (power poll ranking) | |
| Acc Football Report | 24 | 5th | |||
| AP Poll | NR | NR | |||
| Coaches Poll | NR | NR | |||
| Stewart Mandel (SI.com) | 28th | 6th | |||
| CBS Sports Blogpoll | 28th | 6th | |||
| CBS Sports 120 | 28th | 5th | |||
| Harriss Poll | 28th | 5th | |||
| BCS | NR | NR | |||
| College Football News | 19 | 4th | |||
| Dr. Saturday | 24th | 5 | |||
| Avowed Resume ranker, formerly known as Sunday Morning Quarterback (SMQ). |
Blogpoll Ballot
 |
||
| Rank | Team | Strength of Schedule |
|---|---|---|
| 1 | Texas Tech | 67 |
| 2 | Alabama |
76 |
| 3 | Texas | 34 |
| 4 | Florida | 59 |
| 5 | Oklahoma | 55 |
| 6 | Southern Cal | 76 |
| 7 | Penn State | 51 |
| 8 | Oklahoma State | 32 |
| 9 | Georgia | 26 |
| 10 | Ohio State | 9 |
| 11 | Missouri | 56 |
| 12 | Michigan State | 45 |
| 13 | North Carolina | 10 |
| 14 | Cincinnati | 54 |
| 15 | Pittsburgh | 73 |
| 16 | Miami (Florida) | 1 |
| 17 | Oregon State | 25 |
| 18 | Utah | 105 |
| 19 | Boston College | 5 |
| 20 | Maryland | 18 |
| 21 | Iowa | 33 |
| 22 | California | 44 |
| 23 | Mississippi | 15 |
| 24 | Florida State | 21 |
| 25 | Georgia Tech | 6 |
This is not a power poll. I don't attempt to rank teams based on how good I think they are. I only rank teams based on their resume. The poll is designed to be dynamic. I try to start from scratch every week. I do attempt to reward teams for "quality losses", while punishing them for bad performances. I do not give excessive credit for stomping horrible teams. As always, I want your help. Keep in mind though that I don't want "team X is way better than team Y." I do want "team A has a better resume than team B, you should make the change." Power poll rankings are dumb.
The teams ranked 16, 19, 23, 24 all lost to lesser ranked or unranked foes this past weekend. Several others had scares How are those power polls working for them? I do not consult major polls when doing this. Their record of futility is clear. Let the teams earn their rankings on the field. I try to remove as much subjectivity as possible. The AP Poll and it's counterparts are silly. Ranking teams based on who you think is good is not going to work. We don't know how great teams truly are until they play the games on the field. I rank what happens on the field. This system is not perfect. I like to reward playing well against good teams, win or lose, and punish losing to poor teams more harshly than I reward defeating poor teams.
Themes:
Reward Grinders. I like to reward those who play difficult schedules. Those mid-majors do not have to prepare for difficult games on a weekly basis, and I take that into account. After finally getting a chance to watch these guys, I realized that they are not at the level of ranked teams from major conferences. Additionally, their schedule strengths were incredibly inflated because they had all played each other, who were also ranked highly. These teams are not talented. They are able to focus on their 1 game of the year against a big-6 conference team for several weeks. The BCS team views them as a schedule break. Letdown city. I am really against power-polling, but none of these teams deserve to play in a BCS game and I am no longer rewarding teams in any way for simply not losing to the likes of Eastern Illinois and Nevada. Utah is in, but barely.
From the CBS SPORTS.COM Blogpoll Editorial:
Tomahawk Nation is a repeat Mr. Bold winner; last week they won by hating on the mid-majors and throwing in some other oddities like #14 South Carolina. This week: pretty much the same. Someone did prevail on TN to give Utah a chance, as they have wins over BYU, Oregon State and (uh, is this impressive?) Michigan, and the Utes surge eight spots. Everyone else outside a BCS conference can get bent.
Hey, I'm generally on TN's side here—I think the mid-majors in the poll above are generally overrated—but Utah is still under Oregon State, which, like… ain't right.
I give Utah some credit for winning their game against a decent Oregon State team, but Oregon State faced a much tougher schedule and their loss to Utah was by a minuscule 3 points, in a Thursday night road game-- a bugaboo for many teams. I am also consistently lenient on teams who lose cross country road games.
Tomahawk Nation pulls off the impressive feat of retaining Mr. Bold and winning Mr. Manic Depressive in the same week. Usually it's hard for an outlying ballot to change a lot without getting significantly closer to the norm. A large portion of the winning margin here is the disappearance of South Carolina, previously #14, for obvious reasons; that weird vote gave TN the edge.
I had been rewarding South Carolina under the "playing well, win or lose" idea, but their loss to UF was more damaging in my eyes than the aggregate value of their other 3 losses. They're out.
Daily Notes
1. The ACC
It’s finally starting to come together. John Swofford’s raid on the Big East for all the good teams (other than West Virginia) is starting to pay off as the foundation has been set for the ACC to become the super-conference it was supposed to be a few years ago.
Some might call it mediocrity with everyone other than NC State and Duke still with an outside shot at winning the ACC title, but this is the year when everyone is rising up. Tom O’Brien’s Wolfpack and David Cutliffe’s Blue Devils are hardly pushovers, while the rest of the league is getting really good, and it’s still really young.
You scoff? Just look at some of the non-conference wins of note this year. There might be some blowout losses, like USC’s blasting of Virginia, South Florida’s crushing of NC State and Florida’s win over Miami, but Boston College (Notre Dame), Duke (Vanderbilt, Navy), Florida State (Colorado), Georgia Tech (Mississippi State), Maryland (California), Miami (Texas A&M), North Carolina (Rutgers, Notre Dame, Connecticut), NC State (East Carolina), Virginia (East Carolina), Virginia Tech (Nebraska), Wake Forest (Baylor, Ole Miss), have put together the best non-conference résumé of any league in America.
The league is only getting better with phenomenal coaching everywhere but, at the moment, Clemson. There hasn’t been a week off for anyone this year, and things are only going to get tougher as stars Butch Davis, Paul Johnson, Tom O’Brien, Jeff Jagodzinski and Randy Shannon have a bit more time to work with their respective programs, Frank Beamer, Bobby Bowden and Ralph Friedgen each producing, and Jim Grobe still working wonders at Wake Forest.
Give it one more year, maybe two, and the league will really start to rock. The pieces are in place.
Last Night's Basketball Performance
| Offense | Defense | |||||||||||||
| Date | Opponent | Result | Site | Pace | Eff. | eFG% | TO% | OR% | FTR | Eff. | eFG% | TO% | OR% | FTR |
| Sat Nov 15 | Jacksonville (s) (sr) | W, 59-57 | A | 69 | 85.6 | 52.4 | 26.1 | 18.8 | 73.2 | 82.7 | 36.0 | 16.0 | 33.3 | 26.5 |
| Tue Nov 18 | La Salle (s) (sr) | W, 65-61 | A | 71 | 92.0 | 45.8 | 25.5 | 26.9 | 58.3 | 86.3 | 40.0 | 19.8 | 31.5 | 30.0 |
Well, it looks like we actually did deserve to win. Out ball handling is totally atrocious. I think we need to use the more veteran, lesser talented lineup on a more consistent basis.
Open Recruiting Thread
I'll post the choice questions and answers here. Ask away.
A new candidate for Defensive Coordinator: Phil Parker. Look him up. More later
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Comments
Man I was going to add him to Phil to the list
I was looking at the Def stats for Iowa yesterday when we were talking about it and I thought he would be a good pick. the only problem is that teams are running on Iowa. They might not pass good and his Teams does have 18 pick so far this season. I like this If we can also pick up a better guy for the LB and DE. I also thing Odell Haggins should stick around and go from the DT to getting the hole D- line. This would let us pick up another coach for somewhere else. What would be the chance we could get this guy. If not him what about the one from TCU.
Recruiting is a negative on Parker
I don’t think he has much experience going after top rated high school recruits.
I like what I see in regards to his ability to take the “lesser star” guys and turn them into great players, but you’ve got to wonder if a fanbase that is unhappy with 3 and 4 star talent would accept 2 and 3 star talent.
I think you're assuming that he'd continue to recruit 2 and 3* talent. I don't agree.
His zone is Florida. His school is Iowa. Fla kids don’t want to go to Iowa. I think he’d do as good a job as Mickey.
I stand corrected.
I did not realize he had been given the task of selling balogna to a steak eater.
Sort of recruiting related
Another board had this article posted about our top commit, Jacobbi McDaniel..
http://www.wctv.tv/sports/super6headlines/19551549.html
Sounds like the defense has a new nickname: “Beast Mode.”
On the same subject
Which of our current commits (or even possible commits) can have an instant impact on the field??
I think McDaniel could see a lot of playing time considering how thin we are at the position. Also, Starling if he were to commit could see immediate playing time.
I think we have to get Starling.
I think we’re losing our grip on Lincoln and I agree he would see the field early.
If Downs plays safety (and qualifies) he will play early as well. CaStauch is of the opinion that Harley should stay at FS, and he’d get playing time as a freshman too.
McAllister and McDaniel will be all over the D-Line rotation.
So the clear pattern is: DT and Safety recruits will play, and play soon.
If Brinson came back he’d probably play. And we always use our LBs on special teams so Mizell will play some.
Starling and McDaniel like you've mentioned
You’ve got to put McAllister in there too. McDaniel, McAllister, and McCray (The MC boys lol) will be a rock in the middle hopefully for the next few years.
We still need a good cover corner and I highly doubt Kirkpatrick will be coming so our best hope is Branden Smith out of GA but I think he’s headed to UGA. He is visiting for the FSU-UF game so if we impress him there then maybe.
I don’t expect too many offensive players to breakout out of this freshman group. IF we pull a really good TE like Charles or Lutzenkirchen (though they would have to be really special to take over with Reliford and Little on the roster already, plus Caz).
Don’t expect a DE or LB to make an immediate impact either, though we are bringing a couple in who under the right situation could (Mizell at LB- he will in spec. teams- and possibly Vernon- if we get him- at DE because he’s the biggest currently).
We are already stacked with young talent at OL so all our freshmen OL could redshirt.
We are stacked next year at RB but I could see Pryor getting playing time if we lose one like we did with Pressley this year. Also Thompson could get time too should we get low on the Slot receiver depth chart since he could be really good there as a Harvin/Bush type player. (Reed suspensions, Parker leaving, etc).
Being in Alabama,
let me confirm that Kirkpatrick is going to UA. He is a lock.
I’m more confident on Charles than some.
S_barrow, did you see the discussion on Pryor moving to Safety?
I think we get Ricco Sanders.
Is Parker a lock to leave?
No I did not see the discussion of Pryor to Safety
And in my opinion that would be a mistake because that kid is lightning in a bottle with the ball in his hands. I’m not sure on Sanders since he was scheduled to visit with all the Byrnes kids for the Clemson game but decided not to come…
And no I’m not saying Parker is a lock to leave but it is a possibility so thats one way Thompson would have a better chance at seeing the field his freshman season.
Parker leaving...
It’s a possibility. Don’t know if it’s a probability. His performance this season has probably cost him some money, and I don’t think he will measure well at the Combine.
But when have our receivers ever done the logical thing?
Pryor to safety Discussion
He isn’t an especially decisive runner; lacks a great feel for finding cutback lanes. His high-cut frame hinders his pick-and-slide quickness through traffic. Could struggle in a zone-heavy college rushing scheme. Lacks a consistent burst through traffic or acceleration at the second level; he’s basically a one-gear back. He also shows the range, instincts and run-support skills to have a future safety._ESPN.COM
The discussion was mostly here: http://www.tomahawknation.com/2008/11/17/663813/been-thinking#10103711
We can keep it up here, though
As much as I like Pryor as a RB
I think he could benefit the team more as a safety. We are stacked at RB with Thomas, Pressley, Jones and now Thompson and Pryor.
by ChileanNole on Nov 19, 2008 10:04 AM EST up reply actions
I've seen his videos
And I disagree with ESPN on this one. He may be buried on the DC initially but he will start getting valuable playing time while he gets better running in a zone-blocking scheme. To move him to Safety is taking away some valuable skills of his.
So there's nothing to the idea that he has to have a fullback?
Their eval scares me to be honest.
by Bud Elliott on Nov 19, 2008 10:11 AM EST up reply actions
Can't say for sure
But honestly who has seen him play more- the idiots at ESPN who do not focus enough on talent eval or someone like me who has watched maybe 10 minutes of highlight film. Whats sad is I don’t know the answer to that one. All I know is that the kind of numbers he puts up can’t be on accident. Plus he could put another 15-20 lbs and be a bigger back for us.
The knock on ESPN is that they don't project how much someone will grow; not how a player fits a system or how he currently plays.
Rivals is too much about potential.
ESPN is not enough.
I like that ESPN isn’t all about camps and actually watches game film.
by Bud Elliott on Nov 19, 2008 10:47 AM EST up reply actions
I echo Matt's thoughts here.
Does anyone know about Brinson’s alleged run-in with the law? Does anyone remember this? Happened within the last year.
From what I remember he was cleared
Not sure of the actual story though.
Another Recruting question.
How do you see us finishing this class??
I guess this is not as easy of a question as it sounds because you have to factor in the possible reduction in scholarships as well as players that will leave (some may be forced to leave) so the exact number of remaining scholarships is not certain.
I say:
We lose Stinson but get Vernon at DE
Jawanza Starling (Please let it happen)
Khyri Thornton
Starlington
I don’t see us getting him…unless we’re moving he or another saftey to reciever or OLB or something. We are heavy on that position and just don’t think he will join the sardine can.
I dont mean this in a bad way...but are you serious?
Safety may be our thinnest position next year. Rolle, Lawson and McClure are gone. Starling can see immediate pplaying time as he may be better than the current backups
clarification
I meant to say that we have 4-5 saftey commits in this class… he may not want to compete with them for early playing time, when he can virtually pick his school.
I think we get five more.
If we were to trade Stinson for Vernon I’d consider it a dramatic upgrade.
As for who is in my five?
-Starling (Maybe I’m being a bit of a Polly-Anna but I don’t want to imagine a situation where we let him get away)
-Thornton
-Ricco Sanders
-Brinson
-No clue. Maybe a 185 pound OL who will grayshirt and Warchant will call a “clear sleeper who was under-rated” and “the proto-typical Trickett lineman”
Upgrade
I would call it an even swap….Stinson is very good thats why Alabama and LSU are all over him.
Stinson is definitely good.
I didn’t mean to give the impression I didn’t want him. And I should probably not have said “dramatic.” I feel like Vernon will be able to contribute sooner than Stinson, though.
Either one would be great to get.
You're right
Vernon could contribute more immediately but I don’t know if we need a more immediate contributor. Stinson’s ceiling is higher though and he has a LOT of upside. I wish we could get both but doubt it.
Check out our DE roster.
Now take out Brown and Moffett. Markus White will play on one side. Who else scares you? And considering how much we rotate guys, we just don’t have the depth to wait.
If it’s an either/or proposition.
Let’s get both and call it a day. Because you are right, in 2.5 years Stinson is going to be amazing.
McNeil have played a lot this year
And has shown he is good in the past. Dawkins I believe will stick to DE and Jackson is there as well. Thats 4 players with White. Stevens COULD be really good here is he can add good weight this year. Fact is we do have depth here, though not a lot proven outside of some flashes from White and McNeil. Those two can hold down the starting jobs I think and we have those other 3 coming off the bench. So unless Vernon comes in day 1 better than some of those we don’t need that instant impact type player. Vernon is good but thats a lot to put on his plate as he is not IMO the impact type player that Jacobbi McDaniel is.
Are we assuming McNiel stays eligible? I'm hearing that is dangerous.
I hope Dawkins plays DE. We desperately need someone at 265, not the 240 we sometimes throw out.
Next Year the DT’s could be decent. People do not want to hear it, but with another year, Thacker could move from avg-below avg to above avg. That could happen by adding 10-15 good lbs. He might not be as quick, but could become more of a load in the middle. I expect McCray to play at 305lbs eventually. Maybe 310.
Totally not sold on Vernon switching yet.
DTs
We have one Immediate impact type of DT coming in. We could use at least 2 of that caliber, and there seems to be no one (who we have a legitimate chance of getting) on the horizon.
Are we just going to let this one pass. I mean, what good is a fab. linebacker core if we can’t keep the gaurds from getting down field and sitting on them?
We have two VERY good ones coming in
McDaniel and McAllister are studs. There is also a possibility with Thornton if he gets his grrades/test scores straight and the coaches still accept his commitment. McCloud will hopefuly be coming in the year after as well from JUCO.
McCallister is projected to play DE...
We need BEEF in the middle…don’t have it…and aren’t looking like we’re going to get it.
Even McDaniel (as good as he is) is on the small side for a 5 start.
JC
Are there any JC or prep school guys out there that we could plug in right away. We seems to have a niche for that. I know it is a gamble sometimes, but some of them have really paid off. Just not Joe Tonga.
I'm not sure on this
I though I heard that Brinson could be coming back this year. I dont think McCloud will be back until 2010??
Been Busy
So I haven’t been able to read much or comment at all this week. I am looking forward to the Maryland game though. When do we get the previews rolling? This is my first Seminole game this year, and have a lot of concerns.
Heather Dinich reports that they have moved Ingram to safety for a little depth. I wouldn’t be surprised to see them attacking the middle of the field with the run and pass.
I'll have the preview Friday Morning, and the Q&A Thursday.
Thanks for the Ingram report.
by Bud Elliott on Nov 19, 2008 10:03 AM EST up reply actions
Ingram played Safety Until this Year
He was moved to LB this year. He’s 6’6" and has trouble seeing the field because of depth at LB. He could be a really good Rover for us and I expect him and Jaime Robinson to get a lot of time at the two safety spots until Myron gets there. Hopefully Rolle will have his head in the game.
This tells me the coaches are pretty concerned over Maryland's run game.
by Bud Elliott on Nov 19, 2008 10:04 AM EST up reply actions
Why wouldn't they be
Da’Rel Scott is as good as anyone in the country at running between the tackles. He has a great center that can really move people off the ball. As soon as these LB’s creep up to help our dismal DT’s, the middle of the field becomes wide open for a TE or a Reciever. With our starting Safteys out, This can’t help. I dont believe we will see a ton of Ingram, but it could help as far as run support. It also back him off the ball a bit more and helps him see the field. I think the issue of having Myron’s head in the game is going to be huge. Thats a long day for him. It may give us a motivational lift, but I dont know how useful he will be considering his head is one of his problems on the field.
Def Coordinator
I know we have been talking a lot since Saturday night about Mickey and his inability to scheme. Just curious to see what type of defense people think would best suit the type of athletes that FSU recruits. On top of recruiting, what else should we value and need to look for in a defensive coordinator?
A few factors
Doesn’t rely solely on athletes (doing a good job with lesser players)
New idea thinker (read: young, understand statistics, leverage, etc.)
Adaptable.
Able to translate recruiting skills to FSU
Doesn’t have inflated performance due to offensively inept conference (NOT SEC)
by Bud Elliott on Nov 19, 2008 10:10 AM EST up reply actions
Def Coordinator
While we currently don’t have the personnel to run a 3-4, I think that’s what we should be moving to. We’d have to get some bigger LBs to play the middle and juggle our DE/OLB responsibilites, but we could do it.
Qualities Needed:
1. Creative Game Planner
Offenses shouldn’t be able to put in tape from 5 years ago to know what to expect from us on Saturday.
2. In the event Number 1 fails, be effective at making adjustments on the fly.
Sometimes stuff doesn’t work out on Saturday like it did Sunday-Thursday. In the words of Keenan Thompson on SNL, “FIX IT!” Halftime adjustments are great and we should expect them. But if they are blowing the doors off of us in the first quarter, it shouldn’t take another fifteen minutes to figure it out.
3. Youth
I want someone coaching the defense who was not alive before the forward pass was invented.
4. Experience
Some may consider this to negate number 3, but I don’t. Muschamp is young, but he has the chops. Texas had no problem giving him the keys to the car and I wouldn’t either.
5. Discipline
Not so much that no one wants to play for him, but he’s got to run a tight ship. When I was a young kid I do what I wanted in the yard, but if I went down the street too far I was in some trouble.
*5b. His players should not make more stupid mistakes than any other team in the conference/country. Penalties are fine and sometimes beneficial. Aggressiveness is always fine by me. Stupid penalties and stupid aggressiveness are not.
6. Recruiting
Norm Chow is about as interesting as bread mold, but he gets the job done and puts players into the NFL. Put players in the NFL from our defense, and with our other resources the recruits will come. I’d also try to surround him with assistants that can recruit and allow them to do the bulk of the recruiting legwork. As long as the coordinator coordinates, and does it well, we’d be fine recruiting.
7. Good Guy (This part is my personal opinion)
Eh… I’m still a softie for Coach Bowden because he is a good Christian man and a down-to-earth kind of guy. I’m not yet ready for “win at all costs.” Urban Meyer is a douche.
*Grammar fix because stuff like this gets on my nerves
Number 5 should read “I could do what I wanted”
# 9. Must teach pattern reads in zone drops. We do NOT do this, few teams do, and it drives me nuts.
From smartfootball.blogspot.com:
Other Techniques – Cornerback Leverage and Pattern Reading
Finally, let’s discuss some coverage techniques. The first is that Saban likes to have his cornerbacks adjust their "leverage" on a receiver based on the receiver’s split from the tackle and sideline. The theory is that if the wide receiver has cut his split down he has done one of two things: (a) given himself more room to run an out breaking route, or (b) cheated in to run a crossing or deep in-breaking route. So if the receiver cheats his split in, Saban has his cornerbacks align outside the receiver to defend the out-breaking route, because if he runs the in-breaking route the corner has help from the linebackers and safeties. Similarly, if the receiver lines up very wide (bottom of the numbers, let’s say), he has given himself room to run an in-breaking route like a slant. So the cornerback will align inside the receiver to take that route away and on the belief that an out-cut from that wide will be very difficult for the quarterback. To coach this Saban uses a "divider" line where they believe the receiver’s tendencies change to reflect one of the above two strategies. Nevertheless, the defensive back still must defend the route the receiver actually runs and maintain proper technique, but this is an important starting point.
More significant, however, is that Saban heavily coaches up "pattern reading" within his zone drops. The two zone-dropping schools of thought are to teach "spot-drops" or "pattern-reading." One can overemphasize the distinction, but generally spot-dropping is easier to teach and was the traditional approach. For example, if your outside linebacker is responsible for the weak-flat, he will take his read steps and, upon reading pass, will drop to a spot and then react to the QB’s eyes. A big advantage with spot-dropping is simply that it is easy to teach to, say, a run-stuffing inside linebacker who spends most of his time on run game pursuit and shedding blocks. But the weakness is that well coached receivers – who have enough time – can become excellent at settling in the "zone holes" between defenders. And, with good receivers and good QBs, offenses have become more and more adept and finding and exploiting these zone holes.
We currently do a ridiculously poor job of this.
Pattern-reading, on the other hand, is much like a matchup-zone in basketball. Defenders are responsible for zones but they basically play man on the receivers who come into their zones. Moreover, pattern-read teams begin by immediately coaching their defenders on how to recognize popular pass combinations (and indeed, the very concept of pass-combinations themselves), and each week zero in on the 5-15 most common pass concepts they will see from that opponent. When done correctly, pattern-reading defenders know exactly how to cover receivers in their zones and seamlessly (in a quite literal sense) pass the receivers onto other defenders as they run their routes. One thing that distinguishes Saban is that he uses pattern-reading in almost all of his coverages, including the traditional Cover 3, whereas many coaches only let certain defenders pattern read or only use it with certain defenses like Cover 4. Sounds a lot like Belichick, no?
by Bud Elliott on Nov 19, 2008 10:30 AM EST up reply actions
only one problem
in the play above I like what you do and I see the coverage but WHAT IF:
- X WR take a step and takes the pass there then its almost going to be a 4-6yrd before anyone gets to him and then the only people would be the CB or the FS.
Also when the Z wr runs a slant or drag it would pull the SS/ S LB over and leave the FB open in the flats.
Last with Play action in the mix I feel a cover 3 would work much better but Im prob reading to much into this
I think this is Play Action,
and if you’re passing off defenders like you should in zone, it will give them a tight window to throw to. If the X only takes one step up, the weak would probably drift to him, no?
I’m not saying to run this on every play, it’s just an example of pattern reading.
by Bud Elliott on Nov 19, 2008 11:24 AM EST up reply actions
# 8 Player Development (Tubberville)
I want our guys to consistently improve through good coaching as their careers progress. Currently, few of our guys improve at the pace I want.
by Bud Elliott on Nov 19, 2008 10:21 AM EST up reply actions
Good call.
And we should develop every player, not just the starters. Two injuries should not derail our season.
From Saban's Playbook
"[Our] philosophy on first and second down is to stop the run and play good zone pass defense. We will occasionally play man-to-man and blitz in this situation. On third down, we will primarily play man-to-man and mix-in some zone and blitzes. We will rush four or more players versus the pass about ninety-percent of the time.
We already do the bold part, to an extent, but what we don’t do well is in the next paragraph…
"In all situations, we will defend the inside or middle of the field first – defend inside to outside. Against the run, we will not allow the ball to be run inside. We want to force the ball outside. Against the pass, we will not allow the ball to be thrown deep down the middle or inside. We want to force the ball to be thrown short and/or outside.
This is how you should defend every college team except Georgia (Stafford has an arm to hit the whole field).
"… Finally, our job is to take the ball away from the opponents’ offense and score or set up good field position for our offense. We must knock the ball loose, force mistakes, and cause turnovers. Turnovers and making big plays win games. We will be alert and aggressive and take advantage of every opportunity to come up with the ball . . . . The trademark of our defense will be effort, toughness, and no mental mistakes regarding score or situation in any game.
by Bud Elliott on Nov 19, 2008 10:26 AM EST up reply actions
Excuse me Flo?
“Whats the soup dejour?? Thats the soup of the day”
“ooooo….that sounds good. i’ll have that”
lets adopt that. i havent gotten to watch a lot of alabama this year defensively. but i’m sure they are a hell of a lot better at disguising their D than we are….
haha, I just like the idea of actually coaching our players in an intelligent manner.
“Ohh, you boys been boozin have ha?”
by Bud Elliott on Nov 19, 2008 11:57 AM EST up reply actions
The 3-4 basically sends 4 rushers on every play. We're very capable of getting stand-up edge rushers.
We don’t have that nose tackle right now.
by Bud Elliott on Nov 19, 2008 11:33 AM EST up reply actions
I would love to see this
If we could get some DT with some size on them this will rock but its getting DT with size not speed. the DE would be more like LB
Since we are talking recruiting how about a look at the 2010 class.
Florida is LOADED, especially S.Fla.
My top 10 (Targets not rankings, doesnt include Darius Cummings alrdeay commited)
1. Lemarcus Joyner DB Miami,Fl
2. Brandon Willis DT Byrnes, SC
3. Eduardo Clements RB Miami,Fl
4. Marcus Lattimore RB Byrnes, SC
5. De’Joshua Johnson WR Pahokee, FL
6. Fred Pickett WR Belle Glade, Fl
7. Khiry McQuay CB Tampa, Fl
8. Gerald Christian TE Palm Beach Gardens, FL
9. Jared Haggins ATH Lakeland, Fl
10. Derek Owens CB Jacksonville ,Fl
Honorable Mention: Tiger Powell RB , Brandon Carr LB (Greg’s little brother), Corvin Lamb, Greg Hickman LB.
Happens to me all the time.
Agree thats why I have them in my top 5. I dont think we get both Clements and Lattimore, but unlike most people I like Clements better.
by ChileanNole on Nov 19, 2008 10:02 AM EST up reply actions
I like Lattimore a lot better, I just think he is a bit of a pipe-dream.
by Bud Elliott on Nov 19, 2008 10:15 AM EST up reply actions
Thats why I didnt understand why we were not recruiting Clements harder.
Dotn get me wrong, I understand we are a year and a half away from 2010 NSD but Clements is a stud and we are playing for a 3rd place finish with Lattimore.
by ChileanNole on Nov 19, 2008 10:22 AM EST up reply actions
That, I cannot answer. Maybe we are more confident on Footman or Smiley?
by Bud Elliott on Nov 19, 2008 10:26 AM EST up reply actions
I wouldn't count on Footman in this class
I’d put it at 20% personally. I think we are sitting better with Lattimore than you guys believe. It will be hard to pull him but we have his interest.
Yea he had a plan but was going to take a lot of work.
Is Smiley also 2010?? He is a Greg Jones type back. Very impressive film!!
by ChileanNole on Nov 19, 2008 10:43 AM EST up reply actions
clements has recently said that he has an FSU offer
and that FSU is his clear leader. He’s about as close to a lock as possible.
by andy_wooster on Nov 19, 2008 4:52 PM EST up reply actions
Clements
I will never call a South Florida kid a lock. Ice Harris worries me and he goes to a friendly UM school
Yeah me too.
I actually know somebody that played with Clements last year and he told me that he has been talking about going to FSU as far as he can remember so that makes me feel a little bit better, plus in every interview he has mentioned us as his leader. I just hope we didnt turn him off when we didnt offer him right away.
Yeah
I forgot to add him in the Honorable Mention list he will probably be in our class. BTW speaking of bloodlines to FSU I’m pretty sure that Jared Haggings is related to Odell.
From what I've read/heard
He may not be recruited as a QB. He could play multiple positions though he will prob get looks at QB if he can beat the competition.
Rivals just went to one of his games
said he’s top 100 material at WR.
by andy_wooster on Nov 21, 2008 9:26 PM EST up reply actions
yes, FSU
This is what Rivals wrote about him:
PERFORMANCE: Green played quarterback most of the night, showing inconsistency in throwing the ball but brilliance running the ball in a 28-16 loss to Tampa Jesuit.
STRENGTHS: Green is a dynamic athlete playing quarterback. He can run the zone-read effectively. Green has super speed and great quickness. As a passer, he was far more effective throwing on the perimeter. He has above-average strength. Green’s highest upside is at receiver, where he can be a potential national top-100 recruit.
He lists offers from FSU, UF, Michigan, and Tennessee, among others. I’d wager we take him as an athlete.
by andy_wooster on Nov 22, 2008 3:26 PM EST up reply actions
Good thing about South Florida
because Tally is down next year. No way Miami can keep all of those kids home. Also, anybody amused about what Michigan is doing? At this rate, Michigan will offer every 2010 kid in Florida.
Michigan is offering the whole Pahokee and Belle Glade team
I dont blame them though, they need playmakers and the kids from the Muck have proven to be playmakers even if their measurables dont say D1 football. I still think we are going to get the recruits we want from there, but Michigan is starting to become a major player in Fla. with Rich Rod.
I wouldn't exactly say that Michigan is a
major playerin FLA. The big 3 will still get who they want from Florida mostly.
Lemarcus Joyner
is such a friggin beast. Go watch his highlights. He is also my top target for 2010.
Should we? Might not have it during Florida Hate week. I'll also try to have a specific question to address each week.
by Bud Elliott on Nov 19, 2008 10:45 AM EST up reply actions
You could try and see how it goes
I know I love talkng about recruiting so I’ll be here.
by ChileanNole on Nov 19, 2008 10:49 AM EST up reply actions
I think it fits in the discussion of how Florida State wins a National Championship.
And I think this is a place where we can have a serious conversation about the direction of the program.
I woud add, however, that you might want to give it a probationary period before fully commiting as it could become a headache.
Do you think it would run out of gas if we don't focus the discussion with a specific question? Did you get my e-mail?
by Bud Elliott on Nov 19, 2008 11:09 AM EST up reply actions
Let's talk guys who could leave early and free up an unexpected schollie
Definitely Gone:
Everette Brown— degree in December, ESPN’s top DE, gone.
Myron Rolle— already said he’s gone.
Possibly turning pro
Patrick Robinson- combine guy
Dekoda Watson— combine guy
Preston Parker- has at least one kid, behavior issues in the past, could need the money.
Possibly ineligible
Kevin McNiel (there is a reason he decided to use the red shirt for the suspensions)
Mincey (previous academic stuff)
Watson (previous academic stuff)
The JUCO guys (White/ Pressley) who usually went to JUCO for a reason. Let’s hope not here.
Just a hunch
Moody needs to hit the books hard to prevent future problems.
Add: Thacker who reportedly hates school.
by Bud Elliott on Nov 19, 2008 11:02 AM EST up reply actions
come on bud, i heard they were gonna offer yoga as a major....
since i’m up in ohio i dont get much exposure other than my direct tv sun sports channel but they did a ridiculously funny story on him doing yoga over the summer. they were showing all these little girls in the background and then you see him front and center sweating like a stuck pig. someone get him a towel
What can we do about it.
Brown- Staff has known this was coming and we’re recruiting replacements.
Rolle- Ditto
Robinson- I think the staff is aware that we need corners already, this just makes it a little more urgent. We’re not getting Kirkpatrick and Smith is more than a longshot, so unless we steal McGee we’re stuck. I think this might be the reason for the Harley to CB talk.
Watson- We’ve got a lot of talent at LB, but this still would mean losing all of our starting linebackers. We’re only recruiting Mizell, so the staff apparently feels confident, but losing Dekoda would mean we’d have to somehow get Bostic or maybe Jones by a miracle.
Parker- We have WR depth too, but none of them really fit the role Preston plays. Rhodes seems to be the only slot guy we’ve got committed so far. Sanders is more of a Easterling-Reed type.
McNeil- Jenkins softens this blow a little.
Mincey- DT seems to be one of our top targets this season anyway. If we bring in Thornton we’d be ok for the future.
White- If we were to lose Brown AND White AND McNeil, we’d have to do something like bringing in Stinson and Vernon.
Pressley- I guess this means Pryor would stay at running back.
Moody- If he’s going to play safety, we’re bringing in a ton of those. If he’s going to be a linebacker, we might not recruit a replacement this season.
Thacker- See Mincey.
I think we’d be alright as long as the losses don’t add up on the defensive line. We can lose 1 player there in addition to Brown, but any more than that and it’d be tough.
Have the recent interviews with Coach Bowden and Bert changed your mind about his future? If we lost him, we’d have to get Sanders or slip something into Debose’s drink on signing day.
On Bert-- yes, but it's more a function that the Police's witnesses aren't solid.
by Bud Elliott on Nov 19, 2008 11:40 AM EST up reply actions
Let this be a lesson to Bert Reed
Don’t let there be a lot of witnesses should you choose to participate in an activity that might be illegal.
I think Easterling is very much like Parker.
by Bud Elliott on Nov 19, 2008 11:58 AM EST up reply actions
I actually think Easterling will be better than Parker
He is contributing more as a freshman than Parker did. I hope he can stay out of trouble though.
by ChileanNole on Nov 19, 2008 12:14 PM EST up reply actions
Thoughts
Agree on Rolle and Brown.
Prob- Hurt his chances of going high with all the penalties on the nationally televised game agaisnt BC. Also he could be the main guy next year with Carter gone.
Watson – hopefully he will talk to the coaches and realize that staying for another year is what is best for him. ( See Geno Hayes)
Parker- Hasnt had a breakout year and he could be the main guy next year, but I have a bad feeling about this one. Almost like a PK Sam situation it just seems as if he doesnt like the staff.
The academics guys hope they get their stuff together because we need them.
some of the JC guys we are going after
Demetrius Boone TE
James Collins ILB
Robert Johnson RB
Brandon Miller S
Bryan Randolph QB
Darrion Wilson OLB
I wish I saw a corner on that list.
Does anyone have any insight on this list?
by Bud Elliott on Nov 19, 2008 11:52 AM EST up reply actions
Not really.
The only Juco guy I heard was Leon Mackey.
by ChileanNole on Nov 19, 2008 12:18 PM EST up reply actions
I think EJ starts in 2011 as a redshirt Junior.
When you watch how poor our pass protection has been, I seriously doubt any QB would be doing well in Ponder’s place. I’ll have more on Ponder later, but I think we grow EJ and go back to the idea of a redshirt JR starting at QB, ad Desman said below.
Every game is a blackout game for me...
I think this is pretty evident from the nonsense I post late night after the games.
Recruiting Questions for Discussion
Who’s the guy after EJ?
Who’s the next quarterback prospect we’ll get? Is it Sims? Can we steal Lil’ Colt? Who’s it gonna be?
Hmm, I assume you mean the 2010 class
If we RS the guy in 2010, he’d be a rs FR when EJ was a rs jr, and in 2013, the new guy would be a rs jr.
Yeah.
Don’t think we take a QB this year.
The two I mentioned are Phil Sims (not that one) and Case McCoy (Colt’s little brother) from the 2010 class.
Not really.
Just throwing names out.
Although Texas does already have a 5-star QB commited this year….
Not until you said that.
I just spent 9 minutes watching a Youtube clip that I thought was for Texas Tech. Turns out, it was Gilbert’s highlights…. from his sophmore season!
Seriously, it’s like if Noel Devine were a quarterback.
It's not as much an award as it is a recognition.
Mr. Bold= most difference between my ballot and the blogpoll
Mr. manic-depressive= most change week to week
um ya ok
I guess its just something to write about uh. I still think UF is the best team but I know why Ttech and bama are 1-2 but I would have
UF #3
Utah somewhere from7-9
Where is Boise St I would think they are right after Utah down a few spots at least
well
New Mexico State they did shut them out 49-0 JK
Bowling Green who beat Pitt
Oregon but thats not realy impressive
ok good point in Boise St but Utah
lets see
Michigan
Oregon State yes I know that was a thur game and your feelings on that but they won
TCU who lost to OU but beat BYU so I dont know how good that one realy is
and we will have to wait to see the BYU game
OK ok you win maybe they are not all that great but they do diserve a chance to play where that are and to win with what they have I feel they should go to a big bowl game and get blown out but whoever and then people well think dif next year when they go 9-1 10-0 what ever
2010
What do you all think about our chances with Joyner, Willis, Clements, and Johnson. I want these four the most in 2010.
Another name to watch is DT Calvin Smith, Hialeah. He reportedly grew up a Noles fan.
Some people in Tallahassee think that Camren Hudson out of Rickards could be a filthy safety.
Joyner- excellent shot.
Clements- excellent shot.
Johnson- reasonably good shot.
Willis- will be hard to steal from Clemson, but a decent shot, nonetheless.
I’ll put those other names in the back of my mind.
Welcome to Tomahawk Nation, FSUstateOFMind
Willis
We lead for him now. And with the recent debacle at Clemson, they are not looking good for him. UNC will be our biggest competition. I dont want another Marvin Austin repeat here.
I just think Clemson will pull him eventually. He's a Byrnes kid they want.
by Bud Elliott on Nov 20, 2008 10:11 AM EST up reply actions
Some here think he can play. I think we took him for the reasons you listed.
Still, it’ll be hard to get him.
Austin
Pretty sure he wanted to go to a big city but Miami was awful that year (2006). Chapel Hill was just closer to home.
Didn't he turn us away a few days before signing day?
Still, that’s no excuse. That year just sucked all the way around.
Also
can’t wait to see C.J. Mizell break somebody in half at FSU.
What do you think about Terrance Parks? I think he has tons of potential. 6’1 200 and runs well. Does he has the hips to stay at corner? Injuries might be a concern.
It's incredibly depressing...
Per his latest rivals update, HE had to contact US because we haven’t been in contact. :/
Rivals250 CB
http://floridastate.rivals.com/viewprospect.asp?pr_key=83136&sport=1
Wherever he ends up I bet you he’s going to have a career game against us because we wouldn’t offer him. Sigh.
So, another Alphonso Smith type. Great.
by Bud Elliott on Nov 20, 2008 10:12 AM EST up reply actions
Yet another one I've heard good things about is....
Jarvis Byrd, from Pahokee (Alphonso Smith went there too, for those who don’t remember)
http://ncstate.rivals.com/viewprospect.asp?sport=1&pr_key=82645
In the article where he talks about committing to NC State:
“Growing up I liked FSU so with the Wolfpack playing them gives me a chance to go up against them which is also pretty exciting,” said Byrd.
Yay….
Changes?
How many do you think?
1,2,3, or 4? (Coincidentally I think the likelihood of dismissal is in alphabetical order by last name)
Haha! Creative.
I think you could see 1 change (offensive staff), 4 changes (3 defense and 1 offense), 6 changes (BB, + the other 5), really any number. Not more than 6.
By the way
Lest people think I’m heartless, I want to clarify some of my coach bashing.
I don’t dislike any of the coaches on defense. I think it’s gotta suck to be Amato and get fired from your alma mater and a fanbase that only has such high expectations because of what you accomplished. I hope we are able to find nice cushy, even well-paying, desk jobs for all of them ( a la The Sexton Arrangement). I just don’t think they need to be coaching the team.
about Amato
even though he got fired he is still loved in Reilgh. My wafe and in-laws are from there and the people I talk to when I go there for the holidays people still love this guy. they hate that it didnt work out for him but think he was a good coach because players didnt get in trouble. None the less hes just not what he use to be. A lot of people from the wolfpack area love that he went to FSU and are happy for him. but that dont mean much now.
Another Jarvis Byrd quote
“I’m going to show the teams that passed on me that I can play with the best of them.”
He’s talked to Alphonso and we know how much that guy loves to beat us.
Janoris Jenkins is a beast and he wanted to go to FSU
I’m really liking the idea of us going against him at UF for the next couple of years.
Ryan Baker was also another miss out of the 2008 class. F’n Chuck Amato. Least we don’t play LSU every year
Baker hurts too.
He was practically begging for an offer early on and we didn’t give him one. Now we could be screwed next year at CB with all un-proven, young talent.
Who would Baker play over, realistically?
I just didn’t see it with him. LSU did, though, so maybe I’m wrong here.
by Bud Elliott on Nov 21, 2008 11:03 AM EST up reply actions
I'm not saying he would start this year
But he is every bit as talented as Parks is and Parks is possibly a start at CB next eyar. It would be nice having both Parks AND Baker though
I'm an idiot
I got Baker mixed up with someone else. I was thinking he was a CB.
ah. I have a hard time keeping up with everything. Thanks FSUstate.
Also, to reply a a specific post, look for the “reply” button under the post in question, and then proceed to write like normal.
Another recruiting related question (maybe we can discuss it next wednesday)
How much blame do you place on recruiting (or lack there of) for the recent slump of the program?
Let me get this out the way because I know somebody may try to point it out. We did have “high rated” classes even in our down years. But IMO our coaches were not doing a good job of evaluating talent and more importantly character. How many of those 5-star recruits over the last 5 years did not pan out?? ( I wouldnt include Leon Washington, Lorenzo Booker or other players that did not have the opportunity to excel because of poor playcalling and terrible OLs under the old staff). I am talking about Fred Rouse, Xavier Lee, Brandon Warren, Callahan Bright, etc. type here.
It almost seemed as if the old coaching staff would log in to Rivals and offer the kids that were rated high and there wasnt a true evaluation process. We can also see that turning around now. Jermaine Thomas(dont even get me started on him being a 3 star player!!) and our OL being the perfect examples. Coaches are looking past rankings, which are flawed to start with, and performing their own evaluations on how the recruit would fit into their system.
Thoughts??
I think we did a horrible job of evaluating talend independent of recruiting services. Can we use this as next week's question?
by Bud Elliott on Nov 20, 2008 10:16 AM EST up reply actions
I agree and disagree
A lot of the 5 star “busts” couldn’t be helped. How can you NOT recruit XLee? Mr Football and 5 star player. Under a better OC and QB coach he could’ve been better but then again may not have because of his work ethic. However, you couldn’t NOT recruit him.
Fred Rouse is a player that EVERYBODY wanted. He went to school in Tallahassee. BAD character though so I’m not sure if we could’ve laid off him either. Can you imagine the fans screaming had we not recruited him?
Brandon Warren also couldn’t be helped. Hell he was a bright spot his freshman year but was pulled away by Tennessee and his mother’s help. He could’ve been great here and now has done nothing at Tennessee. However, its another situation where talent eval had nothing to do with it.
Now Callahan Bright you’re hitting right. Should we have recruited him? Absolutely. Should we have counted on him (or Marvin Austin for that matter). NO! We should’ve recruited other players just in case. Not landing those two have hurt us inside. Who do we have there now that are upperclassmen? Griffin – ACL tear, Thacker – decent but disappears too much, Mincey – originally brought in as a DE and moved, Dunbar – hasn’t produced anything pretty much since arriving because of injuries, Stewart – actually playing decent and recruited as a DT but gets swallowed often as he is somewhat undersized. This has cause depth issues the last two years here at DT and we are lucky to not have many injured here this year. Remember depth when we had suspensions? We had a freshman starting and walkons logging major time.
Thomas was rated higher by pretty much every other major service besides FSU so a decent example but not a great one. A problem we did end up seeing is this: A lot of the highly rated players we have had here in the last 6 years were on D and they have underperformed compared to their talent level and their draft spot. For example: Timmons, Sims, and Hayes. All LB’s and all highly drafted. What did they do AT FSU? What about Cromartie? What about Pat Watkins? Hell Watkins lost his job for a bit to Roger Williams and we know how well he played. Wimbley was a star for 1 year and was injured half that year.
It can also be argued that our few drafted offensive players have been playing better in the NFL so far than their FSU days. Leon Washington, Boldin, maybe even Booker, etc.
IMO their is NO excuse for the inability of our talent-laden defense to play lights out against mediocre offenses. A team that starts nothing but 4-5 star players with 4-5 star backups at all positions pretty much should not be playing as poorly as they are. A lot of the issues this year have not been talent but rather scheme and fundamentals. Those are ALL on the coaches and has nothing to do with the coaches ability to scout talent. I wince to think about what our defense would look like with the “talent” of the BC defense that shut our offense down. How poor would they be with players that were only 2-3 stars?
by s_barrow1 on Nov 20, 2008 2:12 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Yes!
A problem we did end up seeing is this: A lot of the highly rated players we have had here in the last 6 years were on D and they have underperformed compared to their talent level and their draft spot. For example: Timmons, Sims, and Hayes. All LB’s and all highly drafted. What did they do AT FSU? What about Cromartie? What about Pat Watkins? Hell Watkins lost his job for a bit to Roger Williams and we know how well he played. Wimbley was a star for 1 year and was injured half that year.
It can also be argued that our few drafted offensive players have been playing better in the NFL so far than their FSU days. Leon Washington, Boldin, maybe even Booker, etc.
IMO there is NO excuse for the inability of our talent-laden defense to play lights out against mediocre offenses. A team that starts nothing but 4-5 star players with 4-5 star backups at all positions pretty much should not be playing as poorly as they are. A lot of the issues this year have not been talent but rather scheme and fundamentals. Those are ALL on the coaches and has nothing to do with the coaches ability to scout talent. I wince to think about what our defense would look like with the "talent" of the BC defense that shut our offense down. How poor would they be with players that were only 2-3 stars?
Quoted for Truth
Poor teaching leads to poor development leads to poor habits and combined with bad coaching… you get our defense.
Which is exacty the point I was trying to make
Given the studs we had on the field, especially on defense, saying we under performed is putting very lightly. The question I was asking is if the coaches were just recruiting players based on the rankings or if they truly felt like those players fit their system?? I agree that it would have been hard to pass on players such as Lee and Rouse, but we should not have relied on them to bring us back, considering our past luck with recruits at those positions (McPhearson, Walker, Mauer, etc)
I don't think we should have been shy at all about Lee or Rouse.
Those are largely on the coaches. You must control the primmadonnas.
Now, if your claim is that we were relying too heavily on one specific recruit, then I absolutely agree. It’s just that nobody would have fit our offense at the time.
We’re in agreement on the defensive stuff and I echo Barrow’s comments… how bad would our defense look with poor recruits?
players I see that have Commit
DT/DE LB/CB/S RB/WR
Jacobbi McDaniel C.J. Mizell Lonnie Pryor
Demonte McAllister JaJuan Harley Rodney Smith
Brandon Jenkins Willie Downs Chris Thompson
Ed Stinson Gerald Demps Willie Haulstead
Justin Bright Bryan Stork *TE
O-line/K Xavier Rhodes
Dustin Hopkins
Henry Orelus
John Prior
messed that up
DT/DE
Jacobbi McDaniel
Demonte McAllister
Brandon Jenkins
Ed Stinson
LB/CB/S
C.J. Mizell
JaJuan Harley
Willie Downs
Gerald Demps
Justin Bright
RB/WR
Lonnie Pryor
Rodney Smith
Chris Thompson
Willie Haulstead
Xavier Rhodes
Bryan Stork *TE
O-line/K Xavier Rhodes
Dustin Hopkins
Henry Orelus
John Prior
ok this is what I see we have as a Commit but thats not 100%
Im looking at the Eligibility of the players we have and Off. looks ok for the next few years but our Def. is going to take a huge hit. the DE/LB we are deep right now but all the other Pos we will be hurting. Thats not good.
Yeah it will be a rebuilding year for the D next year for sure.
Safety- replace Myron and no proven depth benind FS OR Rover
CB- we wil lose 2 plus possibly Robinson. That would leave Mangum, who is serviceable but not a lockdown on the number 1 receiver CB, and basically unproven players. Players like Allen and Parks have the ability/talent to play well but have no experience pretty much and Alexander has never played CB really.
DT- We do bring back a couple of upperclassmen but its the eyar after that hurts as we will have only McCray that will be a JR and then a bunch of SO’s and FR.
DE and LB we are set though.
If it is a rebuilding year on defense though, wouldn’t it make sense to make the coaching changes this offseason? I would think so. The defense won’t get BETTER by getting younger/less experienced after this year. This should’ve been the defense’s breakout year with the talent and experience on it.
Now rather than later.
I don’t think it would work out too well if we made changes after next season, because then our young guys are learning 2 systems in as many years. I would rather our recruits come in and have everybody learning a new system than for 2009 to a complete waste.
Agreed Des, and Matt
Let’s have the YOUNG 2009 guys learn the new defensive system.
Maybe we could play defensive with only defensive ends and linebackers?
by Bud Elliott on Nov 21, 2008 11:05 AM EST up reply actions
Who is the guy we pulled from S to play up at LB is it Mangum or Ingram. Cold we pull any LB back to S/FS like Maurice Harris. Also what are we realy going to do with Bright, Demps, Downs, and Harley. Would we conver them to CB I can see Harley is 6’0 and runs a 4.37, I see ESPN call Demps the man, ESPN has Downs as a WR but Scout.com has him as a S. and it looks like Bright will be good on ST/ and as a S/FS only will have to RS to grow.
Ingram, but he's a Senior now.
I think your other question is just that, a question, because we don’t know what the new (or existing) staff would do.
by Bud Elliott on Nov 21, 2008 11:06 AM EST up reply actions
Here's what I think
Harley will go FSU. Too much opportunity for early playing time and its at home.
Downs will play WR I think though he could go S if we need him.
Bright will probably redshirt.
Demps will get playing time next year buidling depth.
Ingram was the FS convert to LB convert to Rover for this game (maybe rest of season) and he is a senior. Harris is a POSSIBILITY to go to Safety but not sure if he has the cover skills and speed. The coaches would know the answer better than I would but its hard seeing Harris break the depth chart at LB though. I imagine seeing Mister Alexander going back to safety before Harris but is Alexander EVER going to make an impact on this team?
The coaches think Harriss is really immature and his status with the team was allegedly in jeopardy earlier this year.
I like Demps a lot more than most.
by Bud Elliott on Nov 21, 2008 12:55 PM EST up reply actions
About the DT and DE
Most of the DT we have are kinda small guys. I widh we could get some that are closer to 300lb McCray and Dunbar are about 290 and I think McDaniel could come in and be a great guy but we can afford to RS him too. At DE Brown is pob gone but McNeil should be back. Some of the DT could play there with there size. Stevens might be better to move him back to a LB. If we were to change to a 3-4 I think we could transition very well actualy. We dont ahve the Big size DT and realy need a NT but I think we could manage with what we have. and being stacked at DE/LB we could have the speed and size to make it work very well.
McDaniel will not redshirt, and McCray is well on his way to being a 310lb type.
I am FINE with 295 or 300lb guys. I don’t want 280 at DT.
by Bud Elliott on Nov 21, 2008 11:44 AM EST up reply actions
NO WAY Jacobbi redshirts.
He will be in the rotation from day 1. Plus he’s not as small as some think and by the time he arrives he may be bigger than Thacker, who will be a senior.
thats how I feel
After seeing what BC did to us with some big guys in the mid. I see how size matters. If we get some beef in the DT spots and the speed from the outsides will cause caos on the D-line. We might not have to biltz as much next year and witch would help in the passing game with a young secondary.
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