Florida State Falls at Boston College, 28-21, as Bowden Shows He Has Lost All Control of Seminole's Program
by Bud Elliott on Oct 3, 2009 7:39 PM EDT
in FSU Football
478 comments
It was a game the Seminoles had to have to save their season. It was a game Bobby Bowden needed to silence the doubters who declared that he was done, and had lost control of his program amidst coaches undermining each other and worse, fighting each other in practice. Players and coaches openly arguing on the sideline, and the head coach nowhere to be seen. The result is clear. Bowden has caused Florida State to crumble.
The reasons are these: average recruiting, poor coaching, lack of leadership. Florida State Football Alum and ESPN Gameday Host Lee Corso
Bowden has lost control of his program, and it's clear that the players have nowhere to look for leadership. If Florida State allows Bowden to stay for next year, at 80 years old, it will be a clear message that the administration believes he is more important than the program. Recruits are not willing to come to Florida State.
Boston College's offense is awful (amassing less than 60 yards against Clemson just two weeks ago), yet FSU's defense may be the worst in the ACC, allowing the Eagles to rack up over 400 yards. The Noles defense, under terrible coaching by Chuck Amato, Jody Allen, and Mickey Andrews, allowed touchdown drives of Drives of 9 plays for 79, 11 plays for 88 yards, 6 plays for 65 yards, and 7 plays for 80 yards. Again, the Noles allowed 7 plays of 20 or more yards, and also have the distinction of allowing Boston College's longest pass and run of the season.
| Play Type | # | Yards |
| Run | 35 | 198 (5.4) |
| Pass | 23 | 211 (9.2) |
| Kneel-down (end of game) | 2 | -8 |
| Total (no Kneel-downs) | 58 | 409 (7.1) |
As they had in every previous game, the Seminoles allowed over 5 yards per carry (not counting sacks, which are of course the end result of a passing play), as Boston College rushed 35 times for 198 yards, an average of 5.7 yards per carry. FSU's defensive players were consistently out of position and Boston College exploited them all day. And it was much much worse than even those numbers show. Boston College racked up 238 1st half yards, amassing a 21-6 halftime lead, gaining over 7.4 yards per play. After that, the Eagle's offense went into a prevent, just trying to run the clock out with a 15 point lead, and in the 3rd quarter threw only 2 passes to go with 11 runs, but did manage to burn off almost 7 minutes, while gaining only 47 yards on 13 plays (3.6 per play).
But the Eagles would have to get out of their prevent offense because FSU's offense came alive, putting together a 91 yard drive to cut the score to 21-13. FSU's defense forced a punt as BC was still in "run the clock" mode. Florida State marched 84 yards for another TD. The 2-pt conversion was good, and the game was tied. Boston College then fumbled (on a good run, no less), and FSU missed a field goal. Boston College took the ball with 7 minutes to go, elected to not run the clock, and marched on an 80 yard drive for the touchdown. FSU couldn't answer, and that was the game.
FSU now sits at 2-3 overall, and the team clearly has no direction. Their hopes in the ACC Atlantic Division are now dashed (because unlike Clemson and some other Atlantic contenders, they do not get to play Duke or Virginia). With Christian Ponder and an offense that has put up 400+ yards in two of the Nole's 3 losses, FSU has a chance to be close in most games, but with a defense that is not just below average by FSU's standards, but far below average nationally, particularly in the coaching category, the Noles don't stand much of a chance and will struggle to make a bowl game.
There are two takeaways from this game. First, Bowden is killing Florida State's program. It would be nice if he could stay at practice for the entire time, but it's probably unreasonable to expect an 80-year old with singles to put in the hours required to be the CEO of a multi-million dollar organization. Should Nole fans expect their $2.5 Million coach to be informed before he makes costly decisions? Second, Boston College's offense could move the ball whenever it pleased. The defensive numbers are incredibly deflated because the Eagles simply shut it down for a little over a quarter. This game was not as close as the score indicated, and while coach Bowden will likely blame the players again, citing that the Noles were just "1 play away", that is simply not the case. The Noles are a coach away, and it's dumb to expect anything other than maddening inconsistency and underachievement until a change is made at the top.
The solution is simple. Promising young coaches must be allowed to work unimpeded (and without active sabotage from disgruntled older coaches). FSU is close enough that they could see an enormous improvement in 2010 if they make the coaching change. It might be too late to salvage even a decent recruiting class, however, and the only way to save that will be to make the change. One thing's for sure, those inside the program worried about Bowden dragging down their reputation and thus future job prospects, will only get louder as they continue to leak details about the dysfunction caused by Bowden.
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Everything in here is true ...
… yet, my gut tells me no matter what our record ends up being (even if it’s 4-8ish), he will be back next season.
Unfortunately we have to hit rock bottom before a change is even contemplated
If you are a betting man take Georgia Tech next week as there is no way we will stop them. M.A. is too much of a old relic to make the necessary adjustments to slow down their running game.
By the way did you see how korey mangum blew the taccle on that last TD run. What a joke, when we he see that mangum absoluetly sucks
He was exposed last year as a bad corner
So MA decided to give him a new position to learn and continues to play him simply because he is a senior. I honestly don’t think the guy would be starting on any other team in the ACC.
This is disgusting! Where has the pride of this team gone?!
No one wants to win. Disgusting.
I think ill make a fire bobby sign for my roof now.
I cant beleive that my school temple now has a better record than the noles
We need a total coaching change, our playcalling absolutely sucks, I was a supporter of Jimbo but after last week and this week I now have my doubts
How is it Jimbo's fault?
His offense putting together some drives was the only reason this game wasn’t a total blowout. Offense was not perfect but was good enough to win if defense had held a very mediocre BC offense in check.
"No, like I said, Woo peed on my rug" - The Dude
Ponder threw for over 300 yards.
We scored enough points to win. What exactly are you looking for?
points, more and/ or sooner.
"Some nasty players that come from those seeds down at FSU in Tallahassee, we hold ourselves to a higher standard... we'll keep grinding it out. When you step on the field you have to represent not just yourself, but for everybody." (DD #45)
Look,
As is almost always the case, the offense did what needed to be done to win.
Fisher’s stuff worked overall. I question whether he’s ever going to be a Best of the Best kind of head coach. He seems perfectly capable of getting the ball down the field, but he seems to lose all imagination inside the 10. We’ll see on Jimbo. I can’t judge him until he’s had a fair shot with control of the whole team.
I’m not at all impressed by Trickett. Yes, the offensive line decided to show up for those couple drives we needed to tie the game, but it also blew it when we got stopped inside the five, and it is thoroughly undisciplined.
The failure, though, goes to the defense again.
Would have been
better for JImbo to not have been named HC in waiting. He is catching flack for some poorly called games and inconsistent performances.
FSUn
What are your thoughts on the offensive line this game? Do you think Jimbo decided not to run because of the rain, BC’s alignments, or just because we had the smash and stick routes all day?
>>---l>
Pass pro was really good, run game has regressed.
Not sure why FSU didn’t run more. Passing game was spot-on.
It really seemed like Jimbo came out throwing
And just stayed with it. It was puzzling to me too.
>>---l>
The backs look like they lack vision.
A few times they were just running into the blockers or making the wrong cut. It’s pretty much been the same all year.
The grass was tackling Jermaine.
Speed is a great asset; but it's greater when it's combined with quickness - and there's a big difference.
- Ty Cobb
On offene we do.
C’mon, that was a damned fine comeback our offense put together.
My only beef with Jimbo
was the connections to the Bowden family. He had a better supporting cast at LSU…
well Jimbo'ds play calling is horrible
Think back to the Miami game and 5 plays inside the 5 and we dont score, then last weeks debacle scoring only 7 at home against Sfla where we had 3 trips inside the 10 and came away with no points and then today again 1st and goal in Q1 and came away with no points. And drive after fumbled kick off, we start at 30 and come away with no points after very conservative play calling, running the ball on 2nd and 22
His play calling is not horrible
Look at offensive numbers. We do have redzone struggles, I’ll give you that. But the offense, as a whole, is a strong unit.
>>---l>
We have no running game at all DK.
Therefore the unit is not strong.
Speed is a great asset; but it's greater when it's combined with quickness - and there's a big difference.
- Ty Cobb
I think we have it when we commit to it
Except for Jax State, we really haven’t made running a priority other than BYU when we did it for 313 yards.
>>---l>
Thats a coaching thing.
Speed is a great asset; but it's greater when it's combined with quickness - and there's a big difference.
- Ty Cobb
Well, when we throw for 400 yards, we don't really need it
But I would like to have seen it more against USF…that was just a terrible OL performance for who knows what reason
>>---l>
True
Against good pass rushing teams, we will have to have a running game.
Speed is a great asset; but it's greater when it's combined with quickness - and there's a big difference.
- Ty Cobb
Thats Fisher's fault
Fisher doesn’t commit to the running game at all. Once he sees that we can’t run on a team he will give it up and ponder will end up throwing the ball 45 times a game. When we commit to it yeah we are good but fisher has no confidence in our run game at all
Um,
did you see how BC was playing? Not sure if you understand coverages and fronts, but they were giving Ponder 6-7 yards outside every time. Fisher would be an idiot not to take that.
Um, I realize that but
I don’t care if the man has 15-20 yards to throw the ball. Sooner or later teams are going to sit back with 8 guys in the secondary and wait for ponder to throw the ball. When we can’t run that makes us one dimensional. When you can’t run why even rush? why not just drop all 11 guys into coverage? Sooner or later teams are going to figure that out. Thats why the running game is so important. When you can’t run you put all the pressure on your qb and I know ponder is unreal but we can’t rely on him to win us every game with his arm. The running game is only going to make ponder better.
They couldn't run because of the alignment
I think you are missing the point. They loaded the box with 8 and played really soft cover-3. Run against that? I don’t think so.
Are you kidding me????
Any sefense will alllow you to move the ball between the 20’s however if you can not score what the hell does it matter???
Did you ever hear of a bend not break Defense???
not to be mean
but are you a moron? Never been shown that you can play good red zone defense and be bad everywhere else.
The bend but don’t break thing is a fallacy.
by Bud Elliott on Oct 3, 2009 8:01 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
A better argument
Would be that with a lack of run game it is hard to score within the 20. And while that is a coaching issue, I think in the back of an OC’s mind is “well how will the defense do if we 3 and out?” Well, the defense will probably get scored on.
Establishing the run has a higher risk of putting you in 3rd in long when you have such an efficient passing offense that generally gets 3rd and short. I think Jimbo would rather just chuck it, knowing that any given play has a higher opportunity to be a big play than if he tries running the ball against teams who remember last year’s highly efficient running attack.
Basically run the ball, risk ToD Punts or throw it and go for the score. Drops are really the only thing that stops our passing offense…besides 3 errant throws by Ponder 2day.
When the opponent
is likely to score from anywhere on the field, that is not bend don’t break. We have been scored on with big plays time and again this season. That is one of the other thing that pisses me off, when MA and Co. talk about the fact that we “give up the big play but we make the big play.”
Our running game is non-existent and we need it in order to win games.
Also the dline is awful.
Speed is a great asset; but it's greater when it's combined with quickness - and there's a big difference.
- Ty Cobb
Not going to debate Bobby...
But you know, the WHOLE TEAM has serious problems. Yes, Jimbo and Christian led a nice comeback. But as has been the formula… get close and then the wheels fall off. That last drive was a jumbled mess. The game was on the line and 4 bad plays and voila… turn over on downs. Last week there was still a chance, BAM! The kicker, while he may be a fine kicker over time, has KILLED US. That miss was a dagger. I also cannot help but say that officiating is NEVER going to be pro-FSU. That god damn PI was a back breaker and even those announcers admitted it. This is sickening and the only real answer anybody has involves Bobby. Again, I wonder what the excuse will be when he is gone and the mystique is not only gone, it is laughed at. I say clean the WHOLE HOUSE if Bobby goes, send them all packing. Jimbo will fail. It just seems like he is not HC material. Too many times he has looked clueless and it is always when the pressure is on. yadda yadda yadda it’s all talk. bottom line, it was a sad day and ESPN got their feel good moments… there was really no hope today… NONE
Well thank you for your expert opinion in saying that Jimbo will fail
Because “it just seems like he’s not HC material.” The last drive was a good one. Ponder missed an open man on 3rd, and then was pressured on 4th by a 3 man front. That’s not his or Jimbo’s fault. Those two guys were the only reason we were in the game. The kick didn’t matter that much because it’s not like the defense was going to stop anybody.
>>---l>
seems you got a hard on for me...
I have an OPINION. I see what I see. If you don’t like it… go screw
You just don't make any rational arguments
You’re going to be challenged on this board. Everyone is. You’d better have something to back up what you claim or you won’t be taken seriously.
>>---l>
Keep the back and forth off the boards please
Nobody wants to see attacks on a personal level.
'Gentlemen, it is better to have died a small boy than to fumble this football.' John Heisman
'I'm not a Role Model" - Charles Barkley
I agree
Fsu has sucked and has been in a downward spiral since 2000 loss to OU. Players have come and gone, but what’s been the one constant since then? BB and MA. I want to see what Jimbo and his staff can do without any interference.
by cousinjay on Oct 3, 2009 8:52 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
You should really read up on
What Bobby did before coming to FSU.
Some very timely probations, combined with some other favorable bounces…like how come our guys never got suspended/how come we never got put on probation?… Created what we now know as Bobby Bowden.
Its just time for him to go. What he did was great, but its just time. I’m not going to say “he is no Bear Bryant”, but I think in the back of his mind is some underlying disappointment about the conclusion of his legacy. He thought it would be more. He trusted his son and he failed. And he had to deal with the death of a grandchild, etc…
The piper has been coming for FSU football and its just time to pay, and move on.
I'd like to go to Chuck Amato's School for LB play
and learn such excellent moves as:
1. running a circle around OL blocks to make a tackle! (Dekoda Watson)
2. jumping randomly into a hole on goal line while forgetting to scrape to the play! (Kendall Smith)
3. Showing a blitz entirely too early and letting the offense read it and adjust!
3. Dropping to your knees after contact and getting dragged for another three yards! (all LBs)
by Yarborough4Heisman on Oct 3, 2009 8:00 PM EDT reply actions
Hi, I'm Troy McClure. you may remember me from such movies as....
…“3 lefts make a right: Dodging a block to stuff the run with Geno Hayes”
by The K-Man on Oct 3, 2009 8:25 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
This is spot on.
As much as I hate to say it, this team has no direction whatsoever. GT will have 400 rushing yards on us.
I hate to say but now I hope we lose the rest of the games except for UF
But how could we even compete on the same universe as the Gaytors????
I almost broke my coffee table, Tore the bar top off the counter, ripped the closet door off, and punched a hole in the wall.
My girlfriend says i have anger issues. I told her I just want to win.
Am i in the right?
Dude, chill out
You had to expect something like this. Seriously, don’t get so emotionally involved. That was okay in 2004 or 2005
by Bud Elliott on Oct 3, 2009 8:04 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I cant help it. I care about W's. What can we do?
There has to be something we can do as fans. Should we march on Doak on a random weekday with pitchforks?
FSUBrad
I feel your pain man….the doctor told me I had aggression issues…..pissed me off so bad I socked the shit out of him.
Ha!
Speed is a great asset; but it's greater when it's combined with quickness - and there's a big difference.
- Ty Cobb
I hear ya man, my wife won't even be in the house when I watch games anymore...
I just can’t control my anger for the incredible lack of leadership and direction that our Noles possess right now!
Obviously a hard slap in the face of Bobbys supporters may wake them out of their coma
And a horrible season may just be the thing to do it, obviuosly mediocraty has not shaken them
grew up in Auburn...
they are fun to watch, finally… all b/c of a culture change, they are modern and exciting, war damn eagle!
"Some nasty players that come from those seeds down at FSU in Tallahassee, we hold ourselves to a higher standard... we'll keep grinding it out. When you step on the field you have to represent not just yourself, but for everybody." (DD #45)
I though you were tigers
Sorry, but you’re not allowed to have two mascots- pick one.
you make the rules?
My point was nothing more than we could learn something from a culture change, Tubs was a good coach and once he got complacent he got the boot… After growing up in Auburn w/ an Aubur
n family I’ve got every reason I need to pull for them and owe no explanations to you.
"Some nasty players that come from those seeds down at FSU in Tallahassee, we hold ourselves to a higher standard... we'll keep grinding it out. When you step on the field you have to represent not just yourself, but for everybody." (DD #45)
I think he was referring to Auburn University
As in, two mascots, war eagle and tigers…he wasn’t questioning you personally
>>---l>
Auburn is garbage
they haven’t played anyone yet and firing tuberville was retarded
by garnetandgold on Oct 4, 2009 12:30 AM EDT up reply actions
Something now has to give if FSU ever wants the respect that we once had. I know there are many bashers of Bowden but let’s face it, 20 years ago, he was the greatest thing since sliced bread. I love him, don’t get me wrong. I feel he had built one of the best college football programs out there but he’s old now. He too’s old to handle it anymore. I think the worst decision that he ever made regarding this team was back when he put Jeff in as offensive coordinator. Things haven’t been the same since. Personally, I don’t care for Fisher and it’d suit me if he was sent packing as well. We are just in a mess and it’s been a total embarassment this season. All I know is that I want my old Seminoles back!!!
I cant beleieve FSUN can do this after another loss, amazing.
We will not make a bowl this year. Will it be enough?
www.fsufishing.com
Of course.
We have 2 Championships. They go to 3. we have 2 heisman winners they go to 3. Its only fitting that eventually take the bowl streak from us too.
I've said this for a while and always get blasted
They are a better program in a better conference with a better future. The only time we’ve dominated them is when they were on major probation. I want to be decisively better than Miami.
I heard this about a month ago.
A die hard gator buddy of mine told me the only reason we had the recruiting we did back in the day was bc UF was on probation and everyone had to go to FSU.
I didnt wanna believe it but I guess the truth comes out.
I hate the Gators. The canes. And now the bulls. ……and the eagles.
Not the sole reason
But things like that always play a apart. For example if UM and FSU hadn’t been sucking for years UF wouldn’t be as stacked.
by osceolafan850 on Oct 3, 2009 8:50 PM EDT up reply actions
And the 90's was before resources really mattered
Things changed, people realized just how much money matters.
What happened in the 90s doesn't matter at this point
The point here is the resources available and leadership of the programs TODAY, and we are being left behind in both
2009 Rays Baseball: Welp.....we'll try again in 2010
2009 FSU Football: Bobby Bowden.........it's time to go
Be a TRUE Seminole: http://www.seminoles.com/sports/m-footbl/spec-rel/071509aab.html
No, you did not
2009 Rays Baseball: Welp.....we'll try again in 2010
2009 FSU Football: Bobby Bowden.........it's time to go
Be a TRUE Seminole: http://www.seminoles.com/sports/m-footbl/spec-rel/071509aab.html
Really?
I thought they had a losing season with Zook…
'Gentlemen, it is better to have died a small boy than to fumble this football.' John Heisman
'I'm not a Role Model" - Charles Barkley
I actually feel pretty good.....
Sorry, I could not resist. I went to hotoberfest in ATL today and got smashed and did miss the game……glad I did. Dont get me wrong, I am not a happy camper about the loss. This is unreal………
The wheels have finally flown off and smashed windows for all to see
This program is in complete disarray and disfunction. Bowden needs to finish the season and “retire”. If not – 2010 will be an even bigger disaster. It is very apparant that the team is being negatively impacted by the complete breakdown within the coaching ranks.
This is one of the most unbelievable situations I’ve ever heard about much less witness – and from my alma matter to boot.
All I can say is we all need to apply the pressure for action from this administraiton. Daily e-mails to national media, boycotts, protests, something, ANYTHING to effect a change
I certainly think...
… Bobby Bowden has earned a right to coach at FSU as long as he pleases.
The school was nothing before his arrival, and while it’s no longer big news when FSU loses to USF or BC, people still watch to see if FSU is relevant at the beginning of each season.
Forcing Bowden out would be an awful mistake. This man, this gentle human, this leader of young men has more than just one more season in him. I can feel it.
5 more years, Bobby!
Orange and Blue Hue: The World through GATOR-colored Glasses -- http://www.orangeandbluehue.com
433 W. St. Augustine Tallahassee, FL
I dare you to step on my porch.
"Some nasty players that come from those seeds down at FSU in Tallahassee, we hold ourselves to a higher standard... we'll keep grinding it out. When you step on the field you have to represent not just yourself, but for everybody." (DD #45)
by econole23 on Oct 3, 2009 8:22 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
lmao!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
"theres two types of people in this world, those who CARRY a spear and those who FEAR the spear"-James Coley
* I live at 444 W. St. Augustine.
Stop on by!
*Some of my relatives may be in my house at the present time. If they act confused, simply keep demanding to see Gatorpilot in very loud tones. They are hard of hearing and a bit stupid.
Orange and Blue Hue: The World through GATOR-colored Glasses -- http://www.orangeandbluehue.com
Don't you
have a perfectly intact pair of jeans to cut the legs off of?
"No, like I said, Woo peed on my rug" - The Dude
Someone's gotta stand up for BB, man.
This oppression will not stand!
Orange and Blue Hue: The World through GATOR-colored Glasses -- http://www.orangeandbluehue.com
There is some hope for the rest of the season.
Best case scenario:
A) Bobby and company announce retirement tomorrow.
2) Team balls out and fights for the fading glory of our once great HC
D) We go 6-6 and make a bowl game
You want motivation? This is how. Maybe I’m just optimistic, but it makes sense to me, If BB and MA announce retirement, it would provide some decent motivation for the players. They would be unified under that front. It should help resolve a wee bit of the power struggles amongst the staff, as they would all fully know their places. It wont solve all the problems, but it would put a band aid on the broken back of the program, at least for the rest of the season. It may even help salvage a decent recruiting class. A man can dream right?
Feel really bad for the students there now...
Being at FSU from 97-00 half of the school year was always great (the other half ruled too of course, but weekends in the fall were easier to plan). They never lost at home, were in the title hunt every year, and had All-Americans and Heisman caliber players that were extraordinarily fun to watch. I’m not even really angry anymore, just sad… its amazing to see a program tank this much and show no real progress of getting better.
Sorry buddy...
Its nice to have the great memories from the height of the dynasty. I think Fisher can turn this around if someone ever hands him the damn wheel. Depending on how the economy looks, maybe just head off for your Masters :)
PHD?
I wouldn’t recommend Med School to anyone… it sucks and never seems to end
yep, same goes for me with the Ph.d.
same answer. and i started at fsu in 02, ive been a fan my entire life and i landed on this decade.
Been there, done that
With a BS and a Ph.D. from FSU, I can’t stop rooting for us even if I wanted to- sucks to be me right now.
Wow
You guys shit the bed too i guess.
Wouldnt it be nice if the Admins had the good sense to fix obvious problems and hire people who had a clue.
god damn mangum
i literally wish he would be cut from his scholarship and slapped on the back of his head on the way out.
"theres two types of people in this world, those who CARRY a spear and those who FEAR the spear"-James Coley
Palace Saloon?
That place still open? Spent way too many nights there
Our O-Line still needs to block
Or Jimbo needs to call a different play other than the same play twice back to back
Go Noles!!
Try being a Nole in Gator Country
At least the decent Gator fans recognize a handicapped person when they see one.
Im almost to the point a 4-9 season could be a good thing for us.
What game are the boosters watching. Do they watch football anymore. FSUn is dead on here. I know some dont want to blame MA because he wanted to get out and the things that happened to him with his son but when you cant do your job anymore then you get out. Its not all his fault. It is a team effort but CTC and the other Def coaches are all to blame here.
Also who should the team fallow. Jimbo is the HCIW but CTC is ect. HC and MA is AHC. I feel like we are watching Varcity Blues and Our players are on the line of blowing off all the coaches and doing it all themselfs. Might work on Def.
So what are the problems on Def and why is it not working. Thats right we Have a DT and DE that shouldnt play Football at all. At least not those places. We have a SS that sucks. The only good players are the Fr. and P rod and they cant do it all.
Why is the sky blue? Because, God Loves the Infantry
Continuation of Current Trend
If we continue on our current path, does anyone think that jimbo’s rep will be intact enough to pull some good recruits? Is the mass of the other coaches too much for him to escape the season intact, even if he is allowed to bring in his people at the end of the year?
This is a fair point
But Jimbo is a great recruiter. He and Coley are tireless workers. He establishes great relationships with prospects, which isn’t always about if your program is winning or not. I think he’ll hire guys that will work as hard as he will, and I think we will recruit well. Bowden is killing us in this regard right now though. Nobody wants to come play for him.
>>---l>
positive and negatives
So you feel; jimbo’s work ethic, his established relations with recruits minus all the shots he is going to take because of the other coaches is better than a completely new staff? The new staff would not have the established relations jimbo built but they would also not have the negatives from the last couple of seasons weighing them down.
We will have a mostly new staff
I still think Jimbo could be very successful recruiting here
>>---l>
Kids want to play for Fisher and Coley
but they are just not going to play for Bowden.
When we talk to recruits, it’s all Fisher-Coley
Its all Fisher-Coley
It’s evident, at least from the recruiting sites that they are doing all the work on that side. I’m worried more about this because if recruiting drops I don’t see Jimbo/Coley coaching players beyond their talent level. I don’t see jimbo/coley beating/upsetting enough teams with superior talent, compared to ours, to bring in better recruits.
Basis
His current inability to fet our current offense to produce at a high level. Yes, yes, I know that there are major distractions for the team, and it affects their intensity. But they still need to execute.
Look at our offensive rankings:
http://web1.ncaa.org/football/exec/rankingSummary?year=2009&org=234
If recruiting/talent drops, do you think these numbers will get any better?
I swear, I'm going to beat a dead horse, but...
Fisher is working with 7 underclassmen. This is not his fault…
I have six locks on my door all in a row. When I go out, I only lock every other one. I figure no matter how long somebody stands there picking the locks, they are always locking three.
Elayne Boosler
7 underclassmen
True, but this will be the second or third year in jimbo’s system for the underclassmen. I can understand if they get beat physically. But linemen keep missing blocks, running backs running through wrong holes, receivers not paying attention to how they plant when they cut and slip(it was wet though), multiple false starts. Look at miami this is whipple’s first year, but they execute. They are a young like us( a little older says jimbo).
But back to the point of my post. Like you say it may not be his fault, but if he can’t do it with our current talent, what will happen if recruiting talent drops off? Right now we are not a top 20 offense. I hope your intuition is right and those 7 upperclassmen get significantly better next year. Hopefully under a new/mostly new staff.
FSU SUCKS
LOL!! I bled Garnet and Gold all last week.. I am running dry now and feel like i want this to be the worst season ever … a riches of embarrassment so that finally the FSU admin sees that we have a problem. Make it happen… F-L-O-R-I-D-A S-T-A-T-E Florida State Florida State Florida State Whoooooo!!!
Jimbo
I don’t think he is a great recruiter. He is a very good one, and that is not the same thing. He is also a very good OC , but by no means great either. The offense is good, but it’s not great either. We do not recruit as well as Miami or FLorida either. So until Jimbo can beat those teams in recruiting then he is not a great recruiter.
This is rock bottom. We lost to USF for god’s sakes. BC SUCKS. They are a horrible team and we lost to them too. Rock Bottom is Mangum playing on the field at any time in the game. We are a horrible, horrible team. We are probably not even in the top 50.
Offense wins games But our Def has lost Miami, USF and BC.
Jimbo and the Offense cant carry us all by themselfs.
Why is the sky blue? Because, God Loves the Infantry
Stop the rresponsibility
Stop reporting that there was fighting amongst coaches on the practice fields or in the locker room. You have no proof of this that you’re willing to share, and I have spoken with several people who would know and they have denied it. Stop starting rumors and trying to further weaken FSU’s efforts. It’s irresponsible!
Did you watch the game?
After the missed field goal, jimbo and amato had a terse exchange of words. I’m no lip reader, but I could see the chest mouthing an insult while clapping.
BS. It is TRUE...
weak efforts to cover it up.
It happened AGAIN before today’s game. See below.
From around college football
http://www.southernpigskin.com/index.php/forums/viewthread/3120/
Playstation All American, right again!
TomahawkNation
Better to bear the rebuke of the wise than to hear the song of fools
Good Lord
" I don’t think he is a great recruiter. He is a very good one, and that is not the same thing. He is also a very good OC , but by no means great either. The offense is good, but it’s not great either. We do not recruit as well as Miami or FLorida either. So until Jimbo can beat those teams in recruiting then he is not a great recruiter."
Give me a break you have absolutely no idea what Fisher can do he is not the coach but he is going to be because in these budget times 5 million dollars is not going to be coughed up that says he is not. The bottom line is he needs to be as fast as possible though so FSU can figure out where they are going and hold onto some recruits.
Playstation All American, right again!
TomahawkNation
Better to bear the rebuke of the wise than to hear the song of fools
What has Fischer done that you have an idea of? Please clue me in since you apparently can see into the future. Last time I checked Jimbo’s claim to fame is Jamarcus Russel, the worst QB in the NFL. SWEET! That’s great. What else. Please share your vast knowledge of why you are so sure that Jimbo is the right choice to be HC.
Why can’t you admit that TK dropped that ball as usual and threw way too much money at Jimbo? What was so great about this offense tday that made you say “HEll yeah, THAT’s FSU football?” Please enlighten me on why you feel your opinion is so valid over mine.
Jimbo made him look good at LSU
If that’s not a great coaching job, I don’t know what is.
No it didn't. They won a national title the next year.
Crowton is a damn good OC. LSU is #4, and this is a “rebuilding year” for them as they break in their young QB. Not one LSU alumn misses Jimbo. I know this because I watch games with the LSU club in Orlando, and my father is an LSU alumn. He does not miss Jimbo at all.
Jefferson played last year im pretty sure. Ponder played his first time last year also. Fisher is known for developing QBs and I would definitley take Ponders development over Jeffersons. Ehh, just my opinion though
well Russell is in the freakin NFL making a lot of money. but i guess those guys arent objective either
Russel is horrible in the NFL. Sure he made the league, but he is already on his way out. He is mocked by every NFL expert out there. He’s terrible, and will not start again after this year. I doubt he survives the season as a starter.
Yes, he is, but he also plays for the raiders
the most dysfunctional franchise in the NFL. Coaches punching each other, etc.
You can't judge a college player by NFL standards
Wienke did zero in the NFL, would you say he sucked? Danny W from UF did zero in the NFL but made our defense look bad on some plays. Matt Leinhart is another that killed in college but is not going to be a NFL QB. There is a lot more that goes into being an NFL QB than who your OC was in college. Trying to tie the two together is ignorant.
by osceolafan850 on Oct 3, 2009 11:08 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
FSU offense better than LSU
FSU
http://web1.ncaa.org/football/exec/rankingSummary?year=2009&org=234
LSU
http://web1.ncaa.org/football/exec/rankingSummary?year=2009&org=365
and FSU has played a harder schedule on top of that
http://web1.ncaa.org/mfb/2009/Internet/toughest%20schedule/fbs_9games_past.pdf
Crowton is a terrible OC
He had one year running primarily Fisher’s stuff, and then the offense goes kaput.
Ask anyone at Oregon or BYU
Seriously, Crowton does this everywhere. One year of good and then kaput.
But they will all admit that Jimbo was a great coach.
Half of my family are huge LSU fans. My cousin played for the Tigers. Ask anyone that follows LSU football… Fisher groomed Russell into a great COLLEGE QB. The kid is dumber than a bucket of rocks…. its his fault he cant hack it in the NFL, not Jimbo Fisher’s. Our offense is LIGHT YEARS ahead of where we were under Jeff. The recruiting has picked up a great deal as well.
I’m not going to sit here and say that Jimbo is the end all be all and will win us 6 MNCs, but I do think he has earned the right to give it a shot.
Jarmarcus is the worse QB in the NFL and playing on the 2nd worse team in the NFL
He bleeds Garnet and Gold, She bleeds Crimson and White. AND THEY BOTH HATE ORANGE! GO NOLES!! ROLL TIDE!!
by gonolesrolltide on Oct 4, 2009 9:50 AM EDT up reply actions
When does hoops start?
I can’t say I am as sold on Jimbo as some of you, but nobody is writing him a check for 5 million (and the 2.5 milion for a better alternative). The situation is what it is and he will have my support as he tries to salvage this thing.
How screwed is the recruiting class? Ship has sailed on the Byrnes duo. Joyner? Green? Jones? Bernard?
FYI....Amato did it again...
he went after Jimbo on the plane ride TO the game.
They had to be seperated. Amato is doing EVERYTHING he can to sabatoge Jimbo and FSU.
Also, Spetman has been lying to boosters groups insisting Amato and Jimbo are friends and saying nothing happened. It is a LIE.
Also, he is stiff as Al Gore. I heard he has been pumping his fist yelling that our coach staff is the best in the nation at these meetings and getting met with Cricketts. Our program is in the hands of somebody not fit to run a high school athletic dept.
Unless you want to see Amato stay at FSU next year (a REAL possibility) and Spetman drive the program into the ground. You need to get this info out.
things are real bad
and Spetman is in way over his head, but no AD in the country is going to publicly admit to what allegedly happened.
Yup...it is REAL bad....
much worse than folks want to believe.
There is more.
Jesus
2009 Rays Baseball: Welp.....we'll try again in 2010
2009 FSU Football: Bobby Bowden.........it's time to go
Be a TRUE Seminole: http://www.seminoles.com/sports/m-footbl/spec-rel/071509aab.html
by JMB on Oct 3, 2009 9:24 PM EDT up reply actions
If this gets out to other sites....
I might post another whooper.
Now Im just curious.
All these stories about our staff are the most exciting thing about FSU football this year. And that makes me sad. How much worse can it get?
Plus… aren’t these “fire-able offenses?” Shouldn’t the president and/or AD be like “Sorry coach Amato… you cant act this way and keep your job…. take your stupid ass antics and get the funk out! Oh… and Bobby, you can’t run a tight ship…. you don’t coach anymore…. you don’t recruit anymore… what do you do anyway? Peace out!” And yes I know they should…. but they wont. Unless public opinion forces their hand…. and we need all the ammo we can get.
Bobby will only fire...
his agent if he doesn’t get a fat raise.
That is all he is paying attention to.
Is this the single worst day of football for the ACC ever?
Looks that way
2009 Rays Baseball: Welp.....we'll try again in 2010
2009 FSU Football: Bobby Bowden.........it's time to go
Be a TRUE Seminole: http://www.seminoles.com/sports/m-footbl/spec-rel/071509aab.html
miami is looking ok right now and just pulled ahead.
Why is the sky blue? Because, God Loves the Infantry
This may be the whiskey talking...
…but I may be done watching FSU games for this season. It isn’t even fun, and that’s what this is supposed to be. These student-athletes don’t seem to be having fun and I don’t know how that environment around them could induce any sort of fun at all.
I have seen some bad FSU days, and I hoped the Jeff Bowden days were the rock bottom but clearly we have sunk lower. Intervention on A & E, which plays every Monday, is one of my favorite shows on TV. The interventionist preach that a person has to hit rock bottom before they can admit that they have a true problem. The catch 22 with that is that most people with a problem won’t hit rock bottom until they are dead or in jail. Bowden will not admit he IS the problem until he is dead or worse, not sure what worse could be tho.
I need to ask those more knowledgeable than I, is there somewhere we can write or email our concerns to so that the university can at least hear us? I have tickets to the NC State game at the end of the month and I am almost certain to either give them away, or just let them rot on my desk instead of going to another game where AARP members are accepted on the sidelines and mediocrity is actually reached for rather.
This could be rock bottom…I’ve told myself that a few times already.
not questioning the gist of your post...
but would rappers and prima donna tmz whores be better on the sidelines? Just clear ALL out and get that young blood… Jimbo looks pretty old, at least for a newbie coach.
I think we have much better players, but they are not being coached worth a damn. Sad to see what one can do to ones own legacy. I cringe when I walk by the unconquered statue everytime. MA has still made some good adjustments, but Amato hasn’t done jack. No recruiting, poor tackling and using Jody Allen as a lapdog. Nothing changes until those two are gone.
If Jimbo can't whip the chest
Coley needs to step in with the overhand right if this is the case.
Playstation All American, right again!
TomahawkNation
Better to bear the rebuke of the wise than to hear the song of fools
Amato is the king of douche bags...
but he was a college wrestler and good football player.
Few people can whip has arse.
Doesn’t make him right. He is still a douche and a huge reason FSU is a train wreck right now.
Thanks Bobby….you are an idiot for hiring a bigger idiot.
FSU sucking has done wonders for my marriage.
Today I spent the day with the wife driving the Blue Ridge Parkway, and this evening enjoying a nice meal at a guest ranch in the Smokey Mountains.
Tomorrow? Well, um, actually a pretty nice little Sunday, we’re going to go to Home Depot. Yeah, buy some wallpaper, maybe get some flooring, stuff like that. Maybe Bed, Bath, & Beyond, I don’t know, I don’t know if we’ll have enough time.
And I’ll take a Wild Cherry Pepsi if anyone has one.
I just dont watch or care anymore.
Next Saturday, if you leave two tickets to FSU-GT on your windshield, when you come back you’ll find 4.
Wait just a damn minute....
Frank the tank?!?!?
Could it be…. they guy from the Palace around 2002?
'Gentlemen, it is better to have died a small boy than to fumble this football.' John Heisman
'I'm not a Role Model" - Charles Barkley
Its hard to imagine Amato being stupid.
He speaks with such poise and elegance.
Is that FireChuckAmato.com site still available?
It is all good
If this doesn’t convince the admin and boosters they live in Alice in wonderland and they are way down the rabbit hole nothing will.
Recruits leaving, chucky wanting whip up, coaches with chipped teeth, BB on the sidelines trying to act like he has input, stadium picketed. What will it take, nobody at the game? How far removed are we here?
Former FSU quarterback Corso saying on national TV we have no coaching and looking pissed. This is beyond BB being run off it is now should the trustees resign as well as TK long before he plans and take Spetman with him he obviously has no idea what he is doing.
I want to hear in the morning BB announce he has decided to retire after this season if not immediately.
Playstation All American, right again!
TomahawkNation
Better to bear the rebuke of the wise than to hear the song of fools
spetman is a puppet. FSU’s President is a joke. FSU’s “HC” is worse than a joke. Maybe we can get some decent people in sooner than later.
Ameica, Land of the free and home to the entitled.
+1
"Some nasty players that come from those seeds down at FSU in Tallahassee, we hold ourselves to a higher standard... we'll keep grinding it out. When you step on the field you have to represent not just yourself, but for everybody." (DD #45)
So this is how rock bottom feels.
Well another week another disappointment. FSU really has lost it’s way and personally as a longtime fan and supporter I am sick of it. The only person who I really feel bad for besides the fans and the university is Christian Ponder. He easily is the best qb we have had since Weinke. The guy single handedly has kept us in every game this year. If he played for Texas, Florida, Bama or any other top 10 team the press would be all over this guy. Sadly I don’t think he will ever get the attention he deserves because I have a feeling he will be gone before this sinking ship is plugged up. I’m tossing my hat in the middle. Jimbo 2010.
Unfortunately NO
We still have a ways to go for rock bottom HOWEVER, I think we will reach it this year with….NO BOWL GAME AND EVEN WORSE A LOSING SEASON.
There is no way around it. Maryland will be our only win and that is at best 50/50 right now. We are way worse than I expected and this year will be almost unbearable when the Gates hold that trophy following an undefeated season.
I am rooting for BAMA for the rest of the year and hopefully in the SEC championship for the only glimmer of hope I have left of happiness this year.
How is boycotting the program going to change anything?
Events will unfold the same way no matter what we do as fans. All we can do is make things worse.
Would you invest in a poorly run company
Where the CEO was incompetent? And the VPs were publicly fighting in front of their employees? Where their projections were far off from real numbers?
Of course not. Investors look for a positive return.
This would be like buying shares of GM 18 months ago.
No I would not but...
I do not look at FSU as a business investment…it is my Alma Mater and I bleed Garnet and Gold. I will support them through thick and thin. Fight the coaching battle somewhere else.
Athletics is a business
And though there is an emotional attachment to your support, I would withhold my support until changes occur.
Why reward incompetence? Why subsidize this nonsense?
If you arent fighting with $, you’re just blowing smoke.
Bowden?
Fired? Since when?
We could lose the rest of the year and he doesnt get fired. Who fires him? Randy? TK? He owns those two.
Bowden leaves when Bowden wants to leave.
TK is leaving.
Now would be the time to do it.
'Gentlemen, it is better to have died a small boy than to fumble this football.' John Heisman
'I'm not a Role Model" - Charles Barkley
I can see it now...
Spetman: Um… Bobby… um Coach? Got a sec?
Bobby: zzzzz zzzzzz
Spetman: ahem
Bobby: huh? receivers, catch the ball, you know? huh… ooh… its just you Sandy
Spetman: Randy. Say uh, Coach. We’ve been talking and uh… we noticed that men’s football isn’t doing very well. I mean, we lost every game this year since BYU and Duke just announced that we’re their homecoming game next year.
Bobby: Well, i tell you what, I just talked to #74s mama at the game, you know? And she thinks were doing just fine.
Spetman: But we didnt even send the band to Gainesville this year.
Bobby: And I saw #38s folks and they seemed happy.
Spetman: Coach, thats because hes transferring.
Bobby: He couldn’t hack it here.
Spetman: Coach, we’re not good and uh….
Bobby: Why don’t you see if we can get Osmose to redo that commercial we just shot, Robby?
Spetman: [walks out]
TK: Well, what’d say??
Spetman: He just mumbled about players’ mamas.
TK: Sh#t. I hate it when he does that. Well, did you at least fire him?
Spetman: Im not sure he knew who I was.
TK: Damn. Another fine tactic he uses. Bastard! He was prepared!
by coonhound on Oct 3, 2009 10:24 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
Whipple for OC under Jimbo?
2009 Rays Baseball: Welp.....we'll try again in 2010
2009 FSU Football: Bobby Bowden.........it's time to go
Be a TRUE Seminole: http://www.seminoles.com/sports/m-footbl/spec-rel/071509aab.html
I’m thinking maybe Peterson from boise state or levitt from USF cause he already knows how to recruit in Florida and he built that team from the ground up. I’d even take the Cinncinatti head coach.
I think Jimbo will be great
He’s a Saban guy, he understands organizational structure.
by Bud Elliott on Oct 4, 2009 12:12 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
WHY WOULD YOU WANT LEAVITT????
The guy is an average coach at best. Consistently, they follow up a big win with a deep, late season swoon. Plus, he is a whiner on the level of Spurrier. I wouldn’t want him and don’t think he will ever leave anyway. Wouldn’t mind Petersen, but he is in a golden situation in Potato Land. As long as he keeps doing what he is doing, he will be a god there. He is a good coach
What about Whipple from Miami? And hurt a rival in the process.
I mean hire him as the HC. Are we that in love with Jimbo we won’t buy him out?
Not for $5 million
2009 Rays Baseball: Welp.....we'll try again in 2010
2009 FSU Football: Bobby Bowden.........it's time to go
Be a TRUE Seminole: http://www.seminoles.com/sports/m-footbl/spec-rel/071509aab.html
I am actually ok with FIsher, but fear he might be becoming part of the problem as well. He has picked up the recruiting and the offense is better, but…..Still stunned with how the OL has been a HUGE disappointment the last two weeks with no running game.
Luckly
The OL’s ability to pass block and CP7’s arm are the only reasons why we might see a bowl game in December
2009 Rays Baseball: Welp.....we'll try again in 2010
2009 FSU Football: Bobby Bowden.........it's time to go
Be a TRUE Seminole: http://www.seminoles.com/sports/m-footbl/spec-rel/071509aab.html
My Blog
http://docholiday2.wordpress.com/
Playstation All American, right again!
TomahawkNation
Better to bear the rebuke of the wise than to hear the song of fools
I was too spontaneous
Take Wetherell and Spetman with you Bobby! I have had more than enough of this.
Playstation All American, right again!
TomahawkNation
Better to bear the rebuke of the wise than to hear the song of fools
There has been a change
http://docholiday2.wordpress.com/
Playstation All American, right again!
TomahawkNation
Better to bear the rebuke of the wise than to hear the song of fools
21-10 scUM
FML
2009 Rays Baseball: Welp.....we'll try again in 2010
2009 FSU Football: Bobby Bowden.........it's time to go
Be a TRUE Seminole: http://www.seminoles.com/sports/m-footbl/spec-rel/071509aab.html
21-17 scUM
2009 Rays Baseball: Welp.....we'll try again in 2010
2009 FSU Football: Bobby Bowden.........it's time to go
Be a TRUE Seminole: http://www.seminoles.com/sports/m-footbl/spec-rel/071509aab.html
I just don't get why the adiminstration keeps covering for his program
What’s the benefit now? he’s not winning anymore, the record is long gone, he cost over 2mill a year to keep and two of his top assistants are generously paid (Amato, Mickey) Why cover up the disfunction? I always assumed the reason they haven’t let him go recently was the pusuit of his stupid record and public backlash. He’s not catching JoePa at this point and if all these stories come out maybe the backlash from retiring Coach Bowden after the year won’t be as harsh, and you won’t have a coaching staff making big money for sub 500 records.
Why?
Because BB owns the current school administration. Right now he’s allowed to leave when he wants, how he wants.
2009 Rays Baseball: Welp.....we'll try again in 2010
2009 FSU Football: Bobby Bowden.........it's time to go
Be a TRUE Seminole: http://www.seminoles.com/sports/m-footbl/spec-rel/071509aab.html
God damn, Cal sucks
2009 Rays Baseball: Welp.....we'll try again in 2010
2009 FSU Football: Bobby Bowden.........it's time to go
Be a TRUE Seminole: http://www.seminoles.com/sports/m-footbl/spec-rel/071509aab.html
The Chris Rix Rumors
Can anyone address why Chris Rix keeps announcing that a lot of the players do not like Jimbo’s style of coaching which consists of a lot of “cursing and screaming”? He has been saying stuff like this 2 weeks straight now on TV.
Chris Rix has the temerity to show his face!?
After 5 loses to Miami and countless brainless plays he has the audacity to stick his head out in public? How dare he!
"Your eyes can decieve you. Don't trust them." Obi-Wan Kenobi, the first sabermetrician...
by Curtain Jerker on Oct 3, 2009 10:58 PM EDT up reply actions
If it's on warchant, you must mean KRIS Rix. In a bikini, asking the players about why gummi bears make them happy
by pillsburysoldier on Oct 3, 2009 11:07 PM EDT up reply actions
They deserve every bit of it
I’m glad to hear Jimbo’s doing some “cursing and screaming” because those bums deserve it. I’m “cursing and screaming” during every game! At least he cares, unlike our head coach.
by seminoleballer on Oct 3, 2009 11:07 PM EDT up reply actions
Do they do it out of loyalty?
At this point what’s the possible benefits from keeping him? I thought I knew but with the record gone and the PR hits the programs continues to take what the hell is the upside. He’s on 1 year contracts some it’s not like you’ll have to pay him a large sum of money when you let him go, just don’t renew his contract. Announce a press conference to thank him for all he’s done, and move forward with Jimbo. At this point who could blame FSU? The program is a joke right now.
TK is going to let his buddy do whatever he wants
And Randy isn’t going to do anything TK doesn’t want him to
>>---l>
Pretty much
Welcome to our hell
2009 Rays Baseball: Welp.....we'll try again in 2010
2009 FSU Football: Bobby Bowden.........it's time to go
Be a TRUE Seminole: http://www.seminoles.com/sports/m-footbl/spec-rel/071509aab.html
Pathetic
We missed EASY plays, including ANOTHER easy kick. We didn’t look like we wanted it, even though this was (as said in the article) a DEFINING game in our season. That pass interference call was total BS, but we should have put the game away long before that even became a factor.
I’m totally disappointed by this game, I bet it set us back a couple years on recruiting. This shows that we just simply don’t have it anymore. And I’m not talking about competing with the big boys, I’m talking about average teams. BC is nothing special and they moved the ball at will. Our defense has NO fight in them. I wasn’t sure if we would make this a winning season or not, but now I’m sure that we won’t make a bowl game this year. We are downright horrible and that’s no joke.
Get Bobby out of there ASAP. He’s not turning us around, he’s not making adjustments, he’s not righting the ship. He’s doing NOTHING to help the program at this point. Bobby, I love you as a coach, but get the hell outta here before you ruin everything that you built.
sadly that seems to be the case
I know it sounds sleezy but I would have just used the accademic scandal as a reason to remove him. I know making him the scapegoat for it would put a tarnish on his legacy but at this point, SO WHAT! We could have used a little tact about how we went about it so it would seem as obvious but the implied message could have been we had to do this so the NCAA would have mercy on us. If T.K. wanted to but just didn’t know how to let Bobby go that was the perfect time and excuse but I guess he’s satisfied with a crappy ass program, as long as he can yuck it up with coach Bowden.
This is where I'm thankful I don't live in Florida
If I had to put up with UF, Miami and USF fans trash talking all the time, I’d be apoplectic.
As a FSU fan I feel like a Roman late in the 5th century. Just walking around in a daze looking at the remnants of my once-proud empire and asking “What the hell happened? It was all so good?” Inept leadership can take down anything.
"Your eyes can decieve you. Don't trust them." Obi-Wan Kenobi, the first sabermetrician...
by Curtain Jerker on Oct 3, 2009 11:09 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
Love bobby
If the administration loved him as much as they say they would sent him out to pasture before he made a fool out of them, FSU and all concerned.
I have no great love for BB I am just a play station All American.
He is not going to give up 2.5 million a year voluntarily. Ann still has some land investments in her sights. Somebody is going to have to step in and say get out of here.
Playstation All American, right again!
TomahawkNation
Better to bear the rebuke of the wise than to hear the song of fools
Do people really LOVE Bobby? Why? he doesnt love you or FSU.
The only school he loves is Bama because of his hard on for Bear Bryant like all those other Bammer psychos.
If it was up to me.....
I’d clean house! Everybody would go. I’m throwing the baby out with the bath water.
I’m sorry but Jimbo is guilty by association. I’m not saying it’s the right thing to do, I’m not saying it’s the wrong to do, it’s just what I would do.
I can’t take this BS anymore. Call me when FSU has a complete and COMPETENT coaching staff, until then………….
I completely agree. Until we get someone who is fired up about winning and I hate to say this but someone like nick saban or urban meyer then we are just going to be an average football team. I just don’t think Jimbo is the answer
agreed
you people are crazy getting on jimbo’s ass already!
by garnetandgold on Oct 4, 2009 12:46 AM EDT up reply actions
I really hope you're right.
I haven’t been strongly against him, and actually I have been for him, but the way the OL Is run blocking is disturbing. A supposed strength is garbage. And Trickett is a Jimbo guy too. Then again, send the ex-Marine against the Chest for a cage death match. I’ll go for the ex-Marine, USA USA USA
Miami wins
ACC +1?
2009 Rays Baseball: Welp.....we'll try again in 2010
2009 FSU Football: Bobby Bowden.........it's time to go
Be a TRUE Seminole: http://www.seminoles.com/sports/m-footbl/spec-rel/071509aab.html
Termite Control Analogy
If it’s caught early you can treat the wood, put up a pesticide deterence, and through out the bad wood. If you let it go on for too long the frame and support is all rotten; its time to call the insurance company. Demolish the house and build a new one.
Termite=Everything Bowden(post 2000)
I was at the game. My thoughts...
1. What the %^&Y* is with our secondary. It seems like we never have a deep safety, it’s 1 on 1 all over the field. We’re always rushing 4, and it’s always 1 on 1 every where you go. Safeties are non existent.
2. Running game? Where did it go? Did Ty Jones even play? Thomas couldn’t stay on his feet.
3. Most underused play ever: QB sneak. When it was 2nd and goal at the 1 I kept shouting QB sneak, I guess Jimbo couldn’t hear me. We run the same play 2x in a row? Then go PA 12 inches from the goalline????
4. Greg Reid had a rough game, getting burnt deep. But if you haven’t been burnt deep, you haven’t played CB for FSU, have you?
5. P-Rob struggled. We needed him to step up this game. How bad was the injury? To be honest I’ve been out of it. I came home from the game, tried to get into a couple shouting matches with drunk fat BC girls, then took a 4 hour nap.
6. The false starts were ridiculous. That stadium is freaking silent.
7. I know it worked, but WR reverse pass on the 2 point conversion? Really?
8. Who forced Harris’ fumble in the closing minute?
A note to #1
I know a lot if it is the dumb schemes we use, but I never remember it being this bad. Every pass play it’s like we’re in a 4 man rush, no pressure, but the secondary looks like we’re in cover 0. We need to stop using a rover, especially against a QB with Shinkie’s mobility.
BTW, we get awful luck playing teams who are in their super bowl. Last week it’s USF’s, this year it was BC’s for Herzlich. Before we were in Jax St’s. We’re not a good enough team to handle that.
by tdchrisdavis on Oct 3, 2009 11:42 PM EDT up reply actions
a second note to #1
on the first 63 yard pass i saw the safety blitz and immediately screamed HERE COMES THE DEEP BALL!
Who was the safety on that blitz? No pressure applied at all. might as well keep them in cover 2
Yea I saw Korey creep up to blitz a few times
Every time I said to myself, is THIS where he makes a play? Instead he’d get ingaged with a blocker and do nothing.
by tdchrisdavis on Oct 4, 2009 12:02 AM EDT up reply actions
Let the waterboy play...
Works in the movies…
I have six locks on my door all in a row. When I go out, I only lock every other one. I figure no matter how long somebody stands there picking the locks, they are always locking three.
Elayne Boosler
Why Bowden MUST Leave NOW!!!
I see some people say that even with Jimbo at the helms our team would still play the same way. My answer to that is: When Miami fired Larry Coker and Randy Shannon took over his first 2 years was rocky, but look at what this team has accomplished now. Every year Bowden comes back I believe our team gets set back 2 years. FSUn had a good read on that WVU website. The last line quoted Bowden as saying he would never stay in one place too long. Well your 4-5 years to long here. I do believe this team will rebound and become successful again. When? That is up to Bowden, does he care about FSU? Not anymore, his wins are the ONLY thing he cares about. Maybe its time to put a “For Sale” sign in front of Bowdens home.
Huked On Foniks Wurks Fer ME!!!!
by PanamaCityBeach-NOLE on Oct 3, 2009 11:42 PM EDT reply actions
I'm more concerned about keeping the two Track NCs
2009 Rays Baseball: Welp.....we'll try again in 2010
2009 FSU Football: Bobby Bowden.........it's time to go
Be a TRUE Seminole: http://www.seminoles.com/sports/m-footbl/spec-rel/071509aab.html
Watching the history channel is so much more enjoyable than our games... Would losing the rest of our games be the best outcome?
Is it a weighing of the risk that we lose all recruits for a year vs winning some games and keeping some recruits and have Bobby around another year and then get two poor years of recruiting…
Too bad its too late to redshirt every possible talented player on our team and let Bobby ride it out on backups.
"I'm falling apart, I'm barely breathing, With a broken heart thats still beating, In the pain is the healing, in Your Name I find meaning, So I'm holdin' on.. holdin' on to you."
Going 2-10
I’m not saying I hope this happens because I hope we reel off 6 acc wins in a row but you know if we lost the rest of our games maybe the admin would realize what a joke our program is right now… like the rest of the country has
We need a support group post for this season.
"I'm falling apart, I'm barely breathing, With a broken heart thats still beating, In the pain is the healing, in Your Name I find meaning, So I'm holdin' on.. holdin' on to you."
+1
i really dont know what to do with myself or the other students who are wandering souls right now.
Honestly the majority of the current students show about as much heart as our weak D.
Yet another crumbling piece of our puzzle.
Another sad fact...
my grandpa donated 1 million dollars to FSU, he was the largest cash donation to fsu & he is still a HUGE Bowden supporter. I think all these Old Timers still love Bowden cause he shakes their hands and acts like a freind to them. Wish the Boosters would finally see the light
Huked On Foniks Wurks Fer ME!!!!
by PanamaCityBeach-NOLE on Oct 3, 2009 11:59 PM EDT reply actions
Maybe we can pawn him off on Terry and the can be Co-Head Coaches
That way he can keep his pathetic farce goging at some place a little less demanding on his time. I know they are not D-1 and the wins won’t count towards his D-1 record but he probably won’t know the difference at this point.
Unacceptable!
We are Florida state right? we had 14 consecutive top 5 finishes. So 2-3, thats unacceptable. I’m sick of after every loss bowden yucks it up with the media. He is smiling and laughing and half the time he has no idea what is going on. When players see there coach laughing after a loss and thinking it’s not that big of a deal then they will think the same thing and think losing isn’t that bad. If you are a competetor at any level losing should piss you off everytime. I’m so sick of losing to teams we should beat and until we make a change at the head coaching position it’s gonna stay like that
2ND & 15 21-21
QB roll out to the right. Put your playmaker in complete control. Pass or run. DONT run it up the middle when you have been stuffed all freaking day. It’s not just the defense that sucks on this team. It’s a team wide effort to really, really suck. The talent is there. I love coach B. I used to set up video for him back in 91-92 in Thomasville. I really, really love this coach. He has been so much for FSU. He is FSU. It’s time for him to step aside and let a new day dawn. I know how he feels about character. But the players are not getting what they deserve. That’s the ethical requirement. Coaches are in a state of dysfunction. If Bowden can’t control it, he must STOP BEING SELFISH and let the players fulfill their intent. It’s about the players, not the coaches. The coaches are the only ones being paid. Therefore they are the only ones accountable to those who give the program money. I love coach Bowden. I do. But he’s in the way of GOOD Talent. Please, please please step aside. It’s past time. Bowden is ruining the program now. When pros are done. They are done. Bird. Jordon. Elway. Bryant. Tuna. It’s past time and you are causing the suffering of the players. There is no lesson in not being up to the job.
by HolyCrap on Oct 4, 2009 12:08 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
Props to Dawsey for acknowledging me before the game
When he walked past he gave a nice headnod. Though he didn’t put in Haulstead like I had asked.
Lets project rest of season
Loss to Georgia tech
Loss to NC
Loss to Clemson
Loss to NC State
Loss to Gaytors
Looks like a 4-8 season to me
Well I forgot we play at Wake Forest also
so there we could realistically end up at 3-9 with the only likely win hopefully against Maryland at home
Wow har far we dropped
Well FSUn did you think in your wildest nightmares that we would be sitting at 2-3?
With Georgia Tech a likely loss to put us at 2-4????
No, I didn't see that
But I did predict 7.65 wins. Vegas said O/U was 7 wins. I guess maybe half credit for being one of the few people to say 8 wins was optimistic.
It may be
Look at GT’s offense. They may run it down our throats. Then a thursday night game against UNC at UNC and we always struggle on thursday nights. Then Clemson where we haven’t won since 01. Then NC State who’s QB has thrown 2 picks in his entire career compared to 30 td’s. Then wake who has beat us 3 straight years and it seems like skineer has our number. Then maryland who is awful so we may win. Then the Gators where it will be tebow’s final home game.That one won’t even be close. yeah it’s not that hard to think we could go 3 and 9
I realistically beleive we win at most another 3 games but likely only 2 more
Maryland 75% chance of winning
GT 25 %
NC 50%
NC State 50%
WF 25%
Clemson 25%
Ok
Realistically, I think you have to give more than a 1 in 4 shot of beating GTech. Their defense is quite bad. Ditto Wake.
In any case, you just predicted 2.5 more wins, so either 4-8 or 5-7.
Any realistic 1 week out GT Game predictions.
Take into account that this is a night game at doak….
Which doesnt mean much anymore.
No Heart.
Home field advantage?
Yeah and we are 5-11 in our last 16 home games
Wow. That is by far the most disgusting thing Ive heard all day.
What happened to 54 straight home wins?
It seems that not only do we need coaching changes we need a fan overhaul. I would argue that our fanbase is one of the least feared in america.
This was proved last week when 12,000 USF fans were louder than 71,000 FSU fans. I was there and it was shocking.
How far we have fallen
You think that is bad how bout I read before the BC that since Oct 15 of 05 we are 25-23 but if you take out the non bcs teams and duke we are a mear 19-23. That is pathetic. Yeah I was there to and that was embarassing to see that much green
Away team fans make it a point to travel to Tally for games because they know they have a real shot.
Last year v.s. UF was probably 40% UF fans.
Thats true.
A place where teams were once scared to played now has become just another win on the schedule. we have no more home field advantage
And the what hurst more than anything the Canes are 3-1 and likley again in top 10
They have made the appropriate coaching changes. Look how many different coaches the canes have had throught the years and they keep on winning. They recently have had some down years like us but they are not afraid to make the coaching changed needed to right the ship and now they are back
Look at our remaining schedule
Does anyone beleive that any of these games are locks for us???
well I dont Wheras Miami is 3-1 all against all ranked teams and now should be favored to win the remainder of their games. In matter of fact Miami has an easier road than the Gaytors the rest of the way
I would not be suprised to see a UF-Miami NC game
The point is
it never should have come down to needing Greg Reid to make that pick in order to win the game. We should have dominated them from start to finish.
The scary thing is we are ranked 35 in Rivals for our 2010 recruiting class
We are behing such recruiting powerhouses such as
NC State
West Virginia
Maryland
Minnesota
Kansas
Iowa
Pitt
Cal
Texas Tech
Texas A&M
Olalhoma State
For crying out loud we are tied with Utah. This is disgraceful for FSU in the most talent rich state
I understand the shaky coach situation might be keeping kids away
but dont these kids see that they could come in and win a starting position pretty easily?
In theory yes but kids want to play for a winning program more than anything
Otherwise you wouldnt teams like Gaytors wouldnt have six 5 star safeties waiting for playing time
And with all of the garbage concerning our coaching issues made public in the past weeks kids are being negatively recruited. Our program is in disarray now and you can bet any kids that were leans to fsu is hearing about that from other coaches
As far as recruiting, I don't see any kid committing to us until after the season.
Were gonna have to fight to keep the ones we got…
I have six locks on my door all in a row. When I go out, I only lock every other one. I figure no matter how long somebody stands there picking the locks, they are always locking three.
Elayne Boosler
I forgot to mention even that powerhouse Stanford is out recruiting us
And you have speak english to get accepted there
CBS Sports is predicting us to make it to the old GMAC Bowl to face Temple.
A game in which after we lose bowden will proclaim “Dadgum, we’re just one player away, you know it?”
YAY
WERE GOING TO A BOWL
2009 Rays Baseball: Welp.....we'll try again in 2010
2009 FSU Football: Bobby Bowden.........it's time to go
Be a TRUE Seminole: http://www.seminoles.com/sports/m-footbl/spec-rel/071509aab.html
by JMB on Oct 4, 2009 1:04 AM EDT up reply actions
This is getting comicly bad
2009 Rays Baseball: Welp.....we'll try again in 2010
2009 FSU Football: Bobby Bowden.........it's time to go
Be a TRUE Seminole: http://www.seminoles.com/sports/m-footbl/spec-rel/071509aab.html
by JMB on Oct 4, 2009 1:07 AM EDT up reply actions
Wow
Temple. Are they even allowed in the same sentence as we are. thats embarrasing. we may as well just stay home and not even play
To show you how pathetic that is
I am a temple grad but am more of a nole fan since my son goes to FSU and now to think that the noles have sunk to such a level. Temple has not been to a bowl games since 1979 and now I think they have a better chance to go to a bowl than the noles
Its crazy because 2-3 years ago it was our D keeping us in the close games.
I say we cram into the Delorean and go pick up the old D.
We might have a complete team!
if we've got a delorean i'm going back and staying there
by garnetandgold on Oct 4, 2009 1:12 AM EDT up reply actions
AND...
when i go back to the mid 90’s, i’m going to find all the assholes who are now conveniently a part of “gator nation” and shank them with something rusty…
by garnetandgold on Oct 4, 2009 1:14 AM EDT up reply actions
i remember that
wasn’t it on the 2nd and 30 play?
Our Offensive line is way too small and cannot create holes
Miami’s o line averages 310 lbs and they maty be the best line in the country
Jacory harris has all day to throw and rb james averaged over 10 yds/carry tonite and gained over 150
Besides the BYU game when we played against a bunch of slow whire guys we have not run well at all even against a Div 2 team in Jacksonville State
Miami’s o line averages 310 lbs and they maty be the best line in the country
Not even close IMO
There are some issues, but USC’s line is the finest in the country and they are not much bigger than FSU’s. There are bigger mesh issues.
That was some bs
How do they call Pass interference on robinson when there feet get tangled up but then don’t call BC for pi on our last drive when there db mugged owens on 2nd down before the ball was even there. The fans determined Robinsons PI call. I thought the officiating was terrible.
Yea that Reid drop hurt and that PI call was a major gift
I would like to see the replay rules change to allow for challenges on penaties, calls and non calls
That PI call was so bogus first their legs get tangled and secondly ball was no where near catchable
That play changed the whole game.
Greg had a rough game today, getting beat deep and the muffed punt. He has been one of the few bright spots this season though.
Several missed calls hurt us
But it shouldn’t have to come down to a needing a call to win this game. We should have dominated.
There were a couple times where their guys hit our receivers before the ball got there. We didn’t make the catch. It was PI but wasn’t called. The Dionte Allen PI call was bogus…their feet got tangled up, plus it was uncatchable. The same thing happened to Bert Reed and they didn’t call it (only it was a catchable ball). Very inconsistent officiating.
Thank god for my favorite HS team STA
They have not let me down for 28 consecutive games now. Lets hope for a 2nd straight national title.
Last nites game was truly a showpiece that lived up to its hype
Um..
remember a couple weeks ago I mentioned something about a losing season….
well it may become a reality if this keeps up..
Next week, 2-4…..
this is gonna be a horrible year….
Go NOl….. nevermind, Roll Tide, I guess…
He bleeds Garnet and Gold, She bleeds Crimson and White. AND THEY BOTH HATE ORANGE! GO NOLES!! ROLL TIDE!!
Fisher Yawning before the game
While Christian Ponder was throwing some ball on the sideline before the game, Jimbo Fisher was yawning in the background. You could clearly see that during the ESPN pre-game broadcast.
Did anybody else notice that? Maybe someone else can post a video to it. Just plain pathetic. I had my doubts about BB, but now I’m questioning even Jimbo’s place in the program.
yeah I saw that
He bleeds Garnet and Gold, She bleeds Crimson and White. AND THEY BOTH HATE ORANGE! GO NOLES!! ROLL TIDE!!
by gonolesrolltide on Oct 4, 2009 5:07 AM EDT up reply actions
If you had to deal with the crap Jimbo is..
I doubt you would be able to get much sleep either…
I have six locks on my door all in a row. When I go out, I only lock every other one. I figure no matter how long somebody stands there picking the locks, they are always locking three.
Elayne Boosler
Yeah I saw that.
Thats good when you see your coach in waiting yawning before arguably the game that was going to make or brake our season. Thats good leadership right there
Seriously...
guys like you are gonna steal my gig as the site comedian.
I’ve never come up with anything that funny.
If this was Fisher's team right now...
How much outrage would there be over that crap of a PI call? The safety last week? The idea that there was still 1 second on the clock in the Miami game? How many people would be pissed over the missed fg’s and pat’s and acknowledge the kicker is at fault? I think it would be easier for people who care about Bobby to agree (albeit in a nicer way) that a change is needed if we were being CLEARLY beaten. Not by a few points and obvious plays that went awry or penalties that are questionable. I don’t get it… why should we of SOUNDLY beaten BC? They had every advantage going into this game (last weeks win vs WF, and the ESPN show) USF seems to be a bit better than folks think, and Miami is as well. I have asked this and have yet to get an answer from those who say I don’t back up my points. LAST DECEMBER this board was warning how bad the defense was going to be. What changed and made the squad so much better that the predictions on here were overwhelmingly putting us in the ACC title game? and a few even said Bobby might go out next year with a run for a title. ? what gives ?
Excuses and Blame can be given and I am not even going to try and defend anybody… I am not there and I am not an expert. I just wonder if the masses (at least here) were not thirsty for aging blood, if they would be rallying for the US vs THEM mentality and really more upset with the “breaks” we have had. The results would still be the same… 2-3. I just think it’s kinda cruel that the football god’s are toying with us… no obvious ass kickings (until UF) plausible denial is there… yes, there will be a change, it’s just a shame that this program and this coach will not have the feel good ending that is deserved. for those who say it needed to happen in 2000 or 2001… Good Lord. I guess we would of been through our Ron Zook and maybe… maybe be in our own version of Urban renewal??? you never know.
I think by now this is more than wins and losses
with all the allegations that have come out the past few weeks this loss was just the last straw.
How much outrage would there be over that crap of a PI call? The safety last week? The idea that there was still 1 second on the clock in the Miami game?
The same morons who bitch about 1 call while overlooking the absolute gift FSU got on the 3rd down spot would probably do the same.
How many people would be pissed over the missed fg’s and pat’s and acknowledge the kicker is at fault? I think it would be easier for people who care about Bobby to agree (albeit in a nicer way) that a change is needed if we were being CLEARLY beaten. Not by a few points and obvious plays that went awry or penalties that are questionable. I don’t get it… why should we of SOUNDLY beaten BC? They had every advantage going into this game (last weeks win vs WF, and the ESPN show) USF seems to be a bit better than folks think, and Miami is as well. I have asked this and have yet to get an answer from those who say I don’t back up my points.
Sorry, did you see BC? They beat us down and put it on cruise control. It’s not about becoming terrible! It is about not maximizing resources.
LAST DECEMBER this board was warning how bad the defense was going to be. What changed and made the squad so much better that the predictions on here were overwhelmingly putting us in the ACC title game? and a few even said Bobby might go out next year with a run for a title. ? what gives ?
Excuses and Blame can be given and I am not even going to try and defend anybody… I am not there and I am not an expert. I just wonder if the masses (at least here) were not thirsty for aging blood, if they would be rallying for the US vs THEM mentality and really more upset with the "breaks" we have had.
It’s not the talent, it’s how the coaches are misusing the talent, and how the coaches can’t get along at all and are literally fighting each other etc. FSU should win the Atlantic because they have much better talent.
. I guess we would of been through our Ron Zook and maybe… maybe be in our own version of Urban renewal??? you never know.
Yes, because it would have facilitated change.
Coaches misusing our talent
I completely agree. Our athletes our top notch every year but our coaches misuse the talent. I’m sorry but if rix had a decent qb coach I think the man would have been awsome. X Lee too. I know he was an idiot but with the right coaching maybe he understands the playbook. The coaches don’t know how to set up the playbook around a players strengths and weaknesess. Our secondary has all the talent to be good but mickey thinks that playing man is the only way to play. You have to play to your players strengths. Just look at the QB from Michigan. Rodriguez has built that playbook around his strengths and they are 4-1.
The Jimbo Pass is Insane
How do half of you continue to give Jimbo a pass? He chokes in big games. He gives up the run too early. We have a good line. The only game we committed to run was the BYU game. We put a hurt QB in the shot gun against USF and let two future NFL ends pin their ears back. Don’t give me the stats. The sacks were included. We also had two horrid running plays on obvious downs. Jimbo runs on 2 and 10 after an incomplete pass. He started the game with at least 5 consecutive passes. It was a consensus from everyone that Jones and Thomas are our top 2 backs. Quit playing the other guys and get these two involved in the game. I have scene the quotes – he and CP put together 2 good drives in the 4th quarter. That is great – since we went 6 quarters in a row without a td. WE SCORED TWO TOUCHDOWNS ON OFFENSE AGAINST J-STATE! You would all be calling for Jeff Bowdens head in the same circumstances. Quit giving Jimbo a pass. He called a double reverse pass on his two point conversion. Really? That is the go to play! If he cannot handles this job how is going to handle being the HC. The whole staff needs to be let go. we need to bring in a new system and coach. We can pay the 5 million and state over. I am sure we have some big money boosters that would step up to get this going in the right direction.
Oh, so you consider the BYU not a big game? Because your second sentance states that he chokes in big games... What about the VT game? Clemson? Hmmm...
Jimbo has turned around the offense in addition to being handicapped by a pathetic coaching staff where half of it tries to undermine him. Why can you not see that? Are you trying to not see it?
Our offense went from one of the worst in the ACC to the best… tell me, please, how can you not see that…
Until Jimbo is unhidered I will reserve judgement and give him the benefit of the doubt. What there shouldn’t be doubt about is his improvement of the offense. I am not skilled in statistics, but I can see our offense have actual substance in its drives and personnel, as opposed to the JB era where it was rainbow pass after rainbow bass, HB toss on 4 and 1, etc. We were a pathetic offensive unit under JB and if you watch games from back then and watch them now, i challange a person not to see the difference. And if you still cannot see the difference, this site will surely point them out with stats and analysis that can cut through what is difficult to see.
"I'm falling apart, I'm barely breathing, With a broken heart thats still beating, In the pain is the healing, in Your Name I find meaning, So I'm holdin' on.. holdin' on to you."
BYU was a blow out. It was big until we had a 30 point lead. Our offense if far from the best in the ACC.
Rumors and blog chatter do not proof any undermining. Maybe Amato doesn’t like him but I find it hard to believe that held us to 1 TD against USF, 2 against J-State and 6 points through 3 quarters yesterday.
I guess Jimbo is undermining the defense. That is why they stink as well.
The offense is totally inconsistent and he is in charge of it. Mickey’s defense is terrible and he is responsible for it. HC in waiting does not make you the HC now. His job is to coach the offense and recruit. We are mediocre at both.
I am not saying JF is worse then JB. I am only pointing out that had we put together a 2 and 3 start under JB everyone would have lost it.
If you are okay with mediocrity that is your problem. I want to be a national title contender year in and year out.
Those who have the live with mediocrity are those who cannot see where the problems are in the organization vs who is holding it up.
We disagree, thats fine, and Jimbo isn’t perfect but I think your underestimating the power of dysfunction within an organization.
"I'm falling apart, I'm barely breathing, With a broken heart thats still beating, In the pain is the healing, in Your Name I find meaning, So I'm holdin' on.. holdin' on to you."
I agree
It’s like Jeff’s playbook stayed and Jimbo is just reading off of it. Seriously. With fisher here we we have gone 17-13. Yeah our offense is pretty good but thats because Ponder is awsome and is actually smart with the football. Without him our offense sucks. The run blocking is terrible and he doesn’t commit to the run at all. When you can’t score from the 2 yard line two straight weeks! thats awful!!! And against BC we had not 4 but 5 plays(the offsides call on 1) against a horrid BC Defense. Yeah there is a difference from the JB era to the JF era and it’s called CHRISTIAN PONDER! Jimbo is not HC material. He seems like an A whole. He never takes any blame on himself after a game. It’s always the players fault. I’m sorry but I grew up watching those teams from the 90’s play and yeah I may be spoiled becasue of it and a 2-3 season is unacceptable! I want to be at the least competeing at the level to play in a BCS game every year. And with how soft our side the ACC is that really shouldn’t be that hard. I say give fisher till manuel is gone and if he hasn’t made progress then he needs to leave
Just wondering. Were you dead last year?
Because that’s the only way you could possibly have not realized how committed to the run Jimbo was last year.
by pillsburysoldier on Oct 4, 2009 10:07 PM EDT up reply actions
He must have been
Because only then could he not have seen how much Ponder has improved. Hmm…who’s to credit there?
>>---l>
He also doesn't listen to the press conferences.
Just like those who say Mickey takes “no” responsibility don’t either.
But I am going to have to turn in my TNation writer’s badge if he keeps this comedy up.
You listening to this, Zachhoop?
You should feel LUCKY that MattDNole likes writing for a FSU sports blog so much.
by pillsburysoldier on Oct 4, 2009 10:21 PM EDT up reply actions
(shot at bobby and those 'playstation all-american comments)
(just gotta make sure)
by pillsburysoldier on Oct 4, 2009 10:22 PM EDT up reply actions
Really?
I didn’t watch the games last year? How many backs did we use last year? 2 yeah and they ran it 35 times a game. This year we have 5 and we run the ball 20 maybe. If he was commited to the run Ponder wouldn’t have to throw it 40 times a game. Also if he was commited to the run he would use our two best backs which are Thomas and Jones and he would run them 40 times a game. He has no faith whatsoever in our running ability cause if he did we wouldn’t have called an option on 3’rd and goal from the inch line he would have had thomas or jones or our fullback or ponder pound it in. Last year Thomas ran for 460 yards this year he hardly has touched the ball. Against BYU jones ran for over 100. He didn’t even see the field saturday. If he was commited to the run then he would have only those two guys touch the ball and wouldn’t dick around with our freshmen. He has no confidence whatsover in either of those guys cause if he did they would be the only ones running the football
I'm confused
When we’re throwing for 400 yards, such as the case of Saturday, why do we need to run 40 times? We were taking what BC gave us with their fronts and coverages. The two games that we didn’t move the ball effectively were Jax State with two days of preparation and pouring rain, and USF when our offensive line was dominated by their defensive line. Not to mention the pregame speech debacle before USF, but that just further points to Bobby’s incompetence and jackassery.
>>---l>
Correct me if I'm wrong:
But, this year FSU has averaged 32 rushing plays per game and 36 passing plays per game.
In most games, we have been playing from behind, which necessitates the pass. So, Jimbo may not be committed to the run because he has no choice.
We would all like to see the running game improve and rush for ridiculous yards on every play. And yes, the balance has favored passing a little bit, but teams want to stop our running game. And as you mentioned earlier, coaches need to adjust to their teams strengths. Our line (minus the USF game) pass blocks well. Ponder throws well and can pick a part a zone. Almost 400 yds of offense per game is a pretty good showing in my book. Now, they need to finish drives to get the points they deserve.
Just the numbers. Say what you wish.
www.Tomahawknation.com
Correct me if I'm wrong...
We average 118 yards a game as a team this year. So if we run the ball 32 times a game thats 3.7 yards a rush. Thats terrible. The only reason we have nearly 400 yards a game is cause ponder throws for 300 a game. The run will set up the pass. Just like it did in the byu game and you saw what happened there
No.
Because they weren’t accomplished after first “establishing the run.”
You didn’t know that there is a .25 yard deduction for every pass yard that is gained without first establishing the run?
How dare Jimbo call plays that are working and stop calling plays that aren’t!!!!
They count alot.
But as you can see in the games we lost (other than the JSU game) ponder has thrown for close to and over 300 yards. Against BYU he threw for 195 and 2 td’s. We rushed for 313 yards in that game. Good teams win games when they can rush the football effectively. Alabama is averaging 223 yards a game on the ground. They are 5-0
No,
see you’re confusing causation with correlation.
Teams often rack up those yards when they have the lead and are putting the game away.
That strip is brilliant!!
I happen to love EFF Grapefruit.
Zach...as I live in Big 10 country, I share your appreciation for establishing the run.
Currently, if you look at the top ten teams as ranked by passing offense and the top ten teams ranked by rushing offense, there are 3 in the top 25 in the passing list and 4 in the rushing list.
Just the facts.
www.Tomahawknation.com
Well we will see soon enough won't we.
I really hope he is but I don’t see it. He lacks the leadership abilities but maybe when bobby goes and it’s his team things will change
CHRISTIAN PONDER!
Developed by Jimbo Fisher. Supported by Fisher all last year when people like you undoubtedly dogged him and protested for Drew.
Jimbo is not HC material. He seems like an A whole.
Laughable. Nice head coaches don’t win in situations like ours.
He never takes any blame on himself after a game. It’s always the players fault.
Totally untrue. He is the only one who sits down with reporters post-game and answers any and all questions.
I’m sorry but I grew up watching those teams from the 90’s play and yeah I may be spoiled becasue of it and a 2-3 season is unacceptable!
Yes, and that relates to Fisher how?
I want to be at the least competeing at the level to play in a BCS game every year. And with how soft our side the ACC is that really shouldn’t be that hard.
First, our side of the ACC hasn’t soft every year, and you’re just not realistic if you expect to be in a BCS game every year. It is not going to happen.
I say give fisher till manuel is gone and if he hasn’t made progress then he needs to leave
So until 2012? Okay, if he is the head coach…
Trivia Time
- Who captained the top offense in the conference last season?
- Who won Offensive Coordinator of the Year?
- Who developed the best QB since Weinke, standing by him even when everyone protested last season?
Those stats mean nothing.
That was last year. Whoopdy doo we won 9 games. Thats two more then the previous two seasons. And two of those wins came against d 1-aa teams. We are 2-3 this season with two straight games getting stuffed at the one yard line. When if we score in both of those situations then we probly win both games. The play calling was horrible, a reverse pass on a 2 point conversion that we needed. If reed hadn’t been an all state QB in high school then he has no idea what to do with the football in that situation. You can give me all the stats you want but until we start scoring in clutch situations then I’m not buying it. I agree that Ponder is the best since weinke and weatherford sucked. And you wanna know why we had the ACC’s top offense last year? We could actually run the ball
That was last year. Whoopdy doo we won 9 games. Thats two more then the previous two seasons. And two of those wins came against d 1-aa teams.
Lessons learned:
Only this year counts. Got it.
Guess what Zach, FSU was 5-3 in ACC play last year, which is much better than in previous seasons.
We are 2-3 this season with two straight games getting stuffed at the one yard line. When if we score in both of those situations then we probly win both games.
No, we wouldn’t have won BC. BC scored every time they tried. Read the story.
The play calling was horrible, a reverse pass on a 2 point conversion that we needed. If reed hadn’t been an all state QB in high school then he has no idea what to do with the football in that situation.
But he was. I doubt Fisher would call that in that situation with a wideout who couldn’t throw. What kind of logic is that?
You can give me all the stats you want but until we start scoring in clutch situations then I’m not buying it. I agree that Ponder is the best since weinke and weatherford sucked. And you wanna know why we had the ACC’s top offense last year? We could actually run the ball
Lesson 2: Passing yards don’t count.
Um
If we score on the inch line the game is tied and if hopkins hit’s that field goal we win
Not sarcastic
Do you honestly believe that the game would have gone exactly the same except for that score?
BC shut it down for over a quarter! Do you think they would have done that had we scored? Come on Zach, you’re smarter than that I hope.
Dude you thinking of going on tour. Your hilarious
Alright Mr. Literall. Lets say we score there. The game could go completely different. I should of chose my words more carefully. If we would have scored then we have some momentum and the game could have changed right then and there. I’m not saying we would have won. I’m just saying it would have helped us to have those points on the board.
ahhh "Mr. Literal"
How dare I assume that when you said “if we score in both of those situations then we probly (sic) win both games” you meant that if we had scored we would have won both those games. How foolish of me.
I love this site.
Hey guys I’m sorry if I came off like an ass. I’m just upset that fsu isn’t playing up to it’s potential. And in my opinion thats all coaching but like I said thats my opinion. I appreciate yall allowing me to chat on here because this is the only site I know of where we can let some steam off after a game. You guys are doing a good job. I love talking football and thats all you guys do.
What does fisher have to show for it?
An 5-3 record in the acc is better than previous years but what does he have to show for it. On the first saturday of december we were still at home watching the acc championship game. Until we start winning games then i’m not hopping on the fisher band wagon
Read the size matters articles
Part one and part two are linked on the right side of the homepage
>>---l>
Don’t give me the stats. The sacks were included.
What does this mean?
We also had two horrid running plays on obvious downs. Jimbo runs on 2 and 10 after an incomplete pass.
So that’s not a good idea? FSU happens to be very good at running on 2nd and 10 to get themselves into better down and distance for 3rd down.
He started the game with at least 5 consecutive passes. It was a consensus from everyone that Jones and Thomas are our top 2 backs. Quit playing the other guys and get these two involved in the game.
Jones had an issue, he played Thomas a bunch.
In conclusion, I really have trouble following your argument. I don’t think you know what you are talking about and I haven’t “scene” you put together a coherent thought.
I apologize for the “scene” typo.
In response, everyone keeps pointing to our rushing stats against USF that include a ton of sacks. The good drives we put together mixed the run and the pass.
How many carries did Thomas and Jones have combined Saturday?
I know you are some sort of an “insider” but Jones had an issue?
What games has FSU been good on 2nd and long funning?
We are throwing in excess of 65% of our plays this year. Is that good?
Is 7 points against USF, 14 against J-State and 6 through 3 quarters acceptable to you?
My argument is the offense is just as bad as the defense. The fans on the boards are giving our offense a pass. I am on the defense just as much as the offense. However, it is hard for me to believe that you are happy with our offense output, playcalling or execution. If you are truly happy with those then we can agree to disagree. The entire team and coaching staff is to blame for our start.
To reply to your question: What games has FSU been good on 2nd and long running?
In their 4 games, FSU has had 52 plays that have been defined as second and long. They have run on 22 of those plays or 42% of the total.
FSU has had 8 plays of 9+ yards out of the 22.
5 plays of 5-6 yards.
5 plays for 1-3 yards
4 plays for 0 or less.
By those numbers on 13 out of 22 plays, FSU has been successful running the ball on 2nd and long. 60% of the time they have gained 5 or more yards on 2nd and long running the ball. They averaged 10 yards per play on those 11 plays.
During each game, only one play per game has gone for 0 yards or less on second down and long.
Just the stats. Just here to provide you the information to make your opinions.
www.Tomahawknation.com
Another correction:
During each game, only one play per game has gone for 0 yards or less on second down and long.
should say on “second down and long when FSU runs the ball.”
www.Tomahawknation.com
So as much as I would love to go through a game by game analysis looking at our offense...I don't have the time to do so.
Am I satisfied with our offense so far this year? No. They haven’t been able to finish. Do I think the offense is better than it has been? Absolutely.
To date, the Noles have put up 404, 402, 512, 288 and 411 yards respectively in each game. Now, total yardage is not an automatic marker of success. However, we can move the ball. Look at the drive charts for each game. We have multiple 50+ drives per game. We just can’t get the ball across the end zone.
Was I pissed that in two games we couldn’t punch the ball in from the one? Absolutely. But, I think there was more to that play calling than any of us think, meaning Bobby got on the head set and said run this play. No, wait run this play. Granted, that is total speculation and just my opinion on it.
Could our run game be better? Absolutely. I think every team in the country wants it’s running game to be better. Could we do a better job up front run blocking? Absolutely. This line has yet to reach it’s potential. Jimbo hasn’t had the chance to run his full offense yet. Having a bunch of sophomores on the team limits your ability to play call. They are still developing. Do I expect more from our offense? Of course. They have to finish drives. They have to hang on to the ball.
Do I think that FSUn is giving the offense a pass? No. But compared to where it has been, this offense is much improved. Have their been missed opportunities? Absolutely.
However, the offense isn’t responsible for giving up the yardage and big plays that our defense has. While FSU’s offense numbers, strictly based on total yardage which I know is a poor marker, the defense has given up: 476, 310, 475, 368 and 399 yards per game.
This team has significant deficiencies on both sides of the ball. What is the common denominator? The head coach. Leadership, recruiting, discipline, motivation, direction starts at the top and trickles down through the department. The players sense the tension between the coaching staff; they see it on a regular basis. They are not immune to the politics that occurs at the level of the administration and coaching staff.
Am I satisfied with this team? No. Was I expecting to be going into this year no? Am I going to wear my garnett and gold? Of course. Would I wear a black t-shirt to a game? Of course. Do I think the people who ‘moderate’ this board/blog/website/analysis whatever you want to call it how it is? Yes. From day one of me joining this site, FSUn has provided the data, though process and logical arguments to demonstrate the positives and negatives of this team. He has rewarded the success stories and questioned the problems with articulate analysis on a regular basis. There is a ton to learn on this site, not only about FSU but football in general.
www.Tomahawknation.com
by TrueCubbie on Oct 4, 2009 8:49 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
I really couldn't have said it any better.
I would like to add that I think the offense is infected with the same lack of leadership and and accountability as a result of not having a head coach that the defense is. The difference is that at least the offense appears to be well-coached for the most part, while the defense is infected and poorly coached by the position coaches, most notably Amato and Allen.
Concerning Allen
The idea of him coaching for us is already nauseating, but on top of that at all his D-1/FBs or semi-pro jobs he has coached offense. Why did BB think he was a stellar DE coach? Imagine if Mickey was actually allowed to pick the position coaches. Or had input.
Coaching Stops:
1983 Marion Military Institute (offensive line)
1984-85 Alabama (graduate assistant)
1986 Alabama (receivers)
1987-89 Ole Miss (receivers)
1990-91 Ole Miss (running backs)
1992 Arkansas State (receivers)
1993 Arkansas State (offensive coordinator/quarterbacks)
1994 B.C. Lions (CFL) (receivers/special teams coordinator)
1995 Shreveport Pirates (CFL) (receivers/special teams coordinator)
1997 Murray State (receivers)
1998 Griffin (GA) High School (offensive coordinator)
1999 Valdosta State (receivers)
2000-01 Florida State (graduate assistant)
2002-2009Florida State (defensive ends)
!!!2010- Let go by JF
Coley
Can you or someone on the staff put together an article on Coley, based on his OC job at FIU, and show us why he will be a better OC than Jimbo? Does he bring more discipline, creativity, explosiveness, combination?
I hope he brings a lot of togetherness
I’m sure it will be done upon his announcement as OC. Which hopefully will be soon. Fingers crossed.
>>---l>
I should make one caveat to my first comment:
So as much as I would love to go through a game by game analysis looking at our offense…I don’t have the time to do so.
FSUn does this every single week. So there is no excuse not to know the numbers. It’s all here on this site. Just need to look for it.
www.Tomahawknation.com
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