Flex Your Knowledge on Georgia Tech's Flexbone
by Bud Elliott on Oct 8, 2009 3:37 PM EDT
in FSU Football
69 comments
As you probably know, Georgia Tech coach Paul Johnson installed a great offense known as the Flexbone. It's a little wishbone, a little spread, and a little run and shoot. And Johnson runs it very well.
After last year's 31-28 loss, I wrote this:
31 Points, 0 Turnovers, & 321 yards on 39 Plays.
8.2 yards per play. Up until GT's QB left the game, that's what they had done. 8.2 yards per play. I don't need to say anything more. 8.2 yards per play. Mickey's unit was ill-prepared. 8.2 yards per play. They played like garbage. 8.2 yards per play.
Some people are going to say that the Noles finally started to make adjustments. 8.2 yards per play. That is pure B.S. 8.2 yards per play. Do not buy that for a second. 8.2 yards per play. The Seminole defense didn't adjust to anything, rather Georgia Tech's QB rolled his own ankle. 8.2 yards per play. That is pathetic.
In a game that the defense was being counted on to carry the day, they were non-existent. Bad assignment football, strange formations with the 2 DT's, and poor angles meant 8.2 yards per play. In the back of every knowledgeable FSU fan's mind, we knew there was a chance that the defense could lay an egg against a team of this design. I dismissed that, telling myself that was silly, that Mickey wouldn't prepare these guys in a way that would allow such egg-laying, and that playing a running QB for the 3rd consecutive week would increase our familiarity. I was so very very wrong.
Perhaps this handy chart will help you understand just how much Florida State didn't stop Tech's offense:
FULL SCREEN VERSION
It was one of the worst performances that FSU's defense has had in a long time. Don't fool yourself. FSU never stopped them. GTech's QB rolled his own ankle and then their offense sputtered. The game should have been a blowout.
Inside, you'll find why Tech's offense owned FSU
I've talked to a few guys who run this offense and they all agree: it's not just about playing assignment football, and you cannot play man-coverage. So FSU is screwed Saturday because they will either to play man-coverage, which is dumb, or try to play zone coverage, which they don't do well.
Start here http://www.sundaymorningqb.com/2008/4/2/12521/45441 It's a nice summary of the outside veer, inside veer, and midline option. Nice diagrams and videos.
Here's some chat from a few GTech fans. http://www.stingtalk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=212407 Probably worth a read.
This one may be my favorite: http://clempsonfootball.blogspot.com/2009/06/gt-defensing-flexbone-basics.html He does a nice job showing the variation between the plays and explains the why in terms of when Johnson will call for each play.
This one is excellent as well: http://thebirddog.wordpress.com/2009/06/28/other-peoples-rivalries-and-the-futility-of-defending-against-the-wishbone/ Shows how Tech destroyed the Georgia Bulldogs last year and some clips of Johnson when he was at Navy.
And this one, gets hyper specific with a ton of video showing the variations: http://bluegraysky.blogspot.com/2007_11_01_archive.html#3764758266899916666
Can you make it through them all? If you can, awesome, but there's more:
Here's how Johnson switches up his blocking schemes mid-quarter, with great success http://bluegraysky.blogspot.com/2007_11_01_archive.html#3764758266899916666 (why you can't just play assignment football, which is undoubtedly what FSU will try to do and they will get torched.)
Finally, Tech's offense struggled a bit early in the season http://smartfootball.com/option/whats-wrong-with-georgia-techs-run-game-is-anything Chris goes over why. I'd add that they faced some amazing defensive tackle tandems. Florida State doesn't have a single defensive lineman who would start for Miami, North Carolina, or Clemson. I'm not sure Chris accounts for that, he's not much of an NFL draft nerd.
Hope you enjoy.
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what a stupid comment
unless you cheat, if you get more points than the other guys you deserve to win the game, period.
He's referring to the fact that if it weren't for a freak accident
We would have lost by 3 touchdowns or thereabouts
>>---l>
it's a TEAM sport
getting hurt is a regular part of the game. Our QB somehow managed to avoid having a ‘freak accident’, didn’t he? So we won that matchup. Our leader managed to finish the game and we would have won game, would have DESERVED to win the game if we hadn’t fumbled the ball at way at the last second.
That’s all part of the game of football my friend. You lose your starting QB, you fumble on the goal line, your cornerback gets beat by 15 yards yet again. As a team you have to overcome all that, your backups have to be ready too. If college ball, if your backups aren’t as good as your starters, then your TEAM is not as strong as you think it is.
If FSU had the theoretical benefit of all of our best guys being able to play in every game over the last 5 years, you can bet our record would have been noticeably better…of course our constant parade of injured players was actually due to a staff weakness (pre-Stroud lack of injury-prevention strength-conditioning), but my point is still valid.
Unfortunately your best players don’t always get to finish the game and the rest of the TEAM has to step it up.
The only reason we didn’t deserve to win that game is because our offense didn’t execute when they had the chance to win the game. You can say the defense allowed too many points, but the fact is, when you have a chance to win the game, you have to take it and there are no excuses. Sometimes it’s the defense and sometimes it’s the offense, but when you have that chance, it doesn’t matter what has happened the rest of the game, it doesn’t matter who’s hurt, it doesn’t matter what your coach is yelling at you from the sidelines, you’ve got to play the game and take advantage of those opportunities.
Please research where we've discussed this 10,000 times already
Sims should’ve scored. That’s an independent event from “we should’ve won.” We were outplayed up and down the field. Read up on it, and all your questions will be answered.
>>---l>
?
Do see a question in my statement? Really, do you see….a…..question? There is no question.
Have you learned nothing in your “10,000 discussions”? Do you really not understand this basic foundational concept of the game, that the team with the most points on the board at the end of the game deserves the win?
I don’t know of any football league, at any level, even pee wee football, where you can win a game because you ‘deserve’ it. It’s simple. You win games by having more points than the other guys at the end. Period. And no, amount of ‘research’ into your previous postings would change that fact. Again, it’s a basic foundational concept of the game.
It’s always funny to me when someone spouts this crap about ‘deserving to lose’ when we win a game. When people say stuff like that it’s usually because they WANT to lose so that some negative opinion they have about the program will be validated. They want to lose because they are embarrassed by the personality of our team which is maddeningly inconsistent and rarely plays up to its potential, in wins or losses. I understand the feeling, but it doesn’t justify stupid statements, like saying you’re glad we didn’t score at the end of the Tech game because we didn’t deserve to. That’s just ignorant.
Wait a minute! Wait a minute! Did you seriously suggest I ‘research’ your previous postings? Ha! I hate to tell you this guy, but if you’ve had “10,000 discussions” on this subject and still can’t understand this basic principle of football then perhaps your towering intellect, of which you are so clearly enamored (did you really tell me to ‘research’ our discussions?), has a few chinks in it here and there. Buck up, buddy. If you’re going to act like you’re smarter than everyone else, you’ve got to produce the smarts.
got
carried away with the research thing :) the point is that the players are out on the field, fighting, not giving up, maybe making some boneheaded plays, maybe playing uninspired football at times…but if they don’t give up, if they fight through it and somehow manage to put more points on the board than the other guys, they deserve the win.
I never said nor implied I was smarter you
I never said to research my posts, I asked if you could please research our discussions because we have talked about it so extensively. I didn’t think that was an unreasonable request for a new site member. Since you won’t do that, I’ll explain what chb03c was referring to. The basic premise is, Georgia Tech was gaining 8.2 yards/play before Nesbitt went down, which was through nothing we did. Total and complete unfounded accident. On that day, their best 22 against our best 22 means they win handily. We were not the better team on the field on that day. That’s what he means by “deserving to win.” It would have been an absolute steal to come away with a win in that game. I’m sorry you feel that I offended you and/or don’t understand football.
>>---l>
Who said
I was offended? I wasn’t.
What makes you think I’m ‘new’? I’ve been reading this site a long time, and nothing that has been written here has any bearing whatsoever on what I said above about which team deserves to win a game.
When you get into ‘their best vs. our best’ you’ve left reality and entered the realm of fantasy football. IF their QB hadn’t gone down, then MAYBE we wouldn’t have come back. IF our coach was still in control of his staff, then MAYBE our team wouldn’t be so inconsistent. If we still had Myron Rolle in the backfield, MAYBE our secondary wouldn’t be getting burnt repeatedly. This may be a fun game to play in your imagination, but it’s got very little if anything to do with actual football.
You said that I thought I was smarter than you and said I don’t know football. Sounded defensive to me. I’m just explaining a point of view. There’s nothing to make anyone believe we would’ve slowed down GT had Nesbitt not gotten injured. There were no adjustments. You may not believe in anyone deserving to win, and that’s fine. We observe process vs. result here, not just result alone.
>>---l>
I have a problem with one thing that is generally accepted around here
“complete and total accident; through nothing we did”
I re-watched the GT game from last year a few weeks ago, and it appeared to me that Nebitt was injured on a QB keep triple option to the left side for a gain of about 6, and was tackled low. Regardless injuries are a part of the game, especially when you run an offense that allows your QB to be hit as often as that one. The rest I agree with.
www.fsufishing.com
Yeah I'm trying to remember the thread where this whole argument was
I don’t really like the term “deserve to win” because it’s so subjective. I’d prefer to talk about who the better team was on that day. Injuries are definitely part of the game, but when it takes a minor miracle to even be within striking distance of your opponent, I don’t find myself being as upset about a loss.
>>---l>
We are in serious trouble against Tech
The best way to beat them is with ball control and good special teams. I do not trust our defense to scheme against them.
Maybe our offense has a chance to keep their Offense from the field
Our offense has done a great job(IMO) of sustaining long, clock eating drives. Plus the GT defense has not really showed me that they can stop anyone with a half decent offense. I think that if we control the ball and time of possesion in this game GT might not be able to put points on the board.
by UnstopaNole99! on Oct 9, 2009 9:26 AM EDT up reply actions
People often forget that we actually have a better pass D than run D
They will be reminded on Saturday
>>---l>
Yeah this game is scary
Paul Johnson is a master at reading defenses and adjusting plays. To defend the triple option you must have sound fundamentals and discipline of which we have neither. I expect GT to run all over us, but hopefully we can keep it close. If not it will be another long Saturday.
I expect them to get at least 440 yards and 5 touchdowns
At a minimum. But I could honestly see 60+ pts
can you please be wrong for once..ha.
On second thought, maybe that will only enforce the need for bobby to retire!!!
by noles 4 life u dig? on Oct 8, 2009 3:59 PM EDT up reply actions
I know many want BB out at all costs, but if there were major changes in coaching staff and Fisher had full control I would settle and let BB roam the sidelines.
happy to down 1 coach and out 2.5 million?
by The K-Man on Oct 8, 2009 4:39 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
If the boosters are okay with it who am I to question them? Aren’t we basically down one coach now? Maybe get a GA to help out. Just thinking of a compromise.
Please, feel free to question the boosters whenever
They are by no means the be all end all of athletic knowledge
>>---l>
I agree it could get ugly
especially if our running game doesn’t come around. You also need to control the ball and keep them off the field. If we can’t run the ball then we need to throw short passes and eat as much clock as possible. GT also has had some problems this year with it’s discipline running the triple option. Hopefully that will show up again as well. OK back to my Kool-Aid.
"You also need to control the ball and keep them off the field. If we can’t run the ball then we need to throw short passes and eat as much clock as possible."
I’m glad you mentioned this because people – you know who – have also failed to realize that Jimbo has had to do this EVERY GAME. Think back to BYU: Ever tried to score 40+ points AND hold the ball for 40+ minutes? What Jimbo has to accomplish to be successful with this offense is insane.
Bud, what you’re saying is that if our DEs play disciplined and our interior D line can get off blocks and stop the dive, and then our linebackers keep their assignments we’ll be in good shape? If that doesn’t sound like our D then I don’t know what does.
by Brandon B on Oct 8, 2009 4:14 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Pretty sure everyone could figure this out
but it seems like we’ve had a giant influx of new readers (or posters, at least) lately.
THIS IS SARCASM. An extreme case, to be sure….
by PBD on Oct 8, 2009 8:26 PM EDT up reply actions
well I know we can't tackle, so you may be right
and we could have a big problem.
by UnstopaNole99! on Oct 9, 2009 9:27 AM EDT up reply actions
Wow
With all this info you’d think that there would be time enough for MA and co. to study, prepare and practice.
Ah, screw it. W/O beast DTs its going to have to be Nole ball control all nite.
"I got a PBS mind in an MTV world"...Jimmy Buffett
by The Ryno and I Know on Oct 8, 2009 4:06 PM EDT reply actions
The good news is
all it takes is some discipline from the defense…oh, wait… we’re dead. Nevermind.
Inside, you’ll find why Tech’s offense owned FSU
I swear when I clicked on this story I expected to see a picture of Bud Thacker laying on the ground.
what's the over/under?
at work, can’t check it….i’m thinking over….
From the ClemPson article
The key to defending the veer here is the dive…if the DE gets sucked in or if your DT’s lose ground, you may as well pack your shit up and go home, cause you are going to give up 10 yards.
That pretty much sums up why we’re screwed….
Take the over
Gt’s defense is horrible. They have 3 guys that are good and the rest are terrible. Expect them also to light up the board on us. I expect a shoot out.
queue Yosemite Sam sound effects.....
by The K-Man on Oct 8, 2009 4:43 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I think if both of our DT crash down hard on the center......HAHAHAHAHAHA... I can't even finish it.
>-----:----:------>Spear 'em then Scalp 'em
I have FOUND the answer - 11 men in the box. Wait, don't we do that now?
Reading my posts is a priviledge and I will ban anyone who disgarees with me from the Internet for life.
If you read this can you ask them ...
I believe that Nesbitt has regressed in the passing game. Do you believe that statement to be true or false and why? Thanks for this exchange of opinions.
I want to feel
Like FSU can pull this one out but it would have to be something like this:
FSU 63
GT 56
GT running back gets his cleats stuck in Thacker’s chest which thwarts game winning TD chance for the Jackets as time expires.
"No, like I said, Woo peed on my rug" - The Dude
by Surfanole on Oct 8, 2009 6:45 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
ha ha
you guys are a blast! After having all day to worry about it, FSU comes out fired up and wins this game by at least a touchdown. GaTech is not the smooth-oiled machine they were last year and our offense is due a BYU-type game. The defense will give up lots of yardage, but fewer big plays than in recent games and Reid or someone will make at least one or two bigs themselves.
FSU can win
But its going to take a solid game from the offense and special teams. I don’t expect the defense to shut down GT because they have not really shut anyone down besides maybe Jax St. but if they can just keep it under control for the offense the noles have good chance to pull this one out. I don’t know if I will stick with my 63-56 prediction though.
"No, like I said, Woo peed on my rug" - The Dude
i think 41-38 is closer than 63-56...
though i actually won’t be shocked to see something like 38-31
Which FSU team will show up??
I think that if the FSU team that played against Miami or BYU shows up we have a good chance for a win. But thats just it we dont know which team will be there Sat. I know that Miami went up and down the field on us but the offence kept us close and should have one the game. Hopefully we will show up to play good Football and have a break out game of sorts. And I Agree with you’re 38-31 score.
I dont know what to expect from our guys.
However, I am fairly confident that Tech will run up and down the field on us. Our offense will have to keep up with their scoring.
I actually
kind of hope we can’t stop their offense, because I’d love to see Ponder and co. airing it out in a shootout, kind of like the Miami game but with more big plays from our guys and with us coming out on top of course.
I think we win
49-45
CP7 and the offense better be ready or we have ZERO hope of winning this game
2009 Rays Baseball: Welp.....we'll try again in 2010
2009 FSU Football: Bobby Bowden.........it's time to go
Be a TRUE Seminole: http://www.seminoles.com/sports/m-footbl/spec-rel/071509aab.html
Nesbitt regressed?
Nesbitt looked awful passing against Miami, but overall he has improved. If he had enough passes to qualify (He has 13 attempts per game, 15 is minimum), he would be 25th in the nation in pass efficiency. Not great, but a big improvement over last year.
GT is #1 in the nation in passing yards per attempt at 11.4. ND is 2nd at 9.9. Im sure you all know it, but FSU is the only defense giving up more than 10 yards per pass attempt.
Im so going to have a great time watching this game
If we win that would rock because I want FSU to win. If we lose I want to know what the drama will be next week. The only thing I hope for is that our Offense shows up. I want them to own GT Def. We dont have to win but putting up 300+ yards will help show Jimbo is going in the right direction even though the Def isnt. I see us sending 7 every play and droping 2 deep and 2 in the mid The D-line should pinch every play and not tackle but stop up the hole so the RB have to bounce outside where our LB can use there speed.
Why is the sky blue? Because, God Loves the Infantry
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