FSU's new DC Mark Stoops recruiting history
by DA-2 on Dec 14, 2009 1:19 AM EST
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PrintWritten by and Credit goes to: Aussierat.
I spent two years at University of Arizona in grad school ('05-'07). I have a cousin with a son who played high school football in Tucson so some of this comes from conversations with his family as well as articles I read at the time. I am by no means an expert on AZ football and hope that if I misrepresent something here, a better-informed person can contribute/correct me.
It goes without saying that high school football in the University of Arizona's backyard is much different than in Florida State's, but I want to reiterate the point with some details:
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Tucson's high school system is divided into districts. Within a district, students can choose which school they want to attend. I'm not certain if this applies to the rest of the state, but I'm pretty sure it does. Kids that want to play football will go to the school in their district that fields the best football teams. The majority of good football players in Tucson come out of two schools - Ironwood in Oro Valley and Salpointe Catholic in Tucson. If a kid is an athlete in multiple sports, but prefers other sports to football (i.e. football is secondary), he may choose a high school with a better basketball or baseball program, thus shying away from the school with the best football coaches in his district.
- The culture in Arizona is very different as well. Football isn't a part of life like it is in Florida. My cousin was raised in Fort Walton Beach, where I am from, and attests to this. In Tucson, it is viewed differently and is often a secondary sport. UA is a huge basketball and baseball school. Football is 2nd or 3rd in the eyes of the student body and local high school kids.
- Another area of difficulty for UA coaches is that if high school football players want to stay in state, they have two campuses to choose from - ASU, which is in the heart of Phoenix, or UA, which is in the heart of Tucson. I love Tucson - it lies in the middle of some of the most beautiful country in the US and there's a Route 66 appeal to the local culture. But I think there's way more to sell a high school kid at ASU. Phoenix is a metropolitan area and just has a lot more to offer.
- Even though ASU is probably more desirable, neither school competes when universities further west come in, dazzle Arizona's few elite high school football players, and pluck them away. Arizona's best football players go to other Pac-10 schools with better programs, facilities, coaches, etc.
We've discussed the culture they are recruiting from. Now let's look at the numbers.
I used rivals data to put together the table below. From left to right, you're looking at the top ranked players coming out of Arizona according to Rivals, the number of these players from Tucson, the number from Tucson that chose UA, and the number of top ranked players that went to the two in-state schools. From top to bottom you're looking at two time periods, the total from 2004-2009 and the total from 2006-2009, when ratings for all of the state's top prospects were included in the online data, as well as the distribution of player ratings during the 06-09 period.
Key Takeaways:
- Rivals reports 15 to 25 top players in Arizona every year (mostly 3* and higher, with a few 2-stars possibly showing up on the lower end of each class). This is a very small group of kids that project to play in D-1. In Florida, roughly 50-60 kids a year would grade out among the five best prospects in Arizona.
- Assuming the top players in AZ are all D-1 caliber, only 10-12 percent of these players are from Tucson/Oro Valley, UA's immediate backyard. There have been no classes with more than 3 players from the Tucson area in the top 15-25. Remember that Arizona really only has three major cities (Phoenix, Flagstaff, and Tucson) - the majority of Arizona's decent football players are coming from the Phoenix area. ASU has an automatic lead in this area.
- Of this 10-12 percent, UA has been able to pull less than half (43-44%) of the kids. In other words, they have less than 50 percent success recruiting kids within a 20 mile radius of campus.
- In the past 5 years, the state of Arizona has only produced 3 5-Star recruits. Although one of these was from Tucson, all three of these went to USC. For comparison, Florida has produced 16 in the last 5 years.
- In the same time period, the state produced 15 4-Star recruits (Florida? 183). Only one was from Tucson and did go to UA. However, that was the only one of the 15 that went to UA. In other words, Arizona has only had 7 percent success recruiting in-state four-stars, assuming they would want all of them. ASU had much better success and landed 6 of these. Other 4-stars went to Nebraska (2),North Carolina, Oregon, Cal, Colorado (2), and Michigan (2).
- Depending on which years you use, only 40-42 percent of the top rated players in Arizona chose to stay in Arizona and attend UA or ASU. This could be skewed downward slightly as some of the top players project as 2-stars and neither school may have been interested. Even so, only 47 percent of 4-stars and 44 percent of 3-stars stayed in state.
Clearly this is a very tough area to have a major D-1 football team. Arizona has less than 10 percent of Florida's talent at 4-star or higher, and despite two in-state schools to split this small player base, their talent is poached by PAC-10 and Big 12 schools. To compound matters, UA's in-state rivals are situated in the middle of the state's most concentrated group of recruits (Phoenix area) and thus pull roughly double the in-state talent than UA.
Now let's look at Arizona's recent recruiting classes. What types of players do they get? This includes recruiting classes from 2004 to 2009.
Takeaways:
- They have recruited slightly better talent on the defensive side of the ball. This remains true even if you expect that most of their ATH recruits would end up on the offensive side of the ball. This is probably expected with defensive minded coaches named Stoops at HC and DC positions.
- They only got one 5-star player over the entire period. For comparison, FSU had 10 in the same timeframe.
- 55 percent of recruits are 3-stars and just under 20 percent project as 4-stars. Under Stoops, these numbers have improved slightly. 64 percent of their class was 2* or less in 2004, and this has declined to about 25 percent the last two classes (meaning 3 and 4 star recruits climbed from 36% of the class in 2004 to roughly 75 percent in the last two classes). In 2006 they landed a stellar class (for them) with one 5-star and 6 4-stars. This class was roughly in league with FSU's (unheralded) worst recruiting year of the decade in 2007.
Finally, where do they get players from? Again this includes recruiting classes from 2004 to 2009.
Takeaways:
- UA gets much fewer players from its own state than it does California and Texas. These states have huge player bases and Arizona is competing with both major schools and lower tier D-1 schools (e.g. Fresno State) for these recruits. Big local schools like Texas, Texas Tech, USC, Cal, and UCLA often get first pick/interest from the major players in their respective states. It appears that UA coaches are occasionally able to lure a solid player or two away from these schools. But it is just as hard recruiting these states as it is recruiting down the street, and in both cases against the same competition.
- Arizona gets the large majority of its 4-star players from California. This is partially because there are so few 4-stars in Arizona.
Now let's compare these results to Florida State (you know, for kicks).
The takeaways from this are pretty obvious.
I gave you all of that to lead you to this point: athletic kids in
Now look at Stoop’s defensive numbers (go to Football Outsiders for this). I think they are quite good considering the talent he has to work with.
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Let me do some math here.
So basically, if my calculations are correct, carry the 1, calculate the variables, account for curvature of the Earth….
FSU + Stoops = Good.
Modified Equation
Hopefully, if things work out correctly
FSU+Stoops > 6-6 which should be ~ ACC championship
We'll have to see how he does
when he actaully has talent. One of the things I’m afraid of is that we’re expecting since he can do decent work with so so to decent talent, therefore he can do great things with the better talent we get at FSU.
However, the types of kids, their motivations and egos may be different when they’re the 4* 5* kind. It may be that it’s easier to mold the 2 and 3 stars with the ole “there’s no I in team” mentality than what we have here.
Either way, time will tell if he can leverage what resources and recruits FSU has. Can’t be worse than this year!
Think that's where
his position coach abilities come in. He’s dealt with these types of kids before, it’s just in a larger capacity (more management, less 1 on 1).
I expect him to produce the same top 30 defenses in Tally that he produced in Tucson.
I expect to have very good secondaries like he had in Miami.
There is no reason to expect, and want, otherwise.
Great stuff
I’m not too worried about his recruiting skills. I think with Coley, Fisher, and Gran FSU will be alright. However, I am certain that Stoops wont be a recruiting dud. Any kids he helps pull from South Florida will just be icing on the cake. From what I have read he is a high energy guy which will mesh well with the coaching team Fisher has put together. I just hope he can coach. I know recruiting is important but I honestly hope that his pure teaching skills are better than his recruiting skills. I would have been ecstatic with a top 25 D this past year. I would be surprised if Stoops isn’t at LEAST that productive in Tallahassee.
Not an alcoholic, just an FSU grad.
Great write-up, and very insightful about the recruting conditions at 'Zona, but I still have some concerns
I’ll paste some of what I just posted in another article. One thing that bothers me and was some what suprising was how inactive he seems to be in recruting for such a young guy. I looked back a some of the recruting classes and stories of the recruits during his Miami years because I remember when he coached their and was surprised I didn’t see his name brought up more by the recruits.
When I originaly thought back I thought he was a far more involved in recruiting than he apparently was looking at old articles and recruting stories from the years he was at UM. My memory of his past recruting prowess probably got a little inflated by him stealing away two heavy Nole leans I was big fans of one year (Willie Cooper & Jon Beason) those two guys loved him, but outside of them I don’t recall and haven’t read about any big gets that he recruited that weren’t already big ’Cane’s fans. Maybe it was because he was younger and they had more expierence guys do the heavy lifting so he had a smaller pool of kids to recruit than others or it was some other factors I haven’t considered yet but it did come as a suprise to me.
Not to keep harping on his recruting but looking back at his stint in Arizona it’s a bit dissapointing to see his or his school’s lack of success in recruting or even getting the “Big Name” recruits from his state to even seriously consider ‘Zona. Back in the ’07 recruiting cycle Everson Griffen was tabbed the #1 recruit in the nation and the home state school couldn’t even get a visit. And then in last year’s recruting cycle what seemed to be an unusualy good year in the state for “Big Name” players you had 2 top 10 DE’s (Devon Kennard & Craig Roh) and a top 10 DT (Corey Adams) in the state and none of them even gave Arizona an offical despite the excitment in the caused by a winning record for the first time since 1998. Guys like Zook and Brewster seem to at least get the best guys in state on their campus for visits despite their records and sign a fair amount of them also, so I’m a bit leery but hopefuly my concerns will be unfounded.
Ron Zook and Tim Brewster are also head coaches.
Mark Stoops is a defensive coordinator. I understand your point, but it’s not fair to compare a head coach to a defensive coordinator.
SCALP 'EM SEMINOLES!
Brewster
“Guys like Zook and Brewster seem to at least get the best guys in state on their campus for visits despite their records and sign a fair amount of them also, so I’m a bit leery but hopefuly my concerns will be unfounded.”
You can compare him to the likes of Brewster because before he was a head coach he was a recruiting monster elsewhere. He’s extremely program positive, gets recruits excited to play, and can charm the pants off Nixon… and has been at every position he’s coached at. He has been a recruiting wiz during his entire college coaching career. He was crucial in bringing Vince Young to Texas.
He’s still struggling keeping all the MN in-state studs from going to Notre Dame, OSU, USC… I’m a gopher fan as well as a nole, and the man can bring in the talent; it’s keeping it there and out of trouble, as well as playing the right players being the program’s main problem. Next year should be interesting with Marquis Gray hopefully winning the QB job.
yeah that's a fair point and it's not a perfect example,
But they were defensive recruits and he’s a defensive cordinator so I’d assume he would have a big role in their recrument. It’s definately harder to gage how much impact a cordinator has on a recruit versus a head coach. I could use a guy like Mike Lockley when he was as Illi but Zook is know as such a effective recruiter that it would suprise me if he didn’t have a big impact on most of the top kids that programed signed while Lockley was there even if he wasn’t there primary recruiter. That’s why I didn’t mentioned the “Big Name” guys Arizona has lost out on from their state on offense. I guess the main point I was trying to Illustrate was that it seems like the big time recruiters usualy get in on guys instate even when they are at a school who’s not known for keeping instate stars home.
Different dynamic.
AZU doesn’t have the history or the initial interest by a lot of instate prospects that FSU has. He’s only been in AZ a couple of years. You’d expect a recruiter’s relationships with HS coaches to improve over time and with success on the field. Stoops has had success on the field in Miami and he can ride the coattails of the relationships with the So. Fla. HS coaches that Coley and Gran have established.
All of your coaches don’t have to be recruiting studs to build a great team. Each has different gifts. If the only thing Coley can coach is TEs and he is mediocre at that, he’s still a valuable coach due to his recruiting prowess. On the other hand, Trickett is known for his coaching ability, not necessarily his recruiting prowess. So he is still a valuable piece of the puzzle for his coaching ability.
My concern is how much of AZU’s D is Mike’s and how much is Mark’s. Mark is a proven position coach, so our DBs should be taken care of. My hunch is that Mark can also get the job done at DC. It’s just somewhat obscured when the HC is a family member. All in all, I think we’ll be fine.
Way off base and flat wrong IMO
If the only thing Coley can coach is TEs and he is mediocre at that
Coley is currently coaching TEs because we needed him on staff and that was the only place we could put him. His experience is with QBs and his offense put up some decent numbers at FIU.
In NoleLaw's defense ...
I am not sure he was saying he thinks Coley is a bad coach. I think what he was trying to say was that IF Coley were not a great coach, he would still be worth having on staff because of his recruiting ability.
Key word was "IF"
It was a hypothetical to make a point. I wasn’t suggesting that Coley sucks. Merely suggesting that we’d keep him EVEN IF he was a mediocre TE coach. If it came across a different way, sorry about that. I agree with you that Coley is good for more than just recruiting.
Fisher would not make Coley our next OC if he was only a mediocre TE coach
It's a beautiful day in Tallahassee
I thought about this as well...
none of them even gave Arizona an offical
Couldn’t get much information on actual recruiting practices from the other SB blog. I also didn’t have time to go recruit by recruit and look at who they considered, or do state-by-state comparisons to look at other states with small talent bases that get “poached” by nearby out-of-state programs (A point moojenowski makes). Both of these might have been useful explorations and as such, this is a reasonable concern. However, I think it goes back to the culture at Arizona and the fact the the schools to play football at on the west coast are in California. I suspect USC was all over these kids from the start.
If he’s just an OK recruiter and not a great recruiter, he’s about to be surrounded by them. Let’s hope it rubs off.
yeah I'm by no means predicting him to be a bad recruter or anything
I was just suprised given his age and a the name “Stoops” I would have thought some of those defensive star recruits would have gave them more of a look. But as you stated in your piece there’s are alot of differnts factors one has to consider in a place like Tuscon.
Regardless the one thing we know for sure is this guy can coach DB’s and we have 2 STUD cb’s and a safety i’m very hopeful will explode under his watch (Harley) The rest of it i’ll remain optomistic about and defer to a guy I have no reservations about (Jimbo Fisher) Fisher just seems like to much of a perfectionist to make a hire that not well thought weighing the pluses and minises of coach he’s bringing on staff.
Airzona recruiting hasn't been THAT bad they had a 28 and 22 ranked class two of his 4 years therer.
and you can see what he’s up against in the article above. Makes those stats very livable.
I think he was at UM all of 2 years…how many stories with his name in it did you expect to read?
He has fielded a top 30 D on average with this years being top 20. not bad….AT ALL
I think if he can do as well with much better talent then you will see at leas top 20 D’s consistently and possibly top 10. Considereing our offense that’s good enough to eventually pound the ACC and compete for national titles every once in a while too!
Yeah, right!
I don't want it to sound like I'm knocking Stoops or anything
Zona hadn’t had a winning season since like what ‘98? when they got their so it’s not like they were working in optimal recruting conditons I get that. But I just like to give a honest assesment of what I think might be a coaches potential strengths and weakness or at least area’s where they might not seems as strong as others. But I’m most definately not predicing his to be a failure or a bad hire.
As far as his years at UM, honestly I did think I would have heard his name more. But one thing I didn’t consider when I posted that but now reflecting on it I should have was that UM was signing an insanely high percentage of kids it brought in for officials at that time something upwards of 80 to 85% so the number of targets probably weren’t as high as it would have been at most schools. Regardless it will be intresting to see what he can do at a big time school (FSU) in a big time postion (DC) with a big time recruting base (FLA).
Moojenowski, Brewster's a stud recruiter
If not for the bad stretch at the end of last season I really believe he would have signed BrYce McNeal last year when at one point it looked rather grim. he also got the attention of Michael Floyd and gave him something to consider even though UF, OH ST. and ND were all over him. And he’s probably gonna get an offical out of Sentreal this year, or has he already have?
Will Stoops be able to pull his weight
Better yet will he have too. We have one of the best groups of recruiters in the nation. I dont think stoops is being pulled in because he a great recruiter and we dont need him to. We need him to be a coach first and recruiter second. We have something like 2 or 3 more coaches to get that and if one of the Def coaches is a great recruiter that should be all we need for now. We have to get Def coaches that can coach there butts off. JF, Coley and Garn will be the top recruiters Im sure and then get a Def coach to help the rest of our coaches just need to be just that coaches.
What all coaching pos. do we still need filled. I know we need a LB and S&C coach as well as someone to replace Allen (Though Odell will prob get the whole line and Garn will also coach ST)
Coaches: Job Replaced
Fisher: HC/ QB Bobby
Coley: Pos OC/TE/ Recruitng JF/ Same job
Trickett: O-line Same Job
Gran: RB / recruitng Carter
Dawsey: WR Same Job
Stoops: DC / DB Micky
??: LB CTC
Odell: D-line Same Job
??: somewhere Allen
??: S&C Stroud
??: ST Allen
We still have 4 coaches to hire but only 3 can recruit. (Dont think the S&C coach can recruit) Most likely 2 at least will be Def coaches and dont know where the other one will fit in.
Why is the sky blue? Because, God Loves the Infantry
I believe Gran will handle Special Teams
by The K-Man on Dec 14, 2009 8:05 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
If that is his title what would his responsibilites be
I know he might have a hand in working with QBs but I would have to imagine that Jimbo is still going to be the predominant QB coach. Where else can Craig assist?
It's a beautiful day in Tallahassee
Working with EJ?
Maybe TE coach?
Maybe let him coach ST & let Gran be the RC? ST is where Saban had him with the Dolphins. Curious that Saban didn’t take him to Bama.
I don’t know much about him. If Jimbo wants him, he must’ve been a pretty good student. Here’s a link to his profile: http://www.usajaguars.com/ViewArticle.dbml?SPSID=99699&SPID=12275&DB_OEM_ID=8300&ATCLID=1419905&Q_SEASON=2009
You are right...he is... I would think being able to step away from that in games or practices would make Craig pretty valuable though.
As HC there will be times he can’t be both places at once. Double teaming the task and then stepping away to leave him in charge….also another potential recruiter.
Yeah, right!
If we get Craig, and I say if because I don't know if it is a given, I personally would prefer Jimbo
to continue coaching the QB’s.
This is Jimbo’s specialty and his strength. IMAO Jimbo > Craig as a QB coach, and I also think he enjoys coaching QB’s.
Craig can coach up the TE’s and ST’s. He may eventually relinquish coaching the Qb’s to another coach, but I think he continues, at least for a little while.
Also, if/when Coley is promoted to OC, I believe Jimbo will continue to call the plays at least for the for year.
>-----:----:------>Spear 'em then Scalp 'em
I think that makes the most sense
I heard second hand from a current coach who was at the HS finals this past weekend that Craig is all but locked up
It's a beautiful day in Tallahassee
He mentioned Gran's ability on ST
I don’t know if he is locked into that though. Would’ve been weird if he said Craig, since we haven’t announced that Craig is a coach yet. He was just commenting on Gran’s attributes. I would expect both Craig and Gran to have input on special teams, share info and ideas like Jimbo was talking about. Gran very well may get the role, just not sure that it is all set in stone.
I think the context was responsiblities of coaches and who they would hire on D.
perhaps it was at a different point in the presser?
He said something to the effect of, “He(Stoops) would coach the entire secondary. thats how he likes to do it. So we could hire an LB coach and two guys to coach the Inside, but that’s up to him(stoops) however he wants to work it.”
Either before or after that someone was asking specifically about a ST coach. I think after in the context of letting Odel coach the entire DL as a possibility. Fisher’s response was Gran can coach ST as well.
To me that indicates that this is the way he wants it.
Yeah, right!
Not worried about his recruiting chops
Outside of Tennessee, I can’t think of a team where pretty much all the coaches are supposed to be recruiting dynamos. Even with the Vols I doubt Monte is a monster on the trail. With FSU’s recruiting footprint and tradition I don’t think we will have a problem pulling talent as long as we win. I also don’t think he will have a problem getting our current players to buy in to his system. Last season had to be so embarrassing to our defense that they would buy into any change.
Second that
First off, I’m not as concerned with Stoops’ recruiting abilities as his ability to make our defense in the top 20 and eventually top 10. FSU already has strong recruiters, which is why FSU is climbing at record speed in the recruiting rankings right now. We need a defense; and he created a defense that was in the top 18% of all FBS teams, in the offense-heavy, and 2nd best conference, Pac-10. Second, basically Stoops had no one to recruit at UA, so we can’t judge his recruiting abilities by his work at AZ. I’m confident that he will ramp up his recruiting if Jimbo asks him to. Again, I’m more concerned that he can return FSU’s defense into the top 10%-20% in the next few years. Given what he did at AZ with very little talent, he should be able to do this at FSU.
by TLHWG on Dec 14, 2009 8:58 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I doubt many of our recruits over the years came to play for Mickey because of his charming personality...
I would imagine more so for the fact he was a great coach and put people in the NFL; if Stoops can prove that he has the ability to do that then recruiting will take care of itself, especially when you have guys like Coley, Gran, Fisher closing the deal.
Stoops has put a few names in the NFL himself and in the first round for that matter
Ed Reed, Sean Taylor, Phillip Buchanon, Antrole Rolle were all coached by Stoops at Miami when he was their DB coach.
Misleading headline
Didn’t read much about his recruiting ability. I think his best recruiting tool is his name. Hope the guy can coach fundamentals and scheme.
by Sabon on Dec 14, 2009 8:15 AM EST via mobile reply actions
Even if he does zero recruiting, Jimbo brought him here so that he can tell recruits you can come play for a "Stoops"
Name has a lot to do with this hire, IMO.
Does the name carry "THAT" much weight?
Kids we’re recruiting may know Bob as the HC of OK, but do they really remember Mark as the DB coach at UM, or Bob as the DC of UF?
I don’t think it’s a bad hire, I just don’t know that name resonates all that much.
I understand your point but...
…i disagree.I think the name will resonate just as the Bowden name did for Terry and Tommy. Ultimately he will be judeged by the production of his unit. If he does well, the Stoops name gets stronger. If he does poorly, the name means less.
I will appreciate Fisher's dynasty more than I did Bowden's...
by Jamil Dawson on Dec 14, 2009 10:30 AM EST up reply actions
More weight than any of the other names on the DC short list.
Until Smart’s recent lock of the Broyles award, have you ever heard of Smart, Sunseri, Hudson? Other than Stoops, the only name recognition would have been Bud Foster – but I’m not sure there was any truth to that rumor anyway.
There would have been a parade in Tally had we gotten Foster.
and probably rioting in the streets in Blacksburg.
Looks like Bud Foster might have just been f*cking with us all, apparently to get himself a sweeter deal at VT by scaring them, and since many of their fans would rather lose Beamer than Foster, it worked.
After toying with my emotions and breaking my heart, Bud Foster “allegedly” was also considered for UF’s and UGA’s open DC positions.
“Allegedly,” Bud was also offered a very sweet deal by Mark Richt.
All this attention, rumors, and offers, have allegedly led to his contract with VT being reworked and there will be a announcement about his new contract real soon, which
will add an annuity to his current five-year rollover contract.
>-----:----:------>Spear 'em then Scalp 'em
http://hamptonroads.com/2009/12/deal-will-keep-foster-tech-least-5-more-years-0
>-----:----:------>Spear 'em then Scalp 'em
I'm giving him a pass until September's over
Realistically, it should be longer than that. The hire isn’t jaw dropping, but like the players should be, I’m ready to buy into something new, anything. This is a bad position to be in, but the hire seems like it has the potential to be great and lets be realistic about our options, what did we know about Smart? Take him away from the SEC and Saban’s tit and we might find out he’s not that great. I guess you could say the same about Stoops, but here is a guy with intimate knowledge of two of our toughest opponents next year (UM – answered to Shannon, Okla. it’s his brother).
Recruiting, from someone who grew up in Coral Gables, you can never ever have enough a stranglehold on SoFla. If he can do his job with X’s and O’s and pull even one kid out of Miami that will be good for me given our current staffs ability.
by vanillathrilla83 on Dec 14, 2009 9:34 AM EST reply actions
Very Surprised
That so many posters are underimpressed by the hire. Always remember that coaches have to make moves upwards before they become greats. Steve Spurrier’s fourth position was offensive coordinator at Duke.
Every coach starts off as an assistant in some nature, then moves up. Same as the rest of us professionally. The guy has succeeded where he has been to date (and I would even say impressively at AZ realitive to the offenses in PAC-10) and like it or not (taking off g&g glasses), here is the job posting he applied for:
Defensive Coordinator position available at well known D-1 school. Former Coordinator retiring after 26 years. Defense ranked 112 in D-1 last year. Head Coach also retiring after 34 years. Offensive Coordinator promoted to Head Coach position. Several changes on offensive and defensive staff positions. Historic name will draw recruits, however facilities not the best, and team has combined record of 37-27 last five years. Fanbase and new head coach eager for success!
There are challenges in taking this job, and a reason why Kirby Smart (beyond his wife’s and own connections) didn’t take it. If it was the best job, we would have gotten the best.
I’m happy with the hire because I viewed the candidate as someone that will be committed to winning in the NEW college football culture of 24-7 workdays, and that has had some level of previous success. It just happens to be a bonus that he’s young, has coached in FL before, and is a well known name.
"I got a PBS mind in an MTV world"...Jimmy Buffett
by The Ryno and I Know on Dec 14, 2009 10:04 AM EST up reply actions 4 recs
We could've at least called Rex Ryan....
I’m glad you took the time to explain that rather than me. Everyone is jumping up and down like little school girls when Coach Coley sends a tweet, forgetting that he was a near-unknown when he was hired to replace John Lilly. I know people have bad tastes in their mouths from Amato, Allen, Carter, Sexton and others, but we’re not getting established coaches to come here. We’re not getting a very successful, former HC of an SEC team to come coach our defense, Mr. Tommy Tubberville Fan Club Chairman Man. And why would we? It’s like dating the hot chick on the rebound. She’s not really into it.
Mark Stoops is a great hire it seems. He’s young, growing professionally, good football pedigree (to use a trite idiom), has experience in Florida, in the NFL, and seems to be producing good defenses with average talent. Lately, we’ve been producing average to bad defenses with good talent.
If Stoops’ defenses suck after a few years, then we’ll call him out on it then, and give Bill Cowher a call.
I think mot of it is more disappointment that we didnt get Smart.
We all started dreaming of this guy, who can recruit, and coaches a system that is proven to stellar. We assumed it would translate, and if others are anything like me, it wasnt if, it was when Smart was named.
I think once we really look at his qualifications and let those simmer, I think most of the disappointment will fade. Also, the disappointment will disappear if he does what he was hired to do, and thats win. Others mentioned it, but I’ll repeat since its what I think as well. With as many recruiters as we have, Im not worried about him being able to pull multiple 5 stars. The only thing I care about is whether or not he can scheme a defense, can he take a position, and help make it better, can he bring in capable assistants that can implement his scheme, and will he be able to find talent out of nowhere once his success leads to turnover since others will want OUR success for themselves.
Lol
I was sarcastically voicing the sentiments of a portion of our fan base. As for me, im excited about this hire! I think a lot of people are in for a pleasant surpirse! One thing i hope people dont do is expect a top 5 defense in the first year. Like Jimbo’s offense, Stoops is going to need time to turn things around. One positive thing is that Stoops has more talent coming in on defense than when Jimbo first came in on offense.
great article
I’m warning up to this hire.
by atlnolefan on Dec 14, 2009 9:53 AM EST via mobile reply actions
I was thinking about some of this
I wonder if Stoops mentioned in the interview he could pick up players in Leon County he would have been happy to have in Arizona.
" Fisher’s approach to building a winner is lifted from Saban’s playbook. Right down to the terminology such as becoming more "process oriented" as opposed to "results oriented."
" Nick and I are friends," he said. "That guy is one of the best football coaches I’ve ever been around. God knows he’s brilliant. … A lot of the things he believes are a lot of things I believe. We’re very similar!
The process begins!
Another disadvantage
is the women. I’ve lived in Scottsdale for 3 mos. and have learned that a large percentage of the people in the Valley are from the Midwest and, to be honest, are just not attractive. The difference between here and the South just walking around is stunning. My 18 year blond, born in Tally and raised in Atlanta from a momma with southern roots, is attending Sagaro HS and does not lack for attention. (She’s also having fun dynamiting some anti-southern stereotypes’ “Why don’t you have a thick accent?” “How come you’re able to correct the valedictorian’s Latin paper!”) This is a beautiful place but very provencial. I can see why kids would want to leave and broaden their horizons.
It's not just the South. It's Tallahassee...
I mean, the women in the South are better of course, everyone knows this. But Tallahassee is on a completely different level. Whenever I got back home to Pensacola, I always wonder “Why are there so many dudes here?!” because there’s a 50-50 ratio.
PS- FiestaNole has a hot 18 year old daughter… noted.
by MattDNole on Dec 14, 2009 10:20 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
yes, she is, and
also smart, which is unfortunate for you, because I’ve seen your posts. :)
by PeachTreeNole on Dec 14, 2009 11:07 AM EST up reply actions 3 recs
On a related topic,
I’m becoming fairly accurate with both my .357 revolver and my 9mm automatic. :)
by PeachTreeNole on Dec 15, 2009 12:15 PM EST up reply actions
FAMU
No one ever talks about the plus it is having FAMU and their student population in Tallahassee. Even more ladies for the potential recruits to intract with. I’ve heard from ballers in the past say having FAMU is an added bonus even the Gates don’t have.
just go to Governor's Square Mall during FAMU Homecoming. LOL.
My wife was shocked first time she saw it. She’s not used to the culture FAMU brings to town on occassion.
Well Done
the culture FAMU brings to town on occassion.
"I got a PBS mind in an MTV world"...Jimmy Buffett
by The Ryno and I Know on Dec 14, 2009 10:40 AM EST up reply actions
that culture almost got
my friend and I shot in the fall of ’98. Not a big fan of FAMU homecomming. However, FAMU is a nice recruiting tool.
Big Fan of Big Spear Diplomacy
I remember one year they scheduled a FSU game and FAMU homecoming on the same weekend
DISASTORIOUS
It's a beautiful day in Tallahassee
Know a girl who unknowingly scheduled her wedding for a FAMU homecoming weekend!
She was so intent upon scheduling it during an FSU bye week she forgot to check FAMU’s schedule.
Which is why
You never get married during College Football Season
by FLAK8 on Dec 14, 2009 12:15 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
+1!
I will appreciate Fisher's dynasty more than I did Bowden's...
by Jamil Dawson on Dec 14, 2009 10:33 AM EST up reply actions
Extemely good point
I remember seing that Deion’s first wife (Lil Deion’s mother) went there
by westcoastnolefan on Dec 14, 2009 11:30 AM EST up reply actions
the appeal of FAMU
Clifton Abraham said that he was surprised to learn when he enrolled at FSU that FSU was not predominantly black.
Apparently, on Abraham’s official visit, Toddrick McIntosh had taken him to FAMU parties all weekend.
Another factor is location
Tucson is 8 hours from ANYTHING. I agree that it is in very beautiful country, but it is essentially out in the middle of the desert. People who have never been out west have no idea how spread out everything is. AZ’s population is also only a third of Florida’s population.
It’s pretty much guaranteed top recruits will have to be far from home to come to AZ, and they’re not going to have a ton of friends there with them.
FSU fans are conditioned to expect bad news
Reading some of this you don’t know whether to laugh or cry. FSU fans really have been forced to be pessimistic the last 9 years. The commentary reminds me of what we saw after the Fisher hire.
Nobody really knew what to expect and when he did not come aboard and produce the top then offense in the nation figured the bottom was falling out once again. I can remember fans on various sites even saying they wanted Fredo back, notwithstanding Fisher had to work with the talent Fredo left behind and an offensive line that Trickett had to run off basically. Trickett did you know send some boys packing right away telling them they would never play a down for him.
Kirby Smart was an interesting idea but look at it another way, could Kirby produce a top 20 defense in Arizona against some very good offenses? He certainly would not have Saban style talent.
Stoops produces top 20 defense in Arizona. Stoops with FSU talent = success rate probability of 95%
Stoops recruits enough players for top 20 defense in a desert town, overrun by illegal aliens and high crime rate= probability for recruiting success in Tallahassee 95%.
Now some say this is not a high profile hire but I am afraid carrying the Stoops name makes it indeed a high profile hire. You will find across the nation more people are familiar with “Stoops” than “Smart”, especially before this year.
This whole debate certainly reminds me of the Fisher debate, field goal Fisher, offensive states similar to Fredo etc, etc. Same with Trickett his lineman are too skinny and he hasn’t signed any five stars yet yada yada yada.
The more I look at this, it appears a hire that will be just as big as the Fisher, Trickett hires. Add Stoops to recruiting push in south Florida and it begins to stand out even more. He can go into a recruits house and begin to explain to him how he molded the great Sean Taylor. People if you don’t know it this is big. Fisher has to be smiling thinking of recruiting next year in South Florida, unleashing Coley, Gran and Stoops on the area.
As far as Coley can only half way coach tight ends, Wow! Coley broke down film for Jimbo Fisher at LSU and helped put together game plans during LSU’s biggest run. He was an assistant with the Dophins and later the offensive coordinator at FIU for one year and the coach there was hear broken when he left.
Coley is the guy Fisher is talking too with his headphone set helping to decide which play to run this season and next year he will still be in the booth and will be officially the offensive coordinator as he was this season. Next season it will be official.
" Fisher’s approach to building a winner is lifted from Saban’s playbook. Right down to the terminology such as becoming more "process oriented" as opposed to "results oriented."
" Nick and I are friends," he said. "That guy is one of the best football coaches I’ve ever been around. God knows he’s brilliant. … A lot of the things he believes are a lot of things I believe. We’re very similar!
The process begins!
by DocHoliday2 on Dec 14, 2009 10:57 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
I would have to disagree with the
“overrun by illegal aliens and high crime rate” conclusion. AZ has been dealing with their immigrant problem for many years. It’s worse in Atalnta. As far as crime rate, not on whites, to my knowledge. This is a gun friendly state (I’ve bought 2 already) and I can’t tell you how many of the older at WOMEN at CHURCH are packing :)
by PeachTreeNole on Dec 14, 2009 11:11 AM EST up reply actions
Slightly off topic
And maybe I shouldn’t have mentioned it but FiestaNole as a retired border patrol agent having been on detail in Tucson and Atlanta, let’s just say I think Tucson would be a tough place to recruit. Enough on this topic anyway.
" Fisher’s approach to building a winner is lifted from Saban’s playbook. Right down to the terminology such as becoming more "process oriented" as opposed to "results oriented."
" Nick and I are friends," he said. "That guy is one of the best football coaches I’ve ever been around. God knows he’s brilliant. … A lot of the things he believes are a lot of things I believe. We’re very similar!
The process begins!
by DocHoliday2 on Dec 14, 2009 11:18 AM EST up reply actions
I would certainly defer to your experience!
Nice to know, and I would love to hear your thoughts on various things related to that. For example, a lot of my friends out here conceal carry, men and women. Is that something you’d recommend?
by PeachTreeNole on Dec 14, 2009 12:27 PM EST up reply actions
My first "old west" experience...
On the porch of the Cracker Barrel in Tucson (where else?). Old dude comes strolling in for breakfast wearing cowboy hat, boots, and pistols in holsters around his waist. Probably a rancher. Needless to say, it was a weird thing to see my first week in town.
One of my family members is a sheriff deputy/detective there. He’s got some awesome “get off my property” stories.
gotta love The Free State of Arizona.
Some of these folks take the literal language of the Constitution very seriously (so far as they understand it).
by PeachTreeNole on Dec 14, 2009 4:15 PM EST up reply actions
I don't think anyone said Coley can't coach.
I was merely making a point by saying that “IF” Coley couldn’t coach and “IF” Trickett couldn’t recruit, we’d keep them both because you need both recruiting and coaching. It’s rare to find guys that excel equally at both. Stoops should be fine.
Slightly off topic...
What time is the press conference today?
I love the hire
Like many have stated if he is just a decent recruit that for me is good enough with the other AMAZING recruiters we already have. Throw in the fact that he can go into any South Florida home when recruiting and say I coached Edd Reed, Sean Taylor, Philip Buchanon, and Antrelle Rolle amongst others and sent all of them to be 1st round picks in the NFL that carries a lot of weight in that part of FL. Everyone knows the name because of his brother and the biggest weakness in our defenses over the past few years has been at the DB position. If nothing else with stoops we get an amazing DB coach and a big time name to impress recruits, so as long as we can get a good LB coach and DE coach we will be fine. At best we get one of the best up and coming defensive minds who has lead a less talented defense to top 25 defense in the country in 2 out of the last 3 years in the middle of the desert somewhere while playing in the offensive minded Pac-10.
Good stuff Aussierat!
Thanks for putting a dent in this mystery. I take away that he is a pretty good recruiter who can work with what he gets. They did finish second in the PAC 10 this year (albeit at 6-3 in a 3-way tie). But they’re at least competing in the PAC 10 and getting some positive media attention. They are also going to a bowl again after an eight year drought. There is no doubt that he and his brother took a PAC 10 cellar dweller and turned them around going 8-4 last year and this year. It just took them a long time to do it. Personally, I had no idea that UArizona was as bad as they were up until the last two years. However, I would bet that recruiting this year would have been a very different story for the Stoops brothers, especially after taking down USC, if he had stayed.
To your point Aussierat, football really is second at UArizona. Basketball has had 21 twenty win seasons since 1983 and a national championship. Baseball has three national championships and fifteen trips to the college world series. The softball team has eight national championships. The golf teams have three national championships. Hell, even the synchronized swimming team has three championships! Too bad all these sports combined don’t make the same money that a championship football team does.
Football, on the other hand, has really only had sporadic success including a run in the late 90s. That all ended after 1998 when the program went into a slump going 28-48 over six years. Something to note is that the worst three years of the stretch were Mike Stoops first three years (03 to 05) when they went 8-26. Then he went 6-6 in 2006 and followed that up with 5-7 in 2007. Talk about a patient AD! Not many coaches get that kind of leeway. I would say that as tough as it is to recruit at UArizona, Stoops did them no favors with such a disastrous three year start. Perhaps it might be good to turn this on its head. Because they must be unbelievably good recruiters in that they got ANY quality recruits to come after that stretch.
So, it’s good to get more information about him since he seemed to come out of the blue and things came so quickly. I would have bet cash money that MattDNole had our next DC somewhere on his list. I don’t even think Stoops was considered a rising star on the national scene. Fisher created something of a stumper with this hire. As far as I know, Stoops has no personal connection with Fisher or our current staff, no connection to FSU, no advanced press and no back channel chatter about him until very late in the deal. He’s the first question mark in a stellar run by Fisher so far. Did he really have such a great an interview that Fisher decided to make this seemingly unorthodox pick? Or do they have a connection we just haven’t seen yet?
It also raises questions about where he will look for position coaches. How will he fit with Haggins? Again, I would have thought that we would have found some (if not all) of our position coaches in MattDNole’s article as well. Now, who will Stoops bring in? Will he get his cadre or will Fisher want to make those choices?
Or (sinister music rises) maybe he simply a pawn, a stop-gap guy that can hold the place until Fisher gets the guy he wants in a few years. This way, he makes a quick hire with some celebrity name recognition and waits until the guy he really wants becomes available. Or or, he came to the conclusion that nobody worthwhile was coming forward possibly because they didn’t want to follow Mickey Andrews (or thought Fisher following Bowden was doomed) and Stoops was the best of the remainders. Or or or, Stoops is the figurehead that holds things steady until Fisher is able to groom a young, up and coming position coach who would be too much of a reach to hire as our DC now. Or or or or, Stoops is someone far enough outside that if Fisher runs into trouble in his first two years, he can give him the axe showing that he’s willing to make drastic changes and will not tolerate failure! (Que Dr. Evil) BWWHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
But I digress. I know we will know more shortly but its hard to wait. And as grandpa used to say “For every mystery, there’s usually a simple, direct answer that’s wrong.”
Thanks again Aussierat!
Go Noles!
From the UTD (Useless Trivia Department): In 1949, UArizona played in a New Year’s Day bowl in Phoenix, Arizona that was the precursor to the Fiesta Bowl. It was called the Salad Bowl (no, I’m not making this up). They lost to football powerhouse Drake University from Des Moines.
http://s825.photobucket.com/albums/zz178/unclefestus/
Just like you Gonzo, I too am a big fan.
Hell, even the synchronized swimming team has three championships!
>-----:----:------>Spear 'em then Scalp 'em
Only "connection" I have found is between Mark Stoops and Saban not Jimbo
but many have thought that Jimbo would go to Saban for insight on a defensive mind, maybe even from within his staff. Mark stoops was picked by Saban to coach the Miami Dolphins secondary when Saban was named the Dolphins head coach but he declined to job offer. Saban is a great DB coach in his own right so if he saw something in Stoops to want him to coach his secondary that can only be a good sign.
Interesting that he turned Saban down.
It shows loyalty to his brother in spite of a rough beginning. He’s stuck it out in a rebuilding program with a second tier PAC 10 team and a brother on an obvious learning curve. Also, he’s staying until after the bowl game (unlike a certain toadie hired by Notre Dame). I like that.
http://s825.photobucket.com/albums/zz178/unclefestus/
Kind of like the idea he doesn't have ties to Jimbo...
In some way, means he’s not getting any free passes, not that Jimbo would give anyone a freepass because they knew him, but there will be no doubt Stoops will be pressured to perform and quickly.
I don't think Stoops is a stop gap measure.
Jimbo doesn’t have a few years to wait and hire the one he wants. This hire better be the right one.
by PeachTreeNole on Dec 14, 2009 12:34 PM EST up reply actions
LB coach?
I don’t suppose any names are out there yet. Will JF give MS full autonomy on who the LB coach might be or JF will require approval of MS’s LB hire?
Some have kicked the name Hargreaves around
He’s a coach for ECU and coached LBs at Miami when Stoops was there. Here’s a profile: http://www.ecupirates.com/sports/m-footbl/mtt/hargreaves_vernon00.html
Name I heard for the LB spot...
Bil Miller. Spent the last year under Mangino at KU. Here’s an old bio…
http://thesundevils.cstv.com/sports/m-footbl/mtt/miller_bill00.html
"If lessons were learned in defeat, our team is getting a great education." -Murray Warmath
Here's an updated Bio from the KU site
http://www.kuathletics.com/sports/m-footbl/mtt/miller_bill00.html
Former LB coach of the Turds—> Nice.
With Mangino out, is he also out of a job or I wonder if Gill will retain him?
Seems like a lot of experience at both LB and DC, wonder if he would take a step down, though I guess if you’re out of a job anything at a program like FSU would be good to take.
Does this answer your question?
While Miller was at Miami, the Hurricanes shared consecutive Big East Conference championships in 1995 and 1996. In 1996 Miller’s defense limited five opponents to seven points or less. In 1997 the Hurricanes led the Big East in pass defense, while in 1998 Miami was second in the conference in rush defense. When he was at Minnesota, the Gophers beat top-ranked Michigan in 1986 and advanced to the Liberty Bowl.
That’s a quote from the Bio.
Doest this time table mean that Stoops worked for him as DB coach?
if so that would be weird to be LB coach for a former assistant.???
Yeah, right!
Or how about this?
NFL Players Coached / Name / School / Team
Dale Robinson, LB Arizona State Indianapolis Colts
Jamar Williams, LB Arizona State Chicago Bears
Channing Crowder, LB Florida Miami Dolphins
Renaldo Hill, CB Michigan State Arizona Cardinals
Aric Morris, S Michigan State Tennessee Titans
Julian Peterson, LB Michigan State San Francisco 49ers
Josh Shaw, DT Michigan State San Francisco 49ers
Robaire Smith, DE Michigan State Tennessee Titans
Josh Thornhill, LB Michigan State Detroit Lions
T.J. Turner, LB Michigan State New England Patriots
Dimitrius Underwood, DE Michigan State Minnesota Vikings
Kenny Holmes, DE Miami (Fla.) Tennessee Titans
Carlos Jones, CB Miami (Fla.) Seattle Seahawks
Kenard Lang, DE Miami (Fla.) Washington Redskins
Ray Lewis, LB Miami (Fla.) Baltimore Ravens
Tremain Mack, S Miami (Fla.) Cincinnati Bengals
Dan Morgan, LB Miami (Fla.) Carolina Panthers
Twan Russell, LB Miami (Fla.) Washington Redskins
Duane Starks, CB Miami (Fla.) Baltimore Ravens
Nate Webster, LB Miami (Fla.) Tampa Bay Buccaneers
Marcus Wimberly, DB Miami (Fla.) Atlanta Falcons
Patrick Hunter, CB Nevada Seattle Seahawks
Henry Rolling, LB Nevada San Diego Chargers
Keith Burns, LB Oklahoma State Denver Broncos
Jason Gildon, DE Oklahoma State Pittsburgh Steelers
Linc Harden, LB Oklahoma State Dallas Cowboys
Jevon Langford, DE Oklahoma State Cincinnati Bengals
That’s from the old ASU Bio.
One of course wonders...
Why he went from being DC at ASU to LB coach at Kansas. Maybe he’s slowing down?
Good catch. Still you have to wonder why he would go from being a co-DC to just a LB coach at FSU after having been a DC or Co-DC for so long.
Miller has served as the defensive coordinator at Nevada, Oklahoma State, Miami, Michigan State, Arizona State and Western Michigan. He was also the associate head coach and linebackers coach at Florida.
Makes me think Miller is a pie-in-the-sky dream and that Hargreaves is a more realistic choice. I don’t envision us having a Stoops-Miller co-DC situation. Also like the diversity Hargreaves brings. Never can tell what Jimbo & Stoops are cooking up.
ANyone in the know....
I think FSUn mentioned Tuesday as a day they might announce the Jimbo promotion and Stoops hiring. That said, any word on the progress of filling out the rest of the defensive staff?
I know this will not be a popular statement on this site, but
I want a coach first, and a recruiter second.
Not knocking recruiting and we all know how important it is, but when we start winning, the recruits will be banging at our door and we will be throwing them out like prom night babies in the dumpsters behind Denny’s.
>-----:----:------>Spear 'em then Scalp 'em
by FrankDNole on Dec 14, 2009 11:47 AM EST reply actions 2 recs
Especially considering we now have some strong closers on our staff...
And that the guys we have on defense we’re good recruits out of HS, we needs to coach these guys up…
"If lessons were learned in defeat, our team is getting a great education." -Murray Warmath
I second that opinion, FrankD
Lets get some competent coaching which will lead to wins…THEN the recruiting will be where it can and should be.
Slick recruiters will lose their impact if winning isn’t happening.
Agree 100%
I’m not worried if the guy can recruit, I only care if he can coach. As FrankD said, FSU starts winning and ranks in the top 20 in D and O, the recruits will head to Tally.
I also think we are some have a wrong view of recruiting... I think recruiting is more a function of evaluation, and relentless pursuit than talent.
I.e. work hard to evaluated kids early and pursue them harder than others. Not some magical ability, some have and others don’t.
I would agree that some are better than others, but I think if you are young, hard working and willing to learn from some of the nations better recruiters on staff, you should be able to pick it up fairly easily.
Charisma is 90% developed skills. Confidence, listening, conversational skills, making others feel better about themselves etc.
Yeah, right!
Here is a writeup
http://www.azstarnet.com/sn/wildcats/320321
“Defensive coordinator Mark Stoops said the UA’s defensive performance was awe-inspiring.
“It’s been a long grind,” he said, stopping twice to regain his composure. “I can’t even tell you.”
Pete Carroll calls the AZ defense very disciplined, a zone, with mixed pressures and always in front of you. We could use a defense that is always in front of people instead of behind them.
" Fisher’s approach to building a winner is lifted from Saban’s playbook. Right down to the terminology such as becoming more "process oriented" as opposed to "results oriented."
" Nick and I are friends," he said. "That guy is one of the best football coaches I’ve ever been around. God knows he’s brilliant. … A lot of the things he believes are a lot of things I believe. We’re very similar!
The process begins!
+1!
I will appreciate Fisher's dynasty more than I did Bowden's...
by Jamil Dawson on Dec 14, 2009 12:28 PM EST up reply actions
Barkley if you noticed passed 20 times for 144 yards
Our defense gives up 144 yards passing in two plays
" Fisher’s approach to building a winner is lifted from Saban’s playbook. Right down to the terminology such as becoming more "process oriented" as opposed to "results oriented."
" Nick and I are friends," he said. "That guy is one of the best football coaches I’ve ever been around. God knows he’s brilliant. … A lot of the things he believes are a lot of things I believe. We’re very similar!
The process begins!
the only reason people are talking down this hire
is because they are still salivating from the prospect of having Smart as their DC. We had our G & G goggles on and never saw this as an obviously illogical lateral (really downward) move that would never happen in the real world. I would also love to have Charlie Strong as our DC while we’re living in a dream world, and why not go after Nick Saban himself, doesn’t everyone crap garnet and piss gold after all?
This is a very good hire, involving an up and coming defensive mind (and an excellent secondary mind) with a very good resume, very good name, being put in position with a very good talent pool to choose from. Do people really believe that Stoops could possibly recruit worse than Chuck Amato, Jody Allen, or even a distracted MA has the past three years?
I am extremely pleased that Stoops will be a part of this team and program, and fully trust Jimbo’s judgment here.
"We had a little come-to-Jesus meeting. And it was fire and brimstone." Jimbo Fisher on his halftime adjustments.
by Yarborough4Heisman on Dec 14, 2009 1:08 PM EST reply actions
You crap garnet?
I think a trip to the proctologist is in order
"I got a PBS mind in an MTV world"...Jimmy Buffett
by The Ryno and I Know on Dec 14, 2009 1:53 PM EST up reply actions
The only medically confirmed case of someone crapping garnet
is of Mr. Craig Yarborough himself.
"We had a little come-to-Jesus meeting. And it was fire and brimstone." Jimbo Fisher on his halftime adjustments.
by Yarborough4Heisman on Dec 14, 2009 3:19 PM EST up reply actions
I agree
and Bama beating UF certainly added to the excitement, though watching that game made me realize it probably wasn’t going to happen.
How many spots are left... 3, or 2 and S&C? I hope we dont leave Odell w/ the whole line...
I want Craig on this staff as much as anyone but please Jimbo, shore up the D staff first. After signing a DB specialist for DC I really hope we have 2 D Line coaches.
I was high on Sunseri b/c how much he would have improved the play of our entire front 7. We will improve there no doubt, but to what degree is still very much up in the air now pending the rest of our hires.
If we have the same number as last year
We have 4 spots left or 3 + S&C:
Old New
1. Fisher 1. Fisher
2. Coley 2. Coley
3. Trickett 3. Trickett
4. Dawsey 4. Dawsey
5. Haggins 5. Haggins
6. Carter 6. Gran
7. Andrews 7. Stoops
8. Amato 8.
9. Allen 9.
10. Bowden 10.
11. Stroud 11.
Craig seems to be a lock. He’d either coach ST, S&C, QB, or TE. It’s unclear how Jimbo wants to use him. Craig played QB and is currently a WR coach. He was an asst. ST coach for the Dolphins while Saban was there. However, Coley becoming OC also leaves a spot open for TE coach.
If Craig takes an O position coach or ST, we could still get a LB coach, a DE coach, and an S&C coach.
OMG WE HAVE 2 JAMES COLEYS?!?!
no wonder hes so good on the recruiting trail…
"Don't flinch, let's kill a fly with an Axe."
by NorFla_Nole on Dec 14, 2009 10:48 PM EST up reply actions
Funny
I tried to space the crap out into two columns (one for old coaches, one for new), but when I hit “post” it scrunched everything together.
sorry i couldnt resist
but i know what you mean about the spacing….its annoying
"Don't flinch, let's kill a fly with an Axe."
Let's see if he can close with Akuna.
Akuna is a left coast guy-Stoops territory. I think Akuna’s last OV was to AU.
Aussie I would like to see the D numbers in the bar graph beside FSU's numbers for the same factors....
I’m not good at graphs so …. if your interested I think it would add to the discussion.
Yeah, right!
See how these look
This is a snapshot of the full period from 2004-09. The main difference in the data set is that I knew where to put the ATH recruits in the FSU dataset. Keep in mind this has some guys that never saw the field, like Callahan Bright. But we are measuring raw talent for the recruiting period as judged by Rivals. UA may have had similar attrition in places.
This is the time period by year, with defensive recruits only, in terms of average stars in the defensive class. What’s interesting is that the offensive recruiting classes follow a similar pattern for both schools (The O data for FSU gets weighted downward by Trickett’s “2*” players who end up All Americans in both ‘08 and ’09 though, so the rebound from 2007 forward isn’t quite as big). 2007 was clearly a huge drop-off for us but the last few months of the JB era and change in coaching staff really affected that cycle. Arizona seemed to get hot in 2005 and 2006 on both sides of the ball. This period may correspond with the Mike Canales era on top of the obvious improvements that the Stoops brothers brought to the defense. He and some of the staff left after that year and after that came the arrival of Sonny Dykes who Desert Swarm says is now their lead as far as recruiting goes.
by Aussierat on Dec 15, 2009 10:30 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
nice stats and graphs
"Don't flinch, let's kill a fly with an Axe."
by NorFla_Nole on Dec 15, 2009 11:56 PM EST up reply actions
Nice!
Now, how about the enrolled rankings… (that’s part of FSU’s problem)
by Bud Elliott on Dec 16, 2009 12:08 AM EST up reply actions
I figured since the context was coachs' ability to get recruits I shouldn't pull them.
There are a number I know didn’t make it for FSU. Downs, Bright, etc. etc. are all in here. I have no idea where the attrition is or how much in the UA data. I can’t imagine it is worse than ours, though.
But your point is right on.
PS bright made it he's apparently just not good enough to play.
Looks like We recruit 2x as well as them when both programs recruit well.
Yeah, right!
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