Learn about Virginia Tech DC Bud Foster
Some believe he is considering leaving Virginia Tech for Florida State due to a bunch of reasons which I am not completely comfortable reporting right now until I can gather more information. The common theme seems to be some sort of rift between him and head coach Frank Beamer.
about 2 years ago
Bud Elliott
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background on beamer-foster
http://74.125.47.132/search?q=cache:EJUbXiX-FYcJ:mbd.scout.com/mb.aspx%3Fs%3D191%26f%3D2577%26t%3D5102910
i think foster would have to get turned down for a HC position this off-season before considering a lateral move. i can’t see FSU waiting that long to make a hire. FSU would be attractive for foster only as a resume-builder as he’s tried to get HC jobs in the past and that seems to be his target. maybe go off to another team with a real offense and build the resume to take over if/when beamer retires. in fact, a beamer retirement/firing (?) would be hastened by a foster departure.
The situation in blacksburg sounds familiar
Fantastic DC keeping a team together while the OC, who is very close to the coach, is doing nothing…where have I heard that before?
"Your eyes can decieve you. Don't trust them." Obi-Wan Kenobi, the first sabermetrician...
Indeed it does.
Sounds like Bud could dash.
I have heard how terrible the OC is this year
But he has a Top 20 offense and considering their schedule I think they have done well
It's a beautiful day in Tallahassee
Interesting...
I wonder if Jimbo would even seriously consider Bud? Especially if he thinks he could get Kirby.
more foster background
One-on-One With: Bud Foster (Part 2)
two quotes stand out:
1. On getting a HC position: “Hopefully, my track record over time shows that I can coach, I can recruit, I can motivate, and I can organize. I don’t need to take a step back to take a step forward. I don’t need to take another coordinator’s job. I really don’t.”
2. “I remember sitting down with Coach Beamer one time and asking him, ‘Do I need to leave here to get back some day as the head coach when you retire or to get another job?’ He said, ‘You know, Bud, maybe a few years ago, yes. But right now, with what we’ve built and with the product that we put out each and every week, I don’t think so.’ Sometimes, being able to network and market yourself more, that could be a factor. But I think we’re known well enough here as it is. And I know enough people, and they know me.”
by Sabon on Dec 3, 2009 2:43 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
I think he would be a great hire
But I’m doubtful he will go from VT to FSU, in the same position. It just doesn’t make much sense to me. Maybe because he wants to be noticed a little more or something? I don’t know.
I think he’d be a solid hire, but I think I’d rather have Smart if it came down to the two.
You should always take someone you have worked with before
It guarantees results and if they aren’t performing you already understand how to motivate them.
bud seems like a shiny penny at the moment
working with someone you've worked with before doesnt guarentee anything
see: Bowden, Jeff.
I love Smart’s portential, but you’re kidding yourself if you think he is more of a sure thing to fix the D than Foster. All signs point to Smart panning out, but we have nothing to prove he’s not just reaping the benefits of Saban’s D.
The main benefit of a familiar hire is the increased likelihood that the person will get along with the HC.
by Mr. Tito Carlos on Dec 3, 2009 9:52 AM EST up reply actions
If presented with the prospect of hiring two men you believe are of equal talent
You are telling me you would hire the one who has not proven themselves to you?
You are kidding yourself. You always hire the one you are familiar with. I didn’t say you hire them JUST because you are familiar with them.
You hire them because they are great and that you work well with them.
Again, Bud is a shiny penny in this circumstance; Smart still is the better choice.
You said...
You should always take someone you have worked with before…It guarantees results
This is an extreme, and you sort of backed off this stance with your second statement by adding the part about "all things being equal. I agree with your second statement – that a prior relationship will give an edge with all things being equal, but ultimately, its just another thing to consider, as opposed to the trump card you (perhaps unwittingly) claimed it to be with your first statement.
You might see this as being nitpicky with words, but I disagree. You may have meant “all things being equal” in your first post, but there are too many people out there see coaches have worked together in the past and expect immediate results. Almost looking for the relationship before the on-field record. And this attitude is sorta the reason behind FSU’s troubles teh last few years to begin with. In looking for something thats going to “guarentee” success, I would rather find a list of studs and then look to see if a previous relationship exists to separate one from the pack.
And I understand Jeffy was unproven and the victim of nepotism. Maybe a better example is Amato, who was hired back on because of previous relationships and a track record of mild success at FSU before he left. I’m sure I can think of more examples of reunions where the second time around didn’t work so well. All I’m saying is that past relationships are important, but they do not GUARANTEE anything, like you said in your first post.
Coming back to the issue at hand – assuming both were available I would take Smart. But for a bevy of reasons, not just because the two worked together previously. FWIW, I’m also not trying to get into a Smart v. Foster debate. I think both would be good in their own way.
by Mr. Tito Carlos on Dec 3, 2009 12:52 PM EST up reply actions
Smart vs Foster
I personally would like to see what Smart can do, but from an objective POV, Foster has the resume. Smart doesn’t. Everything that revolves around Smart is presumptions. "If he wasn’t a good coach, why would Saban keep him", "Saban values him", "He’s a great recruiter".
Lets face it. Frank Beamer is good, but he’s not Nick Saban. Is Smart a great recruiter? Or is he a great recruiter because Nick Saban is his head coach and recruits know that? Is his defense great, or is Nick Saban’s defense great? WHY is Saban keeping him around? Is it because he’s a great coach, or because he’ll be a good scapegoat should something go wrong? We have NO idea.
Smart is recruiting at Bama though
And under Saban. There aren’t many schools with a football tradition bigger then Alabama’s. VA Tech is not an easy place to recruit from, and still they keep their top talent in state year in and year out. I think it’s unfair to compare the 2 recruiting wise. Put Bud in Smart’s shoes and I wouldn’t be surprised if he did just as good. Now put Smart coaching Bud’s 2* and 3* players at VA Tech and lets see if he can get the same results as Bud. I think Bud would be the best most proven guy to fix our defense quickly, although either of these 2 would make my year. I hope it is one of the 2 that actually end up coming to help us although I am not sure either of them would.
A shiny penny?
Bud Foster is a sack of Benjamins. I don’t care if they’re stained, crumpled, torn or worn.
working with someone before
only guarantees some idea of the level of chemistry you will have with them. It doesn’t guarantee results – unless you personally witnessed results before.
Even before, as every major investment firm will tell you – past performance does not guarantee future results.
by Wild@Heart Nole on Dec 3, 2009 1:43 PM EST up reply actions
Not even witnessing results before will garuntee future results.
Look at CTC’s first stint with us and then his second….
Smoke, but is there fire?
Very interesting, indeed. But i would see this(These rumors) more as a way for him to perhaps leverage himself into a more advantageous situation (Whatever he interprets that to be). Unlike Kirby Smart, Bud already receives full credit for being the defensive mind at Va Tech (Beamer is a special teams guru), and has been a known coaching commodity for years. So while this would be a very good “Get” for FSU. I really see no sense in him making a lateral move having already established a rep at a major college.Unless, there is indeed a rift w/Beamer. In which case all bets are off and he’s just looking for a situation that will allow him to go elsewhere (As a HC or DC).
by westcoastnolefan on Dec 3, 2009 3:34 AM EST reply actions
I had no clue you held the patent on it
by westcoastnolefan on Dec 3, 2009 10:34 AM EST up reply actions
I agree with this
I think this is a leverage move similar to what Jimbo did last year i.e. the WVU head coach rumors
I don't see this happening
but boy would the Virginia Tech fans loathe us if it did LOL
Bud Foster is a rockstar up there, and often the only thing they really have to get excited about.
Yeah they do
Has anyone else noticed that 90% of the male, over 30 VT fans look just like Foster? I think they grow goatees to mimic their DC. Just an observatin I made a few years ago at the ACCCG.
by Dent Street Nole on Dec 3, 2009 8:34 AM EST up reply actions
My 2 cents
I don’t think Foster is the recruiter Smart is, but he is a completely known X and O guy while there is a little bit of wonder on how much of Alabama’s D is Smart and how much is Saban. With the kind of talent he could have at FSU Foster could produce truly monstrous defense. Also Foster has been a known product for years at VT and still isn’t getting big time offers. VT is looked at as sort of a big fish in a small pond, beating ACC teams but losing to elite of other conferences, so maybe that makes it harder for Foster to get a job. If he puts the same defense up at FSU, to go with our offense, his name would become white hot in coaching.
That said, I have trouble seeing it happening. He has been at VT so long it is hard to picture him gone. It is really hard for me to see him fitting into our timeline for needs.
exactly, VT hasn't really pulled it out when they've had a shot on the big stage.
I know Bud gets alot of credit for the VT D, but are they really elite? Bama, LSU, heck even FSU has had their way with VT’s defense with some mediocre teams.
What would his schemes be like
with better talent?
I would think he could recruit better players to FSU than VT. Just FSU’s proximity to more/better talent hotbeds is a big advantage with the right staff to make use of it.
by Wild@Heart Nole on Dec 3, 2009 9:17 AM EST up reply actions
He does more with less...they always keep the BEST local players, but rarely have the depth that a team of their ranking should.
Also, He gets very little help from his offense.
I would site a very talented but not increadibly deep defense for the late scoring explotions of Alabama and LSU.
Yeah, right!
Sounds like a similar situation as Smart
Meaning, if we landed Foster, we’d have to hit home runs on the other position hires as well. Seems like Smart and/or Foster would only be here around 2-3 until a HC opp came along. That being said, we would need to be grooming one of the position guys to take over as DC in 2 or 3 years.
Im not going to lie I dont want him
he is a good coach but I want someone that can get us to compeat with the SEC again. I know VT’s problem is with there offense but I want one of the Bama boys.
Why is the sky blue? Because, God Loves the Infantry
I'd take Foster in a heartbeat (though I doubt this is legit)!
His schemes and teaching in a school where talent will be slightly better and much deeper in conjunction with a good offense would be dynamic…not to mention whay he has learned of good speacial teams play from Beamer.
Yeah, right!
Slightly better?
A little more than slightly better tallent..
If not Smart
then Foster would be fine with me. Foster is a great DC. But if we have the option to get Smart then I would much rather have him.
Why hasn't he been considered for a HC postion?
I used to hear that he would only leave for a BCS school, but recently he’s expressed interest in some lower tier schools such as Memphis?
Does he not interview well? I’ve never really heard him speak.
I don’t think it would be impossible for him to be here. At full capacity, FSU > VT. You never know, it could be his dream job that he never thought he would have a shot at with Mickey around (he prob thought he would be a HC by now anyway)…
I’ve told VT fans for years that Bud was the next Mickey Andrews. They were all convinced he was going to get a HCIW tag, and be the next HC, but Frank shows no signs of wanting to hang it up. If he doesn’t leave, he will be 65 and nobody will take him as a HC.
and can he recruit?
I keep hearing about how much he does with 2* athletes, but why is he not pulling in 4*, 5* defensive athletes with his defensive prowess?
D guys rarely make the best HC's I'm not saying never, but there is often something left to be desired in those critical decision moments.
they are usually conservative to a fault… let’s see how Saban does with those moments once he starts getting in title situations on a consistent basis.
Yeah, right!
Titles lets talk National Titles I mean by attempt.... How many NT coaches were offensive backgrounds vs. defensive?
is this close?
Pete Carroll 1-??
Saban 1-2 I mentioned still counting lets see this year.
Stoops is the new king of close but not there yet.
I’m not saying they make poor head coaches at all. I AM saying that in the bigger games they tend to hand tie their offenses.
Yeah, right!
I think its 4 times
win v. FSU (00), loss to LSU (03), loss to USC (04), loss to UF (08).
by Mr. Tito Carlos on Dec 3, 2009 2:04 PM EST up reply actions
I believe he is in the running for the memphis job, but they are considering NFL candidates as well.
I just wrote almost the exact same thing on the other thread.
>-----:----:------>Spear 'em then Scalp 'em
Not to be picky
But I’d much rather have Smart. Bud is a good coach and calls a great game but I don’t think he has the recruiting chops that Smart has. I’m sure Bud would upgrade our defense (hell, who couldn’t?) but if we have our choice I would like to see Smart here.
Let me say that I'm playing a little bit of devil's advocate with my questions, but I like Bud.
I think he would be top 3, maybe top 2 candidates (**again I don’t know how much of bama is Smart vs Saban).
It’s still exciting news that he is interesting. I think we could dominate the ACC with him. It’s also exciting because I would love to piss VT fans off.
I understand what you're saying
I think most of us would prefer Smart, but there aren’t many people out there that maximize talent better than Bud Foster. The guy is as fiery as they come, and he would recruit well in Florida after he established some connections. I would love to have Foster, but I agree that he currently is not the recruiter that Kirby is.
>>---l>
I believe I would als rather have Smart, but this really does seem to magnify:
Bud Foster’s (proven Defense) vs Kirby Smart’s (Maybe it’s his Defense, maybe Saban’s)
and I’m not sure I agree that you always hire someone you know (you especially don’t hire a friend)…These people are always harder to fire if things don’t work out. I also think the ties to Fisher were more important based on who we thought would be available. Fisher had to get the call right, and needed someone he could trust. When you have a proven coach of Bud’s caliber that wants to be a part of what you’re building, the ties become less important, because you know the guys a hard worker and gets the job done.
Saban wouldn't keep him
And Smart wouldn’t bother to stay.
From reports I’ve gotten from guys like FSUn, you don’t just get to come to work comfortably and work for Nick Saban. You work your tail off and your family grows to hate Nick.
With that being said, its very unlikely Smart is hiding under Saban
I wouldn't be disappointed
with either choice, as it would be a huge improvement. Foster would bring ACC knowledge, which would help with us winning a conference title. But Smart has the better defense, assuming it is his. And might allow us to defeat a Bradfordless OU and a Charlie Strong, Tebowless UF. I don’t see either sticking around for long though.
Just toying around with some VT numbers
I know Foster is an obvious improvement but I was just curious
It's a beautiful day in Tallahassee
by RaysnNoles on Dec 3, 2009 11:46 AM EST reply actions 2 recs
If we had their scheme with our Athletes and a healthy Ponder......
Oh well we didn’t and we are 6-6, I need to stop dreaming. Too many if’s since I started going to school at FSU in 2001
NO
He is entrenched in an old school scheme that is not designed to attack the spread. We’ve had that. What we need now is a bright, young, adaptable mind.
You're right.
I didn’t, just part of it. It does indeed look promising. Now I’d have no problem with him coming here, IF it’s not because he’s burnt out and looking for a “rest”. His job will be harder, and he’ll have to work hard here, to turn things around than he did at VT.
by PeachTreeNole on Dec 3, 2009 12:08 PM EST up reply actions
I think he'd be looking for a platform to get himself a HC job
So he’d be highly motivated. Another guy I’d want to groom a protege under.
>>---l>
Actually, I'm very happy with that outcome :)
(my kid’s a Redcoat and had to fly back early after Thanksgiving for the game, and he has GT friends he didn’t want to hear mouthing off).
by PeachTreeNole on Dec 3, 2009 12:39 PM EST up reply actions
Foster would take the talent here and the sky would be the limit for him
But from who I talk to that follow VT sports closely, he wants to be a HC and is also 50 years old.
"as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are My ways higher than your ways and My thoughts than your thoughts."
One angle is that he knows the sky is the limit here, and we are down.
Everyone expects a solid VT D year in and year out. If he could help turn FSU around with the the talent that is here, and the offensive production, that could springboard him into a HC position.
I was reading one of his quotes where he asked Beamer if he was going to have to accept a lower tier job to gain the experience necessary to come back as a HC. Coaching at FSU may be a better option to him that taking a lower tier job?
I can definitely see your angle.
If Beamer makes it clear that he is staying around a long time it would make it more appealing (which I think Beamer is).
Either way, I think its a long shot. Does Foster have any connections/history with Jimbo?
"as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are My ways higher than your ways and My thoughts than your thoughts."
I want Jeff Bowden for DC
He knows how to stop an offense!
Bad joke.
Probably old, I know.
But I hadn’t heard it before today. :)
I think the most interesting thing about this info is
the curiosity of where it came from? Who leaked it? I first heard about it on here last night in the fanshot, and did some searching. I can’t find anything in the VT camps that suggest anything like this.
I haven't heard of this until now.
I would absolutely love to see Foster come here. I don’t see it happening though.
I don't see either Foster or Smart coming here
We need to focus on like-minded DCs at smaller colleges. I don’t give a damn about a big name, just hire the best man for the job
2009 Rays Baseball: Welp.....we'll try again in 2010
2009 FSU Football: Thanks for the memories, Bobby Bowden
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