Florida State's Spring Quarterback Battle
by Bud Elliott on Feb 24, 2009 3:54 AM EST
in FSU Football
76 comments
With Seminole basketball doing so well, you might not have realized that Spring practice is right around the corner. The players are currently surviving Mat Drills and will begin practicing on March 2nd. This spring, the 'Noles offense will have a lot of questions to answer. Of the 29 guys listed in the 2008 two-deep, 21 will return. Let's take a look at the position battles we're likely to see hear about, since Jimbo doesn't allow people to watch practice.
Senior leader Drew Weatherford departs, which isn't considered a football loss by most following the 'Noles. Ultra-talented head case D'Vontrey Richardson will play baseball this spring and I don't believe we'll see him play football again for the 'Noles, as he is expected to be a top pick in baseball's amateur draft. D'Vo has said he will move to safety and play in the fall, but in any case he won't be playing this spring and won't be playing quarterback again.
This leaves Florida State with only two scholarship quarterbacks for the spring. The incumbent, Redshirt Junior Christian Ponder struggled at times last year but still was a catalyst for the 'Noles resurgent top ranked ACC offense.
Those numbers are for ACC play only (8 games), in an attempt to filter out most of the noise.
On their face, those numbers aren't impressive at all. To understand what Ponder meant to this offense, you need to understand how the running game went from three consecutive years ranked 78th or worse nationally to a top twenty ground attack. More importantly, Ponder moved the offense and took the necessary risks that his predecessor did not. Ponder's greatest assets were his intelligence, his understanding of the offense, and his legs. The above numbers include sacks (of which Ponder did a great job to avoid behind highly suspect pass protection from the youngest offensive line in college football). They don't show you that Ponder rushed for more than 40 first downs in conference play. Ponder was the master of keeping drives alive. A punt is a failed drive except in the rairest of circumstances and it is here that Ponder's value was really measured.
| Punts= Failed Drives | # of Punts Overall | # of Punts ACC |
| 2007 (Weatherford/ Lee) | 76 | 53 |
| 2008 (Ponder/ D'Vo) | 41 | 25 |
Typically I do not like using team metrics to gauge individual performance. With Ponder, however, the effects were profound. Ponder led the 'Noles to the #1 rated offense in 2008 Teams had to respect his pre-snap read ability and his legs, a combination that worked to produce favorable rushing conditions through much of 2008.
If you want a really substantive look at how the offense improved in 2008, please see Did the Florida State Seminoles improve in 2008?
Despite being a significant improvement over the options FSU had for much of the past decade, Ponder still has some major flaws. He often made poor reads; a surprising outcome for someone who usually made a pre-snap diagnosis with relative ease. He would lock in on one target for far too long and didn't use his eyes to look off members of the opposing secondary. Annoyingly, he developed happy feet. There have been debates raging here for days over the origins of his pocket demeanor, with some arguing that he never learned to trust a line that was very shaky in the early season but improved later in the year, and others arguing that quarterbacks either "have it" or do not. Ponder also had problems with forgetting to slide and staying healthy; two areas he will need to work on through conditioning and decision making.
It is important to remember throughout these discussions that the ACC is an extremely defensive conference, putting more defensive players into the NFL than any other and having 8 of 12 head coaches who are decidedly defensive minded. Offense does not flourish in the NFL ACC like it does in the Big 12, a conference that produces no defensive players for the league.
Ponder's goal for the spring has to be trust. Ponder must trust his reads as he drops back. He must trust in his ability, which though not likely to land him in the professional ranks, is more than enough to be an excellent quarterback. He must trust his experience, his instincts and his coaches. Most importantly, however, he must trust that his offensive line can give him protection against a standard pass rush.
But if Christian Ponder continues to be a nervous wreck in the pocket, crouching like a ninja while he stares down his primary read, he might find himself watching the action from the bench.
Policy Note: Tomahawk Nation encourages open position battles at all times.
Nipping at his heels is highly touted redshirt freshman E.J. Manuel, a top-five recruit from 2008. Manuel is very impressive at 6' 5" and 225lbs.
Manuel is probably around 215 in that photo and he could stand to add another 10lbs to reach 235. Manuel can run, for sure, but don't fall into the trap of thinking that he's a running quarterback because he is black. Manuel is considered a pro-style passer. Ponder is the better runner of this group. He has an excellent arm and decidedly better mechanics than Ponder. Some believe that his mechanics are so fundamental that they are almost too "highschool-ish." Manuel does a nice job of driving the ball and he has an extremely high release point. Manuel will not have any problems with balls being batted down. At 6'5" and a release point way above his ear, the ball practically shoots down from the clouds.
Here's a small writeup on Manuel.
Many quarterback coaches now believe that it is wrong to overhaul a quarterbacks delivery. Instead, they try to focus on footwork. I don't have any idea about how Manuel's footwork is progressing, but I doubt it's much worse than Ponder's. Will Jimbo tinker with Manuel's delivery, which is currently too over the top? Manuel is often erratic and I do think Jimbo will tinker with his motion slightly, bringing him down to a less cartoonish motion that is still over the top.
My basic read on Manuel is that he is a hard worker and a great person. He has a stronger arm than Ponder and a higher upside as well. He needs to master all of the little things that Ponder already does well, namely the pre-snap reads. Jimbo Fisher routinely calls two or even three plays in one sequence and then asks his quarterback to get his team into the correct play, based on what he sees from the defense. Ponder was great at this and Fisher raved about it all year. Can Manuel do it? It remains to be seen.
I'll also be interested in how well he performs in the run game. With a depleted receiving corps, getting ground production from whoever plays quarterback will be crucial for the 'Noles.
Finally, will Manuel continue to be too nonchalant in the pocket? Calm, cool, and collected is good. Sleepwalking is not.
So, who will win?
I don't know. I think Ponder will win because he does a great job running the offense, has valuable experience, and is the better athlete. My guess is that he'll do just enough to hold off Manuel, who will have a good spring as well. Both quarterbacks will be counted on to contribute heavily in what will be an extremely tough schedule.
One thing we do know: it will be an open competition, and that's a good thing.
Tomorrow: the offensive line.
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GREAT READ!
My three cents for the debate:
1. for the record, I think manuel (although touted as a pocket passer first and foremost) is a much better athlete than you lead us to believe here. I wouldn’t say ponder is that much more athletic….just saying.
2. I think the rib injury that ponder carried middle to end of the season would give anyone “happy feet”. and QB’s “it” factor has nothing to do with happy feet, it;s pre and post snap reads. they either have"it" between their ears (see Ponder) or don’t (see D’vo). Manning had “happy feet” in college, but look at him now!
3. It is my beliefe that to much has been made around Tomahawk about him watching recievers. I didn’t see that very often after game three. I fully believe that sometimes he just knows were the ball is going before the snap (Jimbos pre-snap system and 3 plays at a time enables him to do that.)
Yeah, right!
Thanks Truec
C. Limited Interests.
1. Mortgages.
a) Northwest Farm Bureau Ins. Co. v. Althauser – the policyholders did not burn their house, but they did lie about the claim and make material misrepresentations.
i. The insurer can recover against the owners for the cost of paying off the banks for the mortgages.
ii. This is the “mortgage” exception mentioned above.
b) Insurers are not required to allow you to repair or rebuild; they can pay off the mortgage at their discretion (some states are exceptions).
2. Leaseholds.
a) Alaska Ins. Co. v. RCA Alaska Communications – the insurer was trying to recover against a tenant for causing the fire. The landlord was the insured.
i. Where the lease does not say whether the tenant is responsible for fire damage, the tenant is an implied co-insured, and the insurer cannot seek subrogation against its insureds.
b) Real estate sales.
i. In many sales, there is a window where the buyer owns but doesn’t yet have title or insurance.
ii. The rule from most courts is that the seller’s insurance is held in “trust” for the buyer if there is a loss.
c) Paramount Fire Ins. Co. v. Aetna Casualty and Surety Co. – both buyers and sellers had insurance on a house which burned right in the middle of the sale.
i. The purchase price was eventually still paid to the sellers, and after that point they had no loss.
ii. With no loss, the buyer’s insurance pays all.
3. Other Limited Interests.
a) The Home Ins. Co. v. Adler – a woman with only a life estate in a home died in the fire that burned it, and the insurer claims that since her interest ended at death, the estate suffered no loss.
i. The loss was realized at the moment the fire started, so it doesn’t matter how long she lived after that.
b) Folger Coffee v. The Great American Ins. Co. – property held by a bailee was destroyed in a fire.
i. The policy covers physical property and the insured does not have to show that the bailee was negligent in any way.
by Bud Elliott on Feb 24, 2009 11:46 AM EST up reply actions
This article and the ensuing comments have already generated more analysis than anything offered (or will be offered) at any FSU paysite.
Not to mention I now know the consequences of making false claims and material misrepresentations in the event that my house burns down. Also free. My belief? This was no accident.
Thanks, Truec
I’m not implying Manuel’s a slug. Far from it, he is athletic. I’m just warning people not to fall into the trap. I think Ponder had the happy feet problem because his offensive line was atrocious in fall practice and he never got into that comfort zone.
by Bud Elliott on Feb 24, 2009 11:47 AM EST up reply actions
Good stuff.
Does Manuel have it? I think he does.
Kill a fly with an axe - Mickey Andrews, his 1998 playbook
0.02$
I think Ponder gets the start. I think its importen to put EJ in from time to time to give him a few plays on long drives to 1) give ponder a quick brake and 2) to have him get to the sideline to talk to jimbo about something they want the other to see. I want to see EJ get some play time to get him better ready to take over when his time comes. If Both QB are this good we might see them coming in each week with a dif look
Week one Ponder is the throwing QB and EJ runs,
Week 2 Ponder runs and EJ throws
Week 3 Ponder 1st and 4th downs and EJ 2nd and #rd.
and so on this would make teams have to not get ready for 2 QB but 4 realy because they have no clue what the 2 are going to be doing. Just an Idea dont know if it could work.
I think switching QBs every week would be detrimental to the QBs rythm...
I have never really been a big fan of the 2 QB system, but I do like your second point on getting Ponder to the sidelines to talk to Jimbo.
by UnstopaNole99! on Feb 24, 2009 10:39 AM EST up reply actions
I think we will need to use both of them
because it is unlikely one quarterback will stay healthy the entire season.
by Bud Elliott on Feb 24, 2009 11:48 AM EST up reply actions
If either plays like Ponder did last year,
yes. The line necessitated his scrambling via questionable protection. It did not make him dive and refuse to slide.
Plus, someone needs to take D’Vo’s carries. Who will shoulder that load?
Stoud just needs to put about 40 lbs. and 4 inches of height onto him. No problem.
It seems to me the D’vos most significant playing time came against Championship Division schools. Bert could probably run really fast up the sideline or roll out and chunk the ball as far as he can without geting hurt.
If D’vo is still around he could play both ways as long as the only offense he plays is in the wildcat formation. If by some crazy chance he is still around next fall, I don’t think he’ll be getting any significant PT as a safety anyway.
Given our lack of quarterback depth, I would rather risk Reed or Givens getting hurt than Manuel.
We are going to need to keep Reed healthy
We might have WR problems next year and we know Reed can be a go to guy. We dont need to take a chance when we have another QB thats just as good if not maybe better.
Quality.
I agree, Ponder may not have great numbers but his ability to keep drives alive helped tremendously- Miami game especially. You never know what would happen if Ponder wasn’t the QB, but what we do know is exactly what you pointed out, that he kept drives alive and its hard to take that away from him since he proved it on the field. The scampers on third down, the pass to Easterling during the VT game, the ball thrown pretty well to Carr in the endzone before the end of the first half vs. Wisconsin, those were the most memorable plays (for me) that Ponder completed, which signaled a beggining of an era of better Quater Backing. The Wake Forest game, however, had me worried A LOT.
If it become obvious that our passing game will be lackluster, it seems to make sense to have Ponder as QB if he is the more agile and quicker QB. If so, the option play could be more of a weapon in the playbook. You have pointed out a couple times that when the QB is running with the ball it opens up an extra blocker (the RB, or whoever would have been taking the ball). I would like to see the option pass included. Have ponder roll to the side of our best tackle, corners without a doubt would at somepoint make a mental error or be forced to try to do too many things at once which would leave someone open, and let Ponder make the decision. I bet Caz could really help us here. Jarmon could bully his CB.
"I am the way, the truth, and the life, no one gets to the Father but through me"
Thanks FSUva
I seem to remember us running some sort of option pass. Maybe with D’vo, GTech game?
by Bud Elliott on Feb 24, 2009 11:51 AM EST up reply actions
Ill have to take a look. I'm hoping I can access your play by play review during the season somewhere on this site.
"I am the way, the truth, and the life, no one gets to the Father but through me"
One of the best reads in quite a while.
I don’t have a ton to add, however, I will say it will be interesting to see what happens in the Miami game. We are starting the season against a team who can confuse a quarterback with coverages and unbelievable athletes in the secondary. If Ponder does poorly in this game, will Jimbo give him time to figure it out against BYU USF and Jacksonville State or will Ponder be under a quick trigger finger?
I would say Jimbo is intellegent and will be committed to a quarterback longer than Bobby has been, however the only thing that worries me is the Florida game. Yes, Ponder was hurting which may have been the reason he was pulled or was it his poor start to the game? I think it will be important for the quarterback who wins the competition to have a little wiggle room.
"I have come that you may have life, and life to the max"
would say Jimbo is intellegent and will be committed to a quarterback longer than Bobby has been, however the only thing that worries me is the Florida game. Yes, Ponder was hurting which may have been the reason he was pulled or was it his poor start to the game?
That’s a debatable topic. I can say with certainly, however, that Jimbo never lets the ship navigate into troubled waters like ND 2002.
I hope
that he will be wise enough to judge his quarterback play in relation to the talent level of the opponent and the talent level of his supporting cast. I don’t know what will happen if Ponder does as you suggested.
by Bud Elliott on Feb 24, 2009 11:50 AM EST up reply actions
Lets just hope the Wake Forest game (i.e. the first "real" game of the season) isn't a habitual issue with Ponder.
Lets not forget how terrible the OL was at pass protection. I can only imagine the pschological damage done (even sub) to pocket presence when success rides on Ponder’s shoulders to make a first down and he has what, 3 to 5 seconds to be the hero with the center being backed up right into your line of vision.
"I am the way, the truth, and the life, no one gets to the Father but through me"
Wake Forest's
defense won’t be near what it was with the loss of Curry and Smith.
"I have come that you may have life, and life to the max"
Miami's might though, and they are not the first real game of the season.
Literally this time, with no warm-up act.
"I am the way, the truth, and the life, no one gets to the Father but through me"
They ***are***, sorry I shouldn't do this while I finish another assignment.
"I am the way, the truth, and the life, no one gets to the Father but through me"
for some reason I switched your, Ponder, etc.
"I am the way, the truth, and the life, no one gets to the Father but through me"
Nice job Uncensored
I wish I was as confident about the WRs as I am about the QBs. The two kinda go together… that whole throwing and catching deal.
Great stuff on the drive sustainability.
Those punt number are excellent insight. As the DW/CP war waged last spring, the main DW argument was his ability to limit turnovers in 2007 (at an unsustainable rate, mind you). I always maintained that picks are hurtful, but you have to quantify that a certain number of punts is eventually equal to an interception.
CP’s pick-6 against Miami was actually “OK” when you think about how many more drives he saved and kept Travis Benjamin off the field. Imagine if another QB started that game and had zero picks, but we punted 9 times. I think we lose.
And whoever thinks that Ponder doesn’t lock onto a receiver and under utilize progressions, you watched different games than I did.
I'll be adding in the turnover numbers
and adjusting for the fewer plays run per game in 2008 compared to 2007. The difference is still large, but it won’t be twice as good as my numbers currently imply.
by Bud Elliott on Feb 24, 2009 11:52 AM EST up reply actions
Just wanted to say great read, I dont post much but I am always reading...
Thanks again for a great site guys!
by UnstopaNole99! on Feb 24, 2009 10:36 AM EST reply actions
Does anyone really know how "athletic" EJ really is?
Wasn’t EJ the one impersonating our opponent’s mobile qb’s? Wilson, Taylor…? And i thought i remember people singing his praises on his ability to paint a pretty realistic picture for our D of what they were about to face?
Did anyone really know how quick Ponder was till that game against BC up in Chestnut Hill when Drew got knocked out? I remember thinking out loud when he took off…“holy *&^% he’s fast”
Well you can watch their high school film if you have access
Ponder did have the fastest pro-shuttle time on the team.
I’m not implying Manuel’s a slug. Far from it, he is athletic. I’m just warning people not to fall into the trap.
by Bud Elliott on Feb 24, 2009 11:03 AM EST up reply actions
Sorry i knew what you were saying...
it was just more of a question that outside of his high school film has anyone actually seen him because i certainly haven’t. Just heard all of his praises…I’m guessing he can throw a better deep ball than Ponder. Possibly hitting a receiver in stride rather than Ponder’s style which looks like he is outside playing 500 with a couple buddies on the street.
great post though
In my humble opinion
Ponder was an upgrade at the quarterback position. His legs helped solidify a running game that (like Uncensored said) went from 78th and lower in the NCAA to the top 20 this past year. Ponder, for the most part, protected the football and helped the running game sustain drives. He took a few more chances than we had taken in the Weatherford era and I think this got people pumped more than anything.
I, for one, am ready to see a passing attack that compliments our running attack. I’m not sure from what I’ve seen that Ponder will become the passer that we need him to be. Jogging in place and having 30 yard conversations with the receivers he aims to throw to are not condusive indicators of a Manning-in-waiting or a Matt-Ryan-clone…
I am excited about EJ and the possibilities he brings to the table. I am not trying to take anything away from the fantastic job Ponder did at leading the team this last year, but I am thinking that everyone is settling for something if they are content right now. We have been so used to play-it-safe mediocrity that I’m afraid we are all becoming lulled into a false sense of security because this guy is better than what we had… 1200 yards in 8 games is averaging around 150 passing yards a game. That is simply not good enough. Pile on top of that the fact that Ponder only threw 6 TD passes with almost twice as many INTS against our ACC foes and you may want to stop and think for a minute…
'Gentlemen, it is better to have died a small boy than to fumble this football.' John Heisman
by Nattylite on Feb 24, 2009 12:12 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
GREAT POST
Great post as usual. I don’t post as often as I’d like, but I can assure you, Tomahawk is up and running everyday.
I would like to see both CP and EJ play. Desman has a good point – it would be like preparing for 4 QBs.
Does CP mind sharing? Is he a team player in that respect? From what I can tell I think he is.
Practically
Ponder will not stay healthy if he rushes over 100 times in conference games (sacks included), given his style.
He might not have to run as much next year.
If the o-line improves the RB might get to carry more weight then they did this year. Smith was a good back but never lived up to his hype. I think Jermaine Thomas and Ty jones will do a better job not because they are better but because they will have a better line and Jimbo at the helm.
I disagree here
I think he will have to run more, because Ty Jones Diabates makes him a non-factor. Pressley’s recovery from knee surgery is very much up in their air, and Chris Thompson needs surgery as well.
Additionally, Ponder will need to run in the SoFla and BYU games— replacing the games he had against D1-AA teams, where running was not necessary.
Great read.
I am very anxious to see what EJ can do. The things I hear about him make me very excited about our future.
Glad you enjoyed, 23
Manuel is an amazing prospect and one of the few 19 yearolds with clear NFL potential.
If the WR live up to there hype,
and Trickett and Jimbo stay on the same path, EJ might just get easy ride into the NFL. Lets hope so FSU isnt that far behind some of the big top teams.
I hope manuel wins the job
I thought ponder did well last season. But with that said, i don’t think he’s gonna be good enough to lead us vs elite teams.
I mean really all ponder did last season was run and throw bubbles and short passes where the receivers ran after the catch and made big yards for us. How many times did ponder throw downfield and hit someone on a deep corner route or deep in? Slants downfield didn’t work well either.
Ponder had a nice amount of throws each game that SHOULD have been picked off also. I guess we could argue he’s young and that was the reason why. But really it was b/c of the lack of confidence he has in his self. As many said on this site. If he didn’t progress in the passing department. We won’t be able to defeat elite teams just running the ball from the qb position.
With the said, i hope manuel wins
I thought ponder did well last season. But with that said, i don’t think he’s gonna be good enough to lead us vs elite teams.
Entirely possible.
I mean really all ponder did last season was run and throw bubbles and short passes where the receivers ran after the catch and made big yards for us. How many times did ponder throw downfield and hit someone on a deep corner route or deep in? Slants downfield didn’t work well either.
This is a big point of contention for many here. I tend to think he’s not a good downfield thrower but not a horrible one. Part of the problem was that teams were able to generate the pressure of a 6 man rush while rushing only 4 men.
I need to combine all of this in one huge post, but going through the games…
- Wake totally dominated us up front, never had to blitz, and could drop a million into coverage.
- Colorado didn’t blitz and kept everyone deep… we ran for over 200 yards on them.
- Miami palyed man with 2 deep safeties, little room to throw deep, and we played in a monsoon. We ran like crazy.
- NCST, our defense played like garbage, they had a ferocious pass rush without blitzing, and chose to take away the deep ball. We ran the ball and threw bubbles.
- GTech played a hollow shell, giving us the slant all day, as well as the draw with JT. They were very concerned about the deep ball. We only had one open all game, questionably, and it was D’Vo who hit it on the trick play.
- VTech… was not a big defense, they had to use 8 men to defend us. This was the first team who focused on stopping our run game and challenged Ponder to throw downfield (Wake stopped the run game without focusing on it). Ponder threw two deep balls to Ponder, beating press coverage.
- BC… did exactly what Wake did. We had no run game as they stopped it with 6 men in the box. No QB would have done anything that day with the way they were able to destroy our OLine.
*UF had the #2 defense in the ’Nation, ponder played terribly, and probably should not have played at all.
I think until our offensive line is "mature" we will continue to struggle with teams that have excellent an excellent defensive line.
The two games where I thought our offense looked the most stagnant and painful to watch, were the Wake Forest and BC games. (I’m excluding the UF game because I don’’t want to go there)
I think we typically took what the defense gave us and our offense did not dictate the nature of the game. That starts up front. We exploited the holes in our opponents defense, which in theory should be a good thing. However, when we faced balanced defenses that were able to stop the run up front, without any extra help from the secondary, and who were able to provide moderate to good coverage deep, we struggled. We weren’t successful on offense, which I think frustrated Jimbo. I’m glad he was able to recognize our opponents deficiencies and use it to our advantage, but I don’t think it was from our offense doing an amazing job.
When our line is able to consistently pass block, including blitzes, and get some push off the line, I think we will have much greater success (thanks for stating the obvious TC). To win football games, you have to dictate the pace and keep the defense on their heels (from the offensive perspective). You have to control the line of scrimmage. If a defensive line dictates the movement of the offensive line, it’s over. That happened too often last year.
by TrueCubbie on Feb 24, 2009 6:14 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
If a defensive line dictates the movement of the offensive line, it’s over. That happened too often last year.
To wit, our zone scheme often “takes the defender where he wants to go”. That’s a generality, which isn’t always possible. If a defender wants to remain stationary or wants to go in a direction that affords him beneficial leverage, the offensive lineman must stop this. This is where our line failed. It is no coincidence that Wake and BC were significantly larger in the front 7 than our other opponents. They were able to maintain their collective point of attack.
this is a problem when speed meets STR.
We can have the fastest guys on the D-line but we have to have some beef too. I think thats not going to happen tell MA is gone.
so Andy Staples wrote up an article on the choice jobs in college football
Im linking to the page where we are. Needless to say, he doesnt have a bone of homerism in his body. Unfortunately, I can’t disagree.
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/writers/andy_staples/02/23/destination-jobs/2.html
I figured this was as good a spot as any.
Thanks, Miami
BlueApocalypse actually already posted this as a fanshot (right sidebar), so I’d refer you to the discussion there.
It's Ponder's job to lose
Unless he looks terrible and EJ lights it up of course. I say we’ll know who will be the starter the season for sure after the USF game. If we get off to a 4-0 start and Ponder looks good, it’s his job for the season. If not, then I think EJ will be begin to see snaps, if not the job outright.
"I smoke. If this bothers anyone, I suggest you look around at the world in which we live and shut your mouth."-Bill Hicks
by Jonathan Loesche on Feb 24, 2009 6:16 PM EST reply actions
Jimbo has been consistent in saying that he conducts job interviews in the offseason and isn't into fli-flopping his starter.
Let’s hope he’s able to.
Yeah, but let's be honest
The season will practically be decided by the end of the USF game. Unless it’s because of obvious defensive mistakes, the fanbase will be screaming for EJ if we aren’t 4-0. Obviously this is assuming EJ doesn’t beat Ponder outright in Spring.
"I smoke. If this bothers anyone, I suggest you look around at the world in which we live and shut your mouth."-Bill Hicks
by Jonathan Loesche on Feb 24, 2009 6:22 PM EST up reply actions
4-0 isn't a realistic expectation
It’s a solid goal. I guess some think we have the makings of a top 10 team or something. I do not.
I believe it is
We get a Miami team learning a new scheme, a 1-AA opponent, a consistently overrated “Mid Major” in BYU, and who knows what with USF. I’m not saying bet the farm on us winning in the Swamp, I’m saying I think 4-0 is realistic
"I smoke. If this bothers anyone, I suggest you look around at the world in which we live and shut your mouth."-Bill Hicks
by Jonathan Loesche on Feb 24, 2009 6:52 PM EST up reply actions
Perhaps I'm feeling uncharacteristly optimistic but
UM 70%
Jax St 99.9%
BYU 80%
USF 55%
"I smoke. If this bothers anyone, I suggest you look around at the world in which we live and shut your mouth."-Bill Hicks
by Jonathan Loesche on Feb 24, 2009 6:58 PM EST up reply actions
I can work with those.
You’re saying that we will be favored by
5 points over Miami
10 over BYU &
2 over USF.
Still, your “optimistic” numbers say we will win 3.05 out of our first 4 games. Basically, just as close to going 2-2 as we are to 4-0.
If I may make some Minor changes:
6 over Miami
7 over BYU
4 over USF.
I think BYU is the only team that might beat us untell
we get into ACC play then I couldnt tell you. I want to say UF will be the only team but I think the ACC will be just as crazy next year as this only dif is we make it to the ACCAG and OB. My goal is the OB because I feel we can do that.
thats what happened up here at USC(carolina)
chris smelley started and by the end the fans called for steven garcia. Was it the write call I dont think so because a true Fr taking over a steve spurrier offence thats just a sign for disaster. I dont want to see EJ out there tell hes ready.
The last article was one of the best ever
I didn’t get a comment in before it closed.
I do believe there is a legion of gator fans who thoroughly enjoy watching BB stay on. I have to admit I had a “We love Galen Hall” poster on my car at one time. I used to kid guys at the Elks Club and ask who around here is taking up money for boosters, I want to kick in a 20 spot for Galen.
On Clemson’s coach if lose to at team coached by somebody named Dabo I don’t think I could bear it.
I myself am only banned on the rivals college sounding board. It was partially my fault as the gators would start low level flaming and I would respond with a brick bat. They didn’t seem to like my signature choices either.
I did have my signature link cutoff at warchant for about a year. I could run off at the tkeyboard but no sigs.
Getting back to the quarterbacks I can’t bring myself to around to worrying about it. Quarterbacks get injured all the time as VT, GT, UNC and several other schools went through it. Ponder runs a lot also and it wouldn’t surprise me to see him dinged. Sooner or later we will see E. J. under center most likely out of necessity.
I was really hoping to see more of Presley and Ty Jones last season but we all see how that worked out. I don’t count on much until I see who survives spring training.
I thin Ponder can be a very good quarterback. There were times last season like the Miami game where I was convinced we had the next Roger Staubach on hand and then he would have some very lackluster games but he was really a first year quarterback.
UF is one injury away from Tebow to being a very interesting team to watch also. Don’t forget the computer stealer was being groomed to take his place and he is no longer around. I can’t see Brantley providing any of the heroics Tebow produces.
It was also mentioned earlier by someone that Tebow would be first round. Every draft analyst I have read talks about round 3 or 4. One stated emphatically that Tebow is not a passer he is a thrower. His delivery also is awkward such that it hurts his arm. That was the case before this season and I doubt they have done much about it. This is not the kind of stuff that induces NFL teams to shell out big bucks.
I have to compliment one poster because it is if he read my mind. For sometime I have been saying if the opponents wide receivers don’t catch the ball nobody will. Our dbs last year bring to mind the old Mexican saying manos de piedra, hands of stone!
Quote:
“I like good quality cornerbacks more. You know, the ones that can run, cover, and somehow catch a ball thrown right to them. You know, just the opposite of what we have right now except for P-Rob. I ESPECIALLY LIKE GOOD QUALITY CORNERBACKS THAT WANT TO COME HERE BUT OUR DUMBASS STAFF WON’T OFFER THEM. All caps for emphasis. Sorry about the yelling.”
hey, that last quote is mine from a while back!
That was before Reid hopped on board.
ncensored, remember the Jayron Hosley bromances?
Kill a fly with an axe - Mickey Andrews, his 1998 playbook
weinke couldnt run but he could thread aa needle to minnis
heres to hoping for that from ej
I think ponder is going to get better
I think hes going to start next year and I think hes going to get us to the next level. I think thats where we need to go. To me thats the ACCAG and/or the OB. I want ponder to win a OB and have EJ step in and take us back the the NC. Thats where I want us to go slow and stedy wins the race.
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