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Understanding Zone Blocking and Florida State's Offensive Line

Today I will try to teach you something about offensive line play.  Specifically, I will discuss Florida State's offensive line.  In this article, I'll cover the questions "why zone blocking?", "what is zone blocking?", and "what type of players do we need to run a zone system?"  In future editions, I'll cover specific plays and the passing game.

First, you may have heard that Florida State is primarily a zone blocking team.  This is a departure from the days of Mark Richt and those who preceded him, who favored "man blocking" schemes.

Zone Blocking developed as a response to the increasingly athletic defensive linemen seen over the past 20 years.  These defensive linemen would kill plays before they even began by achieving penetration in the backfield.  The more traditional style, "man blocking", required players to block a specific player, often one of those elite defensive linemen (think FSU beating on Kansas in the Meadowlands in the '93 Championship year).    It was very difficult for teams to find five offensive linemen who could man up and block their specified player, particularly when that assignment was shifting before the snap and running in all different crazy directions after the snap.  To do so would require exceptionally strong, smart, and athletic offensive linemen, and those type players do not come around too often.  As a counter, coaches began to devise ways for their players to deal with these freak defensive linemen.  Instead of blocking each lineman one on one, what if the entire offensive line blocked the defensive line, functioning as a unit?  Instead of each lineman having to adjust to the pre-snap movements, stinting, and post-snap twisting and stunting, the offensive line adjusted as a unit?  What if linemen worked as a unit instead of chasing around these freaks that teams were now employing at defensive tackle?  Welcome to zone blocking; the thinking man's way to block.  Again, the entire goal is to eliminate penetration.

 

Before I get into the mechanics of zone blocking, I want to establish a few philosophical goals.  Think of these goals as Florida State's end, and zone blocking as the means the 'Noles will use to reach that end. 

According to the father of zone running, Alex Gibbs, the man who designed the Denver Broncos running game with Terrell Davis (orchestrating one of the biggest super bowl upsets in the modern era), the entire key to the running game is to stay positive:

WE WANT NO NEGATIVES!  We look at pass as yes/ no, big/ little, big plays and zero plays (w/ negatives).  Out of a certain number of passes, we expect a certain number of failures.  That is the nature of the passing game.

But the run game the exact opposite.  We want NO negatives.  We do not want to run plays that are big/ little, even at the expense of big plays, we do not want it.  We want the system where even the "bad" play gains something.  The entire objective is to stay out of 3rd and long.  We throw out the run plays with which we cannot consistently avoid negatives.

Screw averages.  We want medians.  The back might average 7 yards per carry, but how often did he get stuffed and put us in 3rd and 10, causing a turnover.

And we do this by eliminating penetration and running a limited number of plays to perfection.

Gibbs was way ahead of his time.  NFL and college teams are now spending a lot of money to reach the same conclusion that Gibbs reached:  it's not what you average, it's what you consistently gain.  It is better to have a back average 4 yards per carry with minimal carries going for 0 or negative yards, than it is to have a back average 6 yards per carry but attain that average on a mix of long and bust runs.  This concept of staying out of unfavorable down and distance (2nd and 8+, 3rd and 5+, etc) is known as "leverage".  No matter the talent of the team, we now know that disaster is hugely correlated with poor leverage situations for the offense (high leverage situations for the defense).  By avoiding those situations, the offense can play with favorable leverage, and in turn, the frustrated and tired defense will begin to take unnecessary risks, allowing big plays.  I am not saying that big plays are not important, but rather that they will come if you build the proper foundation for them.  The big plays are a combination of execution and alignment, NOT design.  All of Florida State's base running plays are designed to go the distance if the defense gives a favorable alignment and the execution is good.  FSU does not run big/little running plays (outside of some situational stuff).    Bill Connelly has done some of the best publicly available work in the field for the college game, and I suggest you peruse his work here.  What causes offenses to fall into unfavorable leverage downs?  Penetration, of course!  And what do we want?  No Negatives. 

I know that you grew up on yards per carry, but I am here to tell you that it is time to change.  Know why Emmit Smith was more effective than Barry Sanders?  Consistency.  Barry often had the better yards per carry, but Emmit never lost yards and never put his team in a bad situation.

Florida State runs as a team.  The running game is not solely a function of the running back and the offensive line, bur rather every player has a crucial role in the successful execution of the rushing attack.  Running is a mentality.  The offensive line coach must be able to get on the wide receivers and their coach.  The head coach must allow the offensive line coach and offensive coordinator to get the wide receivers blocking.  The wide receivers coach must be on the same page, and the ultimate effect is that the receivers must be a desirous participant in the run game.  The quarterback is also a huge part of the scheme, carrying out fakes which allow designated defenders to stay unblocked but at the same time out of the play.

I believe there are three important principles of zone running.  First, deny penetration.  Second, re-establish the line of scrimmage.  Third, render the playside linebacker ineffective.  The ultimate goal is to stretch the defense laterally, providing secure creases for the runner.

 

What is zone blocking ("ZB")? 

It's actually exactly what it sounds like.  Offensive linemen are looking to block zones instead of assigned men.  Each lineman, either by himself or in conjunction with an adjacent linemate must account for and block a designated space.  This is different from man blocking, in which each lineman must block a specified man.  Zone blocking is very socialist.  It it a team concept, not a collective individual concept.   With zone blocking, the lineman will advance to their designated area, and block any player in that area in an attempt to "win" the zone.  If the zone is initially empty, they will continue through their zone, possibly help out an adjacent lineman, or proceed to the 2nd level, (LB's and defensive backs).  You may find it useful to think of this in basketball terms, with zone and man defense.  The concept is for two adjacent linemen to come off in unison and attack a defensive lineman to the play side.  Unlike man blocking, where each player has an assigned man to block; zone blocking creates an initial double-team with two players blocking a single defensive lineman. This allows the offensive linemen to be very aggressive because they know they have help from their linemate..  It is this initial team that creates movement at the point of attack, and from which the runner will make his read and find the developing hole.. 

This is an image from an old Bob Davie article that no longer exists on ESPN.

Double_teams_medium

The "W, M, and S" are the Weakside, Middle, and Strongside linebackers.  They are aligned in a traditional "under" front, which is similar to what Florida State runs.  You can see the backside guard and tackle double team the defensive tackle, while the playside guard and tackle double team the playside (right) defensive and.  It's almost impossible for those double teamed players to achieve meaningful penetration.

A double team, however, takes two players, and eventually, one of the offensive linemen will disengage (after the other double team partner has secured the doubled defender) to attack the linebacker.  Teamwork, experience, and trust are key here.  Again, back to the diagram:  

Disengage_medium

Davie has two good examples of this teamwork, which I have condensed into a single diagram. 

Alternates_medium

This seems simple enough, but being able to gauge when your doubling partner is in position to gain sole control of the target defender is not easy. 

 

The zone scheme is designed to create organized chaos at the LOS. The location of the running lanes are impossible for the D to predict from play to play. This variability strains the flexibility of every defensive system, making the location of run fits more difficult to predict and preparation more complex. It challenges the mental discipline of the defense, which is particularly difficult for college defenses, who often depend on athletic talent alone.  It increases the likelihood of an error leading to a large gain.  Fear of such errors can make the defense less aggressive and give the initiative to the O-line; or can make the defense too aggressive, allowing better cut back lanes for the diligent runner.  Just as QBs who are able to run through progressions are more successful in today's game than QBs who run a set play, the zone system gives a quality runner, the man with the best view of the action, decision making power to choose from multiple options dictated by his reads.  From PatsFans.

 

This youtube video is a pretty good explanation of some of these principles:


 


Zone blocking takes a specific type of offensive lineman

Ideally, you want a lineman who is 6'6 320lbs, stronger, faster, and smarter than anyone else.  Unfortunately, reality takes over, and we realize that there are probably only 7 or 8 men in the world who fit that bill and most of them play on Sundays.  (Bill Parcells calls this the planet theory).  From the remaining group of lineman, each probably have a few good traits and a few less desirable attributes.  The key with any system is determining which attributes are critical and which are not, and then focusing on exploiting a market inefficiency, if any.

What do we look for in an offensive lineman?  Let's take this from a speech by Alex Gibbs (legendary Zone Blocking coach of the Denver Broncos and one of the closest guys I've seen to Florida State line coach Rick Trickett in terms of technique and demeanor).:  (roughly transcribed from a video someone sent me)

Above all, we want guys who want play so bad they could die.  We want guys who can run, who are athletic, who have "recoverability", but who maybe lacks bulk and strength.  Maybe doesn't know what his body is about yet.  We want guys who are going to take advantage of that redshirt year. 

TACKLES:  Tall, length, maybe no basic strength, but he can run, and we're willing to let him add that power. 6'5 1/2" is usually the max we want.

GUARDS & CENTERS:  height and length doesn't mean ****.  Marginal height, but plays with great leverage.  "LOW WAISTED" (long torso short legs), with leverage under our bodies.  Healthier by not being heavy.   RARE for them to play early.  Nobody over 6'3".  My center must be football brilliant.

Very intelligent on the inside.  The "test score limit would SCARE YOU."  We make calls from the inside out (centers call guards, guards tell tackles what to do, tackles tell tight ends what to do.  Thus, there's a chain of decreasing responsibility)

No introverts for any position (communication.  Low power-distance culture guys between each other and the coach).

All of them must have the ability to step laterally while keeping their shoulders square to the line of scrimmage (or risk allowing penetration).

Injury history is very important.  don't want guys who miss games, because of the importance of continuity.  4 of the 5 usually get offseason surgery.  NO EGO.   INSIDE 3 must be brilliant.  huge amount of time is spent on these guys making decisions.  Guards must be able to decipher intricate details from the opponent's stance. 

But, there is a minimum threshold of strength that a guy must have.  Cannot have guys who get driven back.

Now, FSU played the youngest line in football last year, and that was effective thanks to Rick Trickett, the best offensive line coach in college football.  Our offensive line scheme is not designed for young kids, in fact, it's the opposite. It's an absolute testament to Trickett's coaching job that FSU's line did what they did last year.  In a normal recruiting year in which FSU will not count on freshmen to play the offensive line, we are looking for smart athletes.  Not big hulking slobs, but athletes.  If you'd balk at a recruit playing third base or left field for your company softball team, he's not the type we want.  And he needs to be smart; possessing both football intelligence and book smarts.  He must understand not only his assignment, but also the defense's alignment and tendencies.  That player must be able to correctly give and receive adjustments at the line.  Also important is his commitment to the system.  Even if his block makes little sense individually, he must be willing to do it because he understands it is but one piece in the puzzle that is the running game.  Strength bulk do not matter in a recruit, because we feel we can add that, and when we do, we want that kid to retain his athleticism (quickness and agility). 

Here is a Venn Diagram to illustrate the point. 

Oline_venn_diagram_medium

Again, last year Florida State was woefully undersized: 

Antone_and_datko_medium

This man is not a tight end!

That's Andrew Datko, freshman All-American Offensive Tackle.  He was 6'5 1/2", 270lbs soaking wet.  Now ideally we do not want to play a 270lb tackle, but last year did not leave FSU with an alternative.  We want him to play at about 290lbs.  Datko fit the bill, however, because he worked very hard, played through injury (separated shoulder), executed his assignment even when it seemed pointless, outquicked a lot of defensive ends, and played with great technique.

I'd be remiss if I didn't add this excerpt from Gibbs:

Your group and your chemistry is more important then your plays.  The ability to get the guys to function as a unit is paramount and is often not achieved.  [Trickett is great at this.]   I don't get Christmas cards, but I do get handshakes and head nods.  Been to a lot of topless bars with my guys guys.  I did whatever it took to get these guys comfortable with each other and with me.  My guys talk all the time.  They are closer with the guy next to them than they are with their wives.

Experience is absolutely crucial.  Even int he NFL, I'll take our draft picks and put them on our scout team for two years before they can play for us, and these are guys we drafted because we think they fit our system!

 

We also look for a specific type of running back. 

The zone scheme can be frustrating for a running back at first because he was usually the best guy in high school, never had to know what to read or look for, and just typically did whatever he wanted.  The zone scheme is very professional in that it asks the player to perform a specific task and be part of a greater plan.  The runner must understand the system.  He must be focused on his point of attack read and then his secondary read.  This can often be very boring for him.  As we've seen countless times, however, that player will reap the benefits of a well run zone system and he will get his yards.  The runner must stick with the system, trust the system, and not deviate from the system.  When the light comes on, bam!, he will reach a point where his eye's light up and he understands that the defense's pre-snap alignment is primed to get absolutely shredded.

Backs in zone schemes need to be "One Cut Runners", or "1C" runners.  For more on this, let's turn to Denver

A "1C" is a runner (he can be either powerful or fast) who starts to run in one direction, and when he sees a hole open up in the defense he cuts back to that opening and runs in a straight line.  This goes against the instincts of most players.

Some RBs "juke", which means they fake side to side movements, and use agility to gain yards.  Other players commit right away and dedicate themselves to a play or a direction.  [Neither of these are desirable in this system.  Antone Smith dedicated himself to a direction way too early.]

But 1Cs must have patience and vision.  They must be able to run towards the direction of the play, have the vision to not commit until the see an opening, and the discipline to make "one cut" towards the hole and to stick with it. They must also have the confidence to pick a hole, since the coordinator doesn't pick it for him, but rather it is based off a read or series of reads.

Another key for a 1C is the ability to keep one's legs moving during a tackle.  This is because most RBs like to spin or juke (or use other methods), but a 1C usually faces tackles in confined spaces where other methods don't work (confined because the second level is full of OLs, not just LBs).  This is another reason why Antone did not run well in our system; he went down when his legs got tangled.  Here again, the 1C does what does not come naturally to most RBs.

In addition to the above, we require a runner with  Precision (in their cuts), Patience, Vision, and Determination  

The runner must be decisive and confident, both in himself and his system.  He has to trust the system.  Occasionally, there will be a huge hole opening up where the play is absolutely not designed to go.  The player must be disciplined enough not to fall for the trap.  Sometimes it might work, other times it might not, but cutting to a hole that is not based on the runner's read is a recipe for bad habits and negative plays (see above).  Deviating from the system turns the running game into big/little, which we cannot tolerate.  Again, our running game is all about having no negatives, even at the expense of bigger plays.  As discussed above, the evidence is overwhelmingly clear that avoiding unfavorable leverage situations is more beneficial to an offense than turning a 5 yard run into a 10 yard run, for example. (see above).  This type of deviation can cause the system to lose structural integrity.  Our runners get one precise cut, and they must make the best of it.  There is a minimum level of discipline we require in our runners.  Some lesser runners have it and some supremely talented runners do not.  There are both philosophical and schematic reasons for this, and they play off each other. 

We cannot have an indecisive runner, either in choosing the hole or IN the hole.  By that, I mean that the determination of the running path must be made before the runner hits the hole.  Some backs do very well cutting inside holes, but our system kills players who depend on moving laterally within the hole.  There can be no decision making in the hole.  We are not looking for a runner who wants to make everyone miss.  That is a recipe for disaster in this system (and for fumbling).  Improvisation, at least in the formative stages of the play, is not tolerated.  

Coachability is a major factor as well.  One of the reasons you saw Denver and New England run this system so well without highly touted runners (at the time), was that their runners did not have the luxury to do it their own way.  5th or 6th round picks in the NFL must listen to everything a coach says and do everything right, absorbing all of the finer teaching points.  If they do not, they will be cut.  Star runners, however, can afford not to listen because they know they are under a huge contract and will not be cut.  You'll recall that the Broncos traded Clinton Portis away for Champ Bailey, in large part because they valued a corner over a runner, but also because they knew they could find another runner to function within their machine.  Applying this to college, we find that things get easier.  While a runner may be very highly recruited, there is no general manager pressuring the coach to play the highly recruited runner over a lesser recruited runner.  The only emphasis is on playing the runner who can best excel in the system.  In this way, it can force a star player to be more of a team player.  This is very important when you consider that this system, at least to the level FSU executes it, will be very new to almost all new college runners.

The runner needs to be able to understand what is being asked of him.  For instance, he may be asked to plant and explode to a hole that will not open for another step or two.  You may think this does not mesh with the patience requirement, but it does.  This is not a loaf scheme, we want the runner to spend the minimum amount of time in the backfield as possible, without running outside the constraints of the play.  We want the runner hiting the hole as soon as possible- but not too early.  Do not confuse this with guessing.  Ideally, we want him bursting through it right as it opens up.  We need him to see things based off the system, not through sight!  We want him to burst through the hole just as it opens up, and by judging his point of attack double team block, studying the system, and having good patience and a decisive cut, he can do just that.

Speed is not overly important in this system, but momentum quickness matter.  If the runner is small, he needs to be fast.  If he is a power runner, he can be slower.  In both situations, the runner needs to be able to clear the arm tackles in the hole without dancing, be that by running by them quickly, or running through them.  In either case, the runner's legs cannot stop at contact.  It is important to remember that because the runner initially runs parallel to the line of scrimmage as he reads his blocks and determines the hole, he is not able to build his momentum/ speed over a long stretch.  Our runners must reach their top speed (whatever that level is) quickly.  Obviously, making a decisive cut helps the player to gain momentum and build speed.

Some highly recruited runners do not fit Florida State's system, and that is okay.  This isn't about finding all the best pieces.  It is about finding the best pieces to fit what Florida State does.

 

2008

In reviewing last year's runners, it's easy to see that Antone Smith did not take well to our system, and freshman Jermaine Thomas did.  Let's review their numbers:

NameNoGainLossNetAVG
Smith,Antone 177 868 76 792 4.5
Thomas,Jermaine 69 492 10 482 7.0
Jones,Carlton 11 106 7 99 9.0
Sims,Marcus 23 68 4 64 2.8

The average are not what I want to focus on.  Instead, let's look at the average yards lost per carry.  First, with Antone Smith:

T1_smith_medium

Many don't think Antone was very good.  He was never great, but he was decent.  Smith struggled to learn the Seminoles zone run scheme. Smith did not have the patience or understanding needed for our scheme.  He consistently ran into the backs of his blockers, and did not hit the hole as it opened.  Further, he was not able to keep his legs moving through the hole, often being tripped up.  Let's look at a chart for Antone

Game (ACC Only)
Rushes Yds
Wake Forest 8 24
at Miami (Fla.) 27 92
at North Carolina St. 20 89
Virginia Tech 9 57
at Georgia Tech 9 35
Clemson 8 57
Boston College 10 19
at Maryland 13 45
Totals
104 418

That's about 4 yards per carry in ACC play.  There's a hidden advantage to losing Smith, however, and that is variance.  Smith was a big/ little back.  He had 104 carries in ACC play on which he gained 481 yards and lost 63 yards.  That's a pretty high loss number for having only 104 carries.  Smith gained 5.23 yards per carry and lost .61 yards per carry.  That's probably  a new stat to you.  I like to use it to look at how often a back puts his team in a negative leverage down after he has a run (like 2nd and 9, for instance).  Modern football scholars almost universally agree that the median carry is a much better measure of running back value than yards per carry.  Part of this it is very much attributable to an offensive line that exceeded expectations, but was far from great.  Smith was frustrating in that never seemed smooth in his approach and often struggled to find the hole in the zone scheme.

Jermaine Thomas, on the other hand, was everything that Antone was not, albeit in a reduced role.  Antone was faster and stronger than Jermaine, but Thomas was better.  Smith was more experienced than Jermaine, but Thomas took to the scheme quicker.  He was just a better fit for our scheme.

610x_medium

340x_medium

via cache.daylife.com

Jermaine Thomas was made to be a running back in the zone scheme.  Thomas understands the need to make one cut and get up the field.  He is more quick than fast and hits his top speed within a step or two of committing to the hole.  At 6-1, 190lbs, his upright style is a thing of beauty to watch.  Let's watch Thomas key on the doubleteam block and cut off the play.  


I will discuss the design of these plays in a later piece.

 

Personally, his running style reminds me of Ricky Watters.  Both Thomas and Watters played a fair amount of wide receiver in their prep days and both have a very upright gait. Here's Watters:


Longtime Tomahawk Nation contributor Fsued compared him to:

Jeff Cheaney.  Both seem real wiry and don’t look very strong, but seem to have a knack for contorting to shed tackles.  

Last season, Thomas went for 279 yards on just 31 carries in ACC plays, which is an amazing 9 yards per carry, but the key was his ability to be a NO NEGATIVES PLAYER.  Unlike Antone, Thomas was not big/little.  In 69 carries, Thomas only lost 10 yards total.  That's a paltry 0.14 yards lost per carry.  Compare that to Antone's 0.62!  Thomas did not put Florida State in bad situations.  I think Thomas will have a great year in 2009.

 

If you have any questions, do not to hesitate to ask.

 

In parts two, three, four, and five, I will review the "inside zone", "outside zone/ stretch", the "zone read", and some various pass plays and protections. 

Oh, and if you enjoyed this story and learned something, send it around on the FSU fan e-mail lists.

 

Until next time...

GO NOLES!!

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Can’t wait for the rest of this series. Been a hardcore baseball guy my whole life and only recently began looking into the finer points of football’s workings.

by l0stnumber on Jun 9, 2009 8:21 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

My only complaint

The case for Smith being a better back than Sanders doesn’t hinge on their yards. Sanders was more of a boom or bust guy because his O-line was so inferior to Smith’s. ESPN did a piece when they were both playing that showed Smith would make his first move 2-3 yards past the line of scrimmage, while Sanders routinely had to make his first move 1-2 yards in the backfield. With a higher quality of linemen Sanders would have done the same thing in the NFL he did in college. Smith’s case for being the better back would be based on his impact in the passing game since he was a better blocker and receiver than Sanders.

What I like the best about FSU using this scheme is that our offensive has so many aspects that come from the NFL. Thomas will be more prepared for the NFL than either Demps or Rainey. A WR like Fortson, who has the physical tools NFL GMs drool over, will be more prepared for the NFL coming to FSU than UF. It goes without saying that the same would be true for a QB or O-lineman as well. This bodes well for the future because FSU will have a better chance of putting players in the NFL who fair well than UF or many other teams.

by osceolafan850 on Jun 9, 2009 8:51 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

It should also be noted that Sanders played in the Run and Shoot which was very conducive to the big play running back. He was often playing against smaller fronts (numbers wise) and it fit his style much more than a typical I formation would.

by gahnki on Jun 9, 2009 1:13 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Its informative....

but it is the longest “front page” article I have seen. We need a ‘jump.’

Great piece and I have a TON of thoughts on it, however am swamped at work and just spend my churches hard earned money reading it. Will get back to you guys later.

"I have come that you may have life, and life to the max"

by UNFNOLE on Jun 9, 2009 10:06 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Outstanding...I'll be reading over this all day at work.

Been busy lately without much time to post, but still keeping up when I can.

FSUn, where does your football IQ come from? Are you a former player, or just a student of the game?

by jasonole59 on Jun 9, 2009 9:02 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I played HS ball and had a good x&o's coach there.

But a lot of it came from church. I shared a bathroom with my sister growing up, and on Sunday mornings, my mom would say “stop screwin around and go get your shower so your sister can get in there.” I’d do it, and then go watch this show called Edge NFL matchup on ESPN. It was great. Had Ron “Jaws” Jaworski breaking down NFL film, and this idiot Merril Hodge as his sidekick. That show can teach you a lot.

Football is simple. You have 5 offensive linemen, and usually a quarterback. That means 5 eligible pass catchers. Don’t complicate things by calling them all different names when discussing the game. Position names need to be used for plays and such, but between fans, it’s not important. 11 players, 55 1/2 yards wide and 100 yards long. There’s only so many combinations.

by FSUncensored on Jun 9, 2009 10:28 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I use to watch that show too, when I was younger.

Of course, I was way too young to even comprehend it.

Just wants to beat the Gators

by DA-2 on Jun 9, 2009 2:35 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

The best show on TV

and the worst possible time slot

by evenflow58 on Jun 9, 2009 4:34 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

And I thought all this time those Denver teams got holes through chop blocking ;)

Seriously though, excellent article on how a zone blocking scheme is supposed to work. The running game needs to take that next step for the team to have a shot at the ACC title.

"The worst kind of non-smokers are the ones that come up to you and cough. That's pretty cruel isn't it? Do you go up to cripples and dance too?"-Bill Hicks
Currently Playing:
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by Jonathan Loesche on Jun 9, 2009 9:19 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Actually...

You’d be dead-on if you said “cut blocking.” Gibbs is definitely the overlord of zone blocking as a scheme, and this method in carrying it out proved extremely valuable.

Chop blocking is an illegal block when a second blocker hits a defender who is already-engaged with another blocker. Also called a “High/Low,” picture a DT and a C locked up high (chest level), and a G concurrently engages the defender below the waist. It’s a block designed to injure the defender, hence its banishment.

The cut block is a legal block below the waist. You see linemen aiming for the ankles with either their heads (bad idea) or the side of their shoulder pads (good idea). This type of block is utilized best against heavy bull-rush type defenders, and can be used on run or pass plays. The idea here is that you take away the defender’s desire to overly penetrate, which later in the game results in substantial run gains especially in the 4th quarter (See: Denver Broncos). Trickett teaches this to his guys, and I’ve seen us use it at times.

by ricobert1 on Jun 9, 2009 10:45 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

This is pretty much dead on.

A coach from Denver addresses the point further here http://www.milehighreport.com/story/2008/3/16/1806/32490

In fact, the NFL changed the rules to make it harder on Denver, and Denver actually got better because it reinforced the need for great footwork!

We WILL cut the backside more this year, I have already spoken with someone on staff ;) That has a lot to do with going away from some of the 4-wide sets.

by FSUncensored on Jun 9, 2009 10:47 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I know the difference between a "Cut" block and "Chop" block

I’m just saying those late 90’s Bronco teams often were on the thin line

"The worst kind of non-smokers are the ones that come up to you and cough. That's pretty cruel isn't it? Do you go up to cripples and dance too?"-Bill Hicks
Currently Playing:
PS3-inFamous
360-Resident Evil 5

by Jonathan Loesche on Jun 9, 2009 3:57 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

It's def.

a hard thing to be disciplined in and very hard for the zebras to officiate.

"I have come that you may have life, and life to the max"

by UNFNOLE on Jun 9, 2009 4:03 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Fair enough

Most people use the term interchangably, however. I just wanted to point it out.

by ricobert1 on Jun 9, 2009 5:30 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Great article Budd!

'Gentlemen, it is better to have died a small boy than to fumble this football.' John Heisman

by Nattylite on Jun 9, 2009 9:49 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Nice!

Scalpem will be happy with this one.

by FSUSOM on Jun 9, 2009 10:37 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Great Read

Something to think about also, and I know you cannot do this type of data exstrapulation with concrete certainty BUT if you give Thomas the number of carries Smith had this year…we are looking at roughly a ~1300 yard back this year as our main back, and a 600 yard back if Jones is given Thomas’s carries. All of that should be highly feasible considering the expected rise of the OL this year, all players in the systems another year and hopefully a field general style QB that uses his intelligence to make changes on the field to take advantage of what he sees. Inject the offensive talent we have coming in with the 2009 class and FSU could be fielding one of their best offenses in about 8 years. If we have 2, just 2 WRs become playmakers and everyone else stick with blocks then our offense will be much better than last year.

Excellent article by the way!! I swear when I read articles like this I hear that crowd of Doak Campbell in the background, the warchant plays in the distance, Gene is screaming yard markers as a FSU runner is running in for the score.

Thanks for that feeling.

by diablonole on Jun 9, 2009 10:41 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Statistics

Extrapolating isn’t bad as long as you can justify the physical explanation. I agree somewhat with the potential yardage for our backs, but you also have to realize that the back-up back (Thomas last year) gets different play calls than your primary back. Look at Antone’s #s prior to him becoming the feature back (courtesy ESPN):

If we would have averaged what he did in his freshman and sophomore campaigns, he would have junior and senior seasons of 993 and 920 yards, respectively. Did he get worse? Did the line get worse? Did playcalling change? Those are all conflating circumstances, some arguably more appropriate than others.

by ricobert1 on Jun 9, 2009 11:03 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think we were able to call the plays we wanted to call with the line we had (sort of) and those didn't fit Antone

When extrapolating, you have to be really careful. Balance some factors here:

First, our schedule is much harder.
Second, teams will not key the run game and not the pass (last year they LET us run. Watch the tapes, they were scared of the pass game)
Third, the line will be better.
Fourth, can Thomas handle 20 carries per game?

by FSUncensored on Jun 9, 2009 11:09 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I don't know if they were as scared of the pass as they were of Ponder taking off running.
Second, teams will not key the run game and not the pass (last year they LET us run. Watch the tapes, they were scared of the pass game)

I don’t think too many teams were afraid of our passing game except for the jump/fade pass.

>-----:----:------>Spear 'em then Scalp 'em

by FrankDNole on Jun 9, 2009 12:20 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I base my opinion off the looks we saw. Watch the safeties. 2 deep look means they fear the passing game.

It doesn’t tell you what type of pass, only that the defense feared the pass. Almost everyone gave us a two-deep look.

by FSUncensored on Jun 9, 2009 7:10 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

On that note...

Although I like the fact that Thomas is not a “negative yardage” guy, I wonder if his negative yards will be higher once he’s the regular go-to guy. I got the feeling that he was getting the ball in special situations last year. In other words, what are the chances that his negative yards stats last year were just an anomaly?

Also, note that he only had limited carries per game last year, making him MUCH FRESHER than Antone on average. I haven’t looked at the numbers, but is it possible that many of Antone’s negative yardage plays came later in the game when he was tired? Of course, you could also argue that Antone shouldn’t have had those negative yards b/c the defense is also tired, but I digress…

Did injury contribute to Antone’s negative yards? Did JF have special plays specifically designed for Thomas? Did Thomas come in on anticipated pass plays, thereby catching the defense in a different formation?

by FSUjab on Jun 9, 2009 11:50 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Although I like the fact that Thomas is not a "negative yardage" guy, I wonder if his negative yards will be higher once he’s the regular go-to guy. I got the feeling that he was getting the ball in special situations last year. In other words, what are the chances that his negative yards stats last year were just an anomaly?

But he was called upon in games where Antone was injured or gassed or just not making any reads and played quite well. I do not analogize Thomas’ 2008 play with Antone’s 2006 play.

Also, note that he only had limited carries per game last year, making him MUCH FRESHER than Antone on average. I haven’t looked at the numbers, but is it possible that many of Antone’s negative yardage plays came later in the game when he was tired? Of course, you could also argue that Antone shouldn’t have had those negative yards b/c the defense is also tired, but I digress…

The one thing I will say is that even when Fisher had Addai (1st round DC, Colts), he still ran other backs a lot, but I don’t Thomas is a 225 carry back.

On your other point, I think Antone ran himself into a lot of negatives because he was guessing at the holes, not reading the blocks.

Did injury contribute to Antone’s negative yards? Did JF have special plays specifically designed for Thomas? Did Thomas come in on anticipated pass plays, thereby catching the defense in a different formation?

I assume it did, somewhat. Thomas ran better on the zone plays, and when we did man block stuff it was typically Antone. I don’t think Thomas was used disproportionally on 3rd down compared to other downs.

by FSUncensored on Jun 9, 2009 7:14 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

thanks for the uncensoring

very easy to understand.

I have one question, what happens when the first and second defensive levels condense, as in a goal line or fourth-and-inches situation? Does this take away all the room for chipping lineman and moving to the LBs?

I have always appreciated the aesthetic value of a back being able to make himself small to scoot through the hole, and then burst like a track runner straight downfield, standing upright the way elite sprinters do. Im a big fan of JThomas.

by NorthernHaze on Jun 9, 2009 11:39 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

In "pile-up" situations

I’d say you have to go with man up blocking for any type of inside run. You have to block the guy closest to you and just try to put a hat on anyone you can. I think a zone will break down if you have too many extra defenders (extra LB, S up in the box) to slice through the wave of blockers. You may be able to zone block here if you have the quickness (OL) and speed (ball carrier) to get to the outside. A stretch play can take advantage of stunting / stacked defenders in this scenario.

by ricobert1 on Jun 9, 2009 12:08 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

so the scheme reduces to brute force if you attack the inside in short yardage situations?

I’m sure this situation will become more clear as FSUnc posts the remainder of the series

Regardless of offensive scheme, doesn’t going to the outside in a short yardage situation have a significantly lower success rate? As in, the shortest distance between two points is a str line?

by NorthernHaze on Jun 9, 2009 12:27 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Geometrically

You are correct. But the fun in football is the strategy. You go outside when they’re thinking inside, you go left when they expect right. Xs & Os, baby. Whatever it takes to get into the endzone.

by ricobert1 on Jun 9, 2009 12:39 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well again, in short yardage, you have to avoid penetration.

The splits are cut (though last year ours were way too small for reasons I’ll discuss later)

You can still double down there. If they are so packed in that you can run inside zone, run the stretch play.

There’s also a “force or smash” play I’ll discuss.

by FSUncensored on Jun 9, 2009 7:27 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Some thoughts.

-The days of the WR’s being prima dona’s in a zone blocking environment are pretty much over. If you want to be on the field, you have to get down and dirty and engage and stick to the DB you’ve been assigned. This is one of the benefits of the bigger prototype WR, it’s not just about the jump ball advantage anymore. While we have a couple of big WR’s, I think our average size leaves a little to be desired. This is why I think Surrency, who was perhaps one of the best WR blockers ever for FSU, not just with his down field blocking ability but his ability to engage the defender at the LOS to help with the run and the bubbles, is going to be sorely missed.

-The QB’s ball handling abilities and techniques are something that is not emphasized and not enough time is spent on IMO. It seems many QB’s just want to hand off the ball and get out of the way instead of following thru on a fake pass to freeze the secondary, and vice versa, by doing a lousy play action fake and just wanting to settle in to the pocket to pass. Dan Marino, one of the greatest QB’s ever was a lousy ball handler, while Chad Pennington constantly freezes the defense with his deceptiveness, because the D isn’t sure if he has really handed it off or if he still has it and is going to pass. That slight hesitation by the D gives the O a big advantage in both the running and passing game.

-The RB’s vision and getting to the predetermined point of attack is more important that trying to read the blocks and then going for the holes. Upon reaching the set point of attack, he must continue going downhill or cut back. Learning to do this is so very important to the success of a ZB scheme. RB’s have a tendency to try to see the entire LOS then deciding where the hole will be. Ant. Smith was a great back for us, but IMO this was part of reason he did not have more success with us, as he waited, and expected the hole to be opened up for him. This contributed to so many of his negative plays, and from my questionable recollection, always seemed happened on 3rd downs, and the few 4th downs we went for. From what I have seen of J. Thomas, he seems to hit the predetermined point of attack on the LOS hard and fast then he has the great vision to decide whether to go full speed ahead or cut back, and this is the reason for his nice long runs last season. Also, as your article states, the RB’s must always keep their legs moving at all times and not be allowed to be arm tackled or tripped up before hitting the LOS.

-I am excited to see how our young OLmen perform this year, and I expect they will be one of the most dominant forces in college ball this year, but even more so next year and the year after that, assuming everyone stays healthy. By then the backups will have had time to develop and maybe great OL’s at FSU may become a tradition.

-Finally re: our OL’s size. You have stated your POV over and over and you know I agree 100%, so I will not expand on it any further except to say, I also really like some meat with my potatoes.

-BTW. I usually like to type out my thoughts as I am reading an article so I don’t forget what my points are by the time I get to the end, especially with an article of this length. In today’s case, I found that as soon as I finished typing out my thoughts, then going back to finish reading the article, I would find you have covered the same points I was trying to make further down into your article. I decided to post these comments anyway, even though I only reiterated some of the points you had already made in a much more eloquent manner. Great job and I am looking forward to reading the rest of the series as you release it.

>-----:----:------>Spear 'em then Scalp 'em

by FrankDNole on Jun 9, 2009 12:17 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Appreciated as always, Frank
The QB’s ball handling abilities and techniques are something that is not emphasized and not enough time is spent on IMO. It seems many QB’s just want to hand off the ball and get out of the way instead of following thru on a fake pass to freeze the secondary

We actually use this to leave a defender unblocked. The backside end has go be wary of the bootleg and thus we leave him unblocked on the stretch.

I actually think Antone had horrible patience. He would just run full speed ahead and guess. He did not do well when trying to go laterally and then cut to the hole, which is what we need.

From what I have seen of J. Thomas, he seems to hit the predetermined point of attack on the LOS hard and fast then he has the great vision to decide whether to go full speed ahead or cut back, and this is the reason for his nice long runs last season.

I think there’s some confusion on your end or my end. The back does not hit the predetermined point of attack hard at all. In fact, he needs to be patient and reduce his speed until he knows where the hole will be, and then he hits that hole hard. The cut back doesn’t occur AFTER the hole, but rather it is the hole (which occurs when the traditional path is closed because the defense has over pursued).

We’re FSU. We don’t want midgets, and we will have guys who are 285/290 and can move.

by FSUncensored on Jun 9, 2009 7:49 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Another reason while it would be helpful to

have Hudson at C is to call the zones.

"I have come that you may have life, and life to the max"

by UNFNOLE on Jun 9, 2009 8:33 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

In retrospect, pre determined point of attack was probably a bad choice of words on my part.

The way I always understood it, which now I guess is probably wrong, by the time the RB is handed the ball, he and the line should be on the same page, whether the play was called to go in a certain direction or point on the LOS in the huddle, or that everyone should have read the D alignment and they should all know whether the play should head L, R, or middle. As the RB approaches the LOS, he runs towards that hole (point) and upon hitting it continues running in a straight line or cuts back depending on where the next level (LB’S) is playing. I did not consider heading towards the hole as a cutback, I always thought the move at the hole, or after the hole, was the cut back, but I understand your explanation.

What I meant by JT hitting the hole hard, was that I did not see much hesitation on his part to get to the LOS, and then run forward or cut back (my definition not yours), as opposed to AS, who I always felt dallied around too much before getting to the LOS, waiting for a hole to open up, and this is why I felt he had that many negative plays. That is just my prespective of their 2 contrasting styles in “hitting the hole hard” (also probably a poor choice of words). Again I understand your POV and the problems with committing too early to a certain point. While you may have seen it as AS being impatient and running full speed ahead and guessing, then being wrong and standing there dancing and waiting to get tackled because there is no hole, I saw as dallying around waiting for a hole to develop or trying to decide which way to go.

However, your reply to my comment about the importance of QB’s ball handling ability, and the need for them to follow thru with a fake whether it is a pass or run, confused me.

>-----:----:------>Spear 'em then Scalp 'em

by FrankDNole on Jun 9, 2009 8:57 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Quick Thought:

We talk about a 1C running back. I love this because it doesn’t specify what type of back we want you to be. So many different styles of backs can fit into a 1C classification.

Obviously Denver is the most prominent example of a zone running scheme and have made the playoffs for a long-time doing just this. However, let’s look at the “type” of backs that have succeeded in their offense.

Olandis Gary – Smaller, but packed a load when healthy
 Mike Anderson – Big, Roided Up, and converted FB
 Clinton Portis Fast and Physical
Reuben Droughns Bigger, More Physical
 Tatum Bell – Smaller, Quicker

I would even add (though they weren’t 1000 yrd rushers)
Mike Bell – Medium sized back without great spead or great (football) strength.
Peyton Hillis – converted FB

I loved your section on what the running backs actually need. Very little of it has to do with their “style” but more IQ and coachability. This helps us not only in recruiting as we can look at a number of different players and (after a while in this system) will be able to point to the successes of it, but also with depth (which we know all teams need at RB).

The one thing that does concern me about a zone scheme is the rate at which backs get hurt. Just looking at Denver and New England it is kind of startling their injury rates to running backs. I have no idea of the correlation in the zone scheme vs man scheme and injuries (though it would be a fascinating study) but when you have “controlled chaos” and a lot of cut blocking you can see how easy it would be to take out a knee or ankle.

Anyway, that’s my two cents. Good job FSUncensored.

"I have come that you may have life, and life to the max"

by UNFNOLE on Jun 9, 2009 1:06 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Good post, UNF

As you point out, it’s a misconception that this can’t be a power scheme. It definitely can.

As to this:

The one thing that does concern me about a zone scheme is the rate at which backs get hurt. Just looking at Denver and New England it is kind of startling their injury rates to running backs. I have no idea of the correlation in the zone scheme vs man scheme and injuries (though it would be a fascinating study) but when you have "controlled chaos" and a lot of cut blocking you can see how easy it would be to take out a knee or ankle.

I can’t say I agree or disagree. We would need to look at the injuries one by one. We could work on it as a group.

by FSUncensored on Jun 9, 2009 7:53 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

In the next couple of days

I will try to grab some video of their injuries if possible.

Who knows what we’ll find. Could be a worthless use of my time.

"I have come that you may have life, and life to the max"

by UNFNOLE on Jun 9, 2009 8:34 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Though

most of them had serious injuries (and several career ending for all intent purposes) none of them seemed to be from the scheme itself. So, Basically I wasted my time. Denver just has a knack for finding running backs who suffer severe injuries (though I guess it’s not uncommon for RB’s).

T.Davis – Degenarative knee and ankle problems
Gary – While pass blocking (ACL)
Mike Anderson – Torn Groin
Tatum Bell – Foot Problems
Hillis – Hamstring
Clinton Portis- Selfishness

"I have come that you may have life, and life to the max"

by UNFNOLE on Jun 10, 2009 5:27 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

It's NOT a waste of time.

You had an idea and you investigated it. And everyone here appreciates your efforts.

by FSUncensored on Jun 10, 2009 7:39 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

The inside zone run out of the Pistol formation in that Jermaine Thomas video was interesting.

Good feature story.

by gahnki on Jun 9, 2009 2:10 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

That was one of his better called games.

We killed them on slants and zone running. They played off and wide.

We had not run that play before to my recollection.

Does anyone remember us breaking that out before the GTech game?

by FSUncensored on Jun 9, 2009 7:54 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Nice piece of work.

You should find a way to combine this interest/ability with your chosen profession. Then you’ll be one of the few happy lawyers! :)

by FiestaNole on Jun 9, 2009 2:17 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

With Saban at U of Alabama, ...

they’re gonna need all the lawyers they can get soon…I wouldn’t be shocked if Saban took over the UF job when Meyer bolts for ND…

"We're not maxed out, ... The best is still ahead of us."

Bobby Bowden

by NaGaNole on Jun 9, 2009 2:38 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I will bet a cold one that neither of those things happen.

Meyer only leaves for NFL in my opinion and Saban only leaves for retirement. If Saban returns UA to a national champion, he will become a god in Alabama. Meyer knows his brand of player will never make it to or at ND so he won’t waste his time.

Of course it all of that post was tongue in cheek then I agree.

by diablonole on Jun 9, 2009 3:18 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

You could possibly be right about Meyer never leaving for ND.

However it’s always good for laughs to bait my gator friends by telling them that at any time Ubbie will be leaving for ND because it is his dream job, and because Timmmmmie (my S. Park voice) will have graduated (maybe?). It always pisses them off big time.

>-----:----:------>Spear 'em then Scalp 'em

by FrankDNole on Jun 9, 2009 3:44 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

couldn't disagree more

While I don’t think it is probable, it is very possible that Meyer leaves for ND. No football program will ever have the kind of money to throw around that ND does. The odds are also completely against Meyer going on at the pace he is now, and a nice run at UF will not put him on the kind of pedestal winning a NC or two for the Domers would. But I don’t see anyone talking about Meyer in the NFL but fans on websites. Several jobs have opened up over the years, and you hear about Carroll all the time, but no Meyer. No NFL team will ever run the spread option. Defensive units are just too big and fast and no QB could take the pounding. So why would they bring in Meyer.

Saban on the other had is a well known job jumper. I doubt he would leave Bama before he makes them truly elite again. But if a NFL team decides to get over how he screwed over the Dolphins I think he would jump at the chance. He doesn’t appear to be the forget and move on type so I am sure his complete and utter failure as a NFL coach eats at him in his alone moments.

by osceolafan850 on Jun 9, 2009 3:51 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I have it on pretty decent authority that they contacted his agent this offseason. And he told them “wait until next year.” That was why Weis was in limbo for so long. They weren’t going to fire him unless they had their guy lined up.

by gahnki on Jun 9, 2009 9:47 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

ND will never be what it was in its hay day.

I think the landscape of college football has changed so much that ND is no longer the greatest college football job in the land. In fact, I gotta wonder if Meyer would not be more interested in the Ohio State job more than ND. OSU spends immense amounts of money, he is from the area and has admitted his “respect and admiration” for the university.

by diablonole on Jun 9, 2009 10:23 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

J Thomas Video

Watching the vid of Jermaine really reminds me how much I like this kid. A smart back with his talent as a sophmore = SCARY. I was excited about our run game before, but watching that makes me wish it was Labor Day!

Oh and great post by the way, LOVE the details put in all your articles.

by freshcollegeboy on Jun 9, 2009 3:22 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Too many great points and people to applaud

And this site is free? Damn.
I just got schooled in a good way. Love the way that FSUn reiterates points throughout the article like a professor should.
I was jotting down notes and points to expand upon, but the list got too long.
Here’s a question:
How does Ty Jones fit into the scheme for 2009. I know that FSUn is concerned about his health issue, but for the sake of this argument let’s imagine that Carlton’s diabetes is in check and the Spring fumbilitis was caused by his thumb injury and an outlier. How do his physical tools and football IQ match up to what should be an improved line?
With the way Jermaine isn’t afraid to lead with his head and initiate contact (ala Jeff Chaney), it’s quite apparent that JT nor anybody will be toting the rock more than 20 times a game on average.

One point I’ll go back on…..
Love the picture of Andrew Datko. He does look like a Tight End. All he needs is to tie up his jersey around his navel like Dave Roberts in the late 80’s.
Heading into last year, I was terrified (hyperbole) of Datko having to start at left tackle. I’m not knocking the kid, it was just the circumstances. No coach in their right mind wants to start a freshman 4 months removed from Prom, but it was the card we were dealt. We got pushed around in the Wake game, but I had visions of much worse. I imagined Datko getting cartoonishly pancaked by the DE on every play. To the point where we’d have to line up in the shotgun and sprint right on every play.
I don’t know what Andrew’s ceiling will be, but he’s deserving of praise for one of the gutsiest performances against the odds for an FSU player in recent memory. I believe he played several games where he couldn’t lift one arm higher than 90 degrees.

Also, great call on the Dan Marino play fake, Frank D. Even on plays where he handed it off, he would stick the ball out like he was passing the baton from the moment he stepped back from center. For a Hall of Fame QB, I can’t believe he was that inept or patently lazy to ignore a huge part of the quarterbacking repertoire his entire career.

by The K-Man on Jun 9, 2009 6:03 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

What weight are the o-line guys at now?

I see that Coach Stroud specifically mentioned Datko being at 293 today.

by WBisaNOLE on Jun 9, 2009 7:50 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I automatically subtract 3%

thus, 293= 285
275=262
250= 243.5
etc

Strength coaches have an incentive to inflate their numbers. Nothing against coach Stroud. They all do it. And everyone sees players shrink at the combine.

by FSUncensored on Jun 9, 2009 8:13 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Great read.

It really explains the concept of zone blocking. I am actually a fan of it, and I believe our line will be the best in the conference this year.

by fsunole23 on Jun 9, 2009 10:32 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

What RB recruit on our radar do you think would best excel in our Zone-Blocking scheme?

Should Lattimore really be our top choice?
What about:
-Bernard
-Clements
-Gainer
-Hall (naples)

by Zach_Nole on Jun 9, 2009 11:59 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I don’t like Bernard or Hall for our system.

I think Lattimore and Gainer are the definitive two, and that Malcolm is the #3. If Clements wants to consistently run hard and be disciplined, he’s the 4.

by FSUncensored on Jun 10, 2009 12:53 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Leon Washington or JT?

As I watched the JT video above, I had to question how much of a 1C back he really was. Some of his biggest runs were sweeps to the outside where he got the corner and took off. Not as many situations where he took a cut and was off …

Having said that, Leon Washington struck me as a great 1C back. He hit the hole hard, made 1 cut, and was gone (or was tackled falling forward). Always amazed how quick he hit the holes … at least compared to other backs that tended to dance a lot in the backfield.

The big contrast was with LoBo … who was a speedster that always tried to get to the corner. Many times he didn’t make it … but when he did he would break it big. When he tried to go between the tackles … he would usually make 2-3 moves rather than 1 hard cut.

What am I missing with JT and the 1C analysis?

by txnole on Jun 10, 2009 6:29 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Opportunity.

This is something another member of ours wrote, and he’s a State Championship HS coach.

McMahon just cannot overtake anybody. O.Z. would be murder for us but he cannot overtake anybody (no matter the technique) and we end up having to bounce so much. I re-watched the bowl game and he single-handedly destroyed our running game in the first half. I think thats why we went to the “I” later in the game, it allowed a double and we could get Sims on the Sam backer.

I post that because of the bounce language. Often those “sweeps” were really outside zones bounced because there was little else to cut off. Also, on some of the Zone Reads, his read was to get the corner. I do agree that we were too corner oriented in result (probably not by design).

The GT game is the game to focus on. We effectively ran inside zone there with Thomas making the correct read generally, eyeing the over pursuit, and hitting the cutback.

Leon would make a great ZB runner.

by FSUncensored on Jun 10, 2009 7:17 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I thought so at first too

But as you watch there is not really any cutbacks in some of those runs. Especially at first.

But as you get into it more there are some very good off guard cutbacks he does to take it through.

by GrassyNole on Jun 10, 2009 11:04 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Great article

and very useful knowledge. I expect to see our runing game really explode in the upcoming years as Trickett has been able to instill his philosophy and get his guys recruited.

by Buc Wild on Jun 10, 2009 9:53 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

This is why I joined Tomahawk Nation

It raises a few questions in my mind, though, particularly concerning the RB. Any thoughts on which of the 2009 and 10 RB recruits will/would likely be most successful in our system?

by Aussierat on Jun 10, 2009 10:32 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I do not think Pryor fits

He’s an excellent athlete, and loves the Noles. He’s also a good kid who could play safety, and at worst, special teams. That said, maybe he gets a reality check, is determined to learn the system, and comes on strong later than we initially thought.

For 2010, I think Lattimore, Gainer, Malcolm, and Clements are the 4 best who we have a realistic shot with.

And then… well… Smiley is one of those beasts you can live with if he never totally gets it.

by FSUncensored on Jun 10, 2009 2:23 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

What a tremendous article, Uncensored.

I’m sure this is what fans expect when they sign up for a paysite subscription. The editors at FSU’s Rivals site got the education of their lifetimes when they read this along with everyone else yesterday.

by TRMNole on Jun 10, 2009 4:26 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Great hands

Thomas also has great hands which is good as Jimbo loves the bubble pass. I expect Thomas to come in stronger with increased endurance this year also. We have the horses who do fit the scheme this year, Thomas, Jones, Pryor, Thompson and maybe Tavares Presley who could be a big surprise if healthy. I think it was Ponder who said this guy is looking good.

I read a year ago that Trickett still calls Gibbs on the phone and wants to discuss zone blocking.

Fisher never looks for an all out dual threat quarterback because FSU under Jimbo is never going away from the passing game like WVU. WVU almost never passed and White did quite a bit of running himself as quarterback. So this is a bit different for Trickett also and still a work in progress.

If you will notice however Jimbo likes a quarterback who can run a bit if he has to however. Ponder, Manuel and Secord can scamper a bit if they have to and it appears the recruit Godrey can also.

by DocHoliday2 on Jun 10, 2009 11:10 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Totally agree Doc.

It will be a big test for Thomas. He will have to shoulder a bigger load.

by FSUncensored on Jun 10, 2009 11:18 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ok I tried to read all this its a little to much but I think I see something

As for the RB for the Zone Blocking you dont need a fast back. from the looks of it you need is a smart back. Second the RB that seem to fit the mold better would be a bigger stronger but slower back. More like a faster FB or a PJ hill or Benny Wells type. Someone that can use there size to blast someone on a blitz in pass pro. Above when UNFNOLE was saying something about the Denver backs they seem more like that. From the looks of the rucruiting side it seems we are looking for back that fit this mold better with recruits like Giovanni Bernard, Marcus Lattimore, and Storm Johnson.

Why is the sky blue? Because, God Loves the Infantry

by Desman on Jun 13, 2009 12:56 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

The beauty of the system is that it's adaptable to speed or power backs.

Many teams have the back step up or step back. For instance, Oregon played Jon Stewart (now with the panthers) at 7.5 yards deep!

by FSUncensored on Jun 14, 2009 10:49 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I ran into a great article on Trickett

It is an old one but noteworthy.

http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pittsburghtrib/sports/steelers/s_504613.html

" Fisher’s approach to building a winner is lifted from Saban’s playbook. Right down to the terminology such as becoming more "process oriented" as opposed to "results oriented."

" Nick and I are friends," he said. "That guy is one of the best football coaches I’ve ever been around. God knows he’s brilliant. … A lot of the things he believes are a lot of things I believe. We’re very similar!

The process begins!

by DocHoliday2 on Jan 17, 2010 6:57 PM EST reply actions   0 recs


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