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'Nole Your Enemy: The BYU Cougar Defense

BYU Senior Defensive End Jan Jorgensen sacks UCLA's Quarterback.

BYU Senior Defensive End Jan Jorgensen sacks UCLA's Quarterback.

We started with South Florida (OffenseDefense).  Yesterday we discussed BYU's Offense, and I'm proud to say that most BYU fans thought the article was spot-on.  Today we'll talk BYU's defense.  

BYU's Head Coach Bronco Mendenhall is a defensive guy and for the most part, BYU's defenses have been quite solid under his tutelage.  They are not blitz-crazy by any means, but that's probably a result of some personnel issues.  Mendenhall runs a 3-4, but he's really a 3-3-5 guy. 

BYU's 2008 Defense

This was a bad defense.  There's not any other way to describe it.  Their season started off decent on the surface, but they were beating up on some pitiful offenses.  Some decent teams would soon expose them, as they gave up at least 5 TD's in 5 of their final 6 games. Here are some rather shocking results to help you understand just how bad BYU's defense was last year.

Every Division-1 Defense FSU played was significantly better than BYU.  Every one.  I decided to put this in graph form:

Byu_defense_efficiency_medium

"One of these things is not like the other..."

The graph speaks for itself, but there is still more.  Not only was BYU much worse on defense than any FSU opponent, but FSU was better than any offense BYU's defense faced.  Once again, we find BYU beating up on bad teams, and really struggling with decent teams.  This one needs a graph and a chart.  First, the graph:

Byu_offensive_opponents_medium

BYU didn't face many great offenses.  FSU's Offense was better than any offense BYU faced last season.  BYU did an excellent job of beating up on bad teams.  Look at hoiw they shut down New Mexico, Wyoming, UCLA (home of 4 different starting QB's in one year), and San Diego State!  Feast your eyes:

 

Opponent Adjusted Offensive Efficiency of BYU's Opponents (Higher # is better) Nat'l Rank Points Allowed by BYU Defense
Florida State 0.298 15 ???
Arizona 0.207 26 31
Utah 0.194 28 48
UNLV 0.161 35 35
TCU 0.093 47 32
Colorado State 0.002 63 42
Air Force -0.076 72 24
Utah State -0.265 100 14
Washington -0.274 101 27
San Diego State -0.31 106 12
UCLA -0.364 111 0
Wyoming -0.383 112 0
New Mexico -0.402 114

3

 

  • Against 6 opponents with an offense outside the top 100, BYU allowed an average of 9 points per game. 
  • Against 7 opponents with an offense inside the top 100 (though no top 25 offenses), BYU allowed an average of 32 points per game, and Air Force is included in that because they were a top 100 offense.  That's hardly a mark of distinction for the cadets as their offense was still very much below average nationally.
  • Remember the graph above.  BYU didn't play an offense as good as FSU's.  How many points would the 'Noles have scored?  50?  55?  50 sounds about right, because the 'Noles would undoubtedly have ran the ball in the second half more than some of the other offenses did. 

So it seems that BYU does a really nice job of playing hard all the way through blowouts, where other schools might take plays off towards the end.  That helps their numbers, but a motivated 2nd string isn't going to help the Cougars take a bite out of the 'Noles. 

Bad Against the Run

BYU ranked 87th nationally in stopping the run.  That's obviously very bad.  They got blown off the ball by some average offensive lines.  More on this later in the article, but for now, check out how their rushing defense stacked up against FSU's 2008 opponents' run defense.

Byu_rush_defense_comparison_medium

FSU had its best offensive games against the teams at the bottom, where BYU is. This was a horrible defense last season.

Terrible Against the Pass

For as bad as they were against the run (87th), they were even worse against the pass, finishing 98th in the country in Pass Defense!

Byu_pass_defense_and_comparables_medium

That's obviously very bad.  This is getting repetitive, so there is just one more graph before we break down the 2009 BYU Defense. 

Byu_passing_situations_defense_medium

That's embarrassing for BYU.  115th in the nation!  That's worse than teams like Idaho.  The reason BYU struggled so much on defense is a lack of talent, compounded by injuries.  The reason they struggled so much in what should be favorable situations, is a complete lack of a pass rush coupled with a shaky secondary that can't shoulder the heavy coverage responsibilities that a blitz requires. 

Inside, we'll preview BYU's defense.  Could the FSU 2nd team defense really be better than BYU's starting unit?

Star-divide

Defensive Line

BYU runs the 3-4 defense.  Let's have a look at that alignment:

3-4-defense_medium

 


So BYU uses three defensive linemen. Click the diagram to enlarge

At Left End, BYU has Jan Jorgensen.  We profiled the 6'3" 260lb senior here when we discussed Left Tackle Andrew Datko's slate:

Jorgensen projects as a 2nd round draft choice. The senior has had quite the career. Jorgensen has been named 1st team All-Mountain West Defense for two years in a row. He is the conference's career leader in sacks already. He's a Lombardi and Hendricks award finalist. Oh, and he is 26 years old after serving a three year Mormon mission and redshirting his freshman year. The recent word is that he dropped 10lbs down to 245 in order to be quicker.

At Nose Guard, the cougars return Russel Tialavea.  He's 6'3" 286.  The junior has about 20 starts under his belt and is a decent player. Phil Steele thinks he will be a 2nd team All-Conference selection.  He is not expected to be drafted for the NFL, as he lacks the bulk to play defensive tackle and the quickness to play on the edge.  That said, BYU is very glad to have him, as he actually decided to skip this season to take his LDS mission.  "Somehow", there was a snafu with the paperwork, so he couldn't get approval.  He's now back on the team, and that's huge because the Cougars have literally no quality depth behind him after the backup nose guard left school.

At Right End, BYU returns Brett Denney.  The 6'4" 260lb Senior started all 13 games last year, registering 7 tackles for loss. 

BYU's depth took major hits when both 2nd-team defensive ends left.  Ian Dualan was being counted on to spell Denney, and Bernard Afuiti (a JUCO stud) is academically ineligible- though he should return in 2010.  BYU is very thin on the defensive line.  On the bright side, they do have Matt Putnam who played well at times last year in his end role.

The Cougar starters are good, but not great, and considering their lack of depth, that this unit will rank in the middle to bottom half of defensive lines FSU will face this year.

 

Linebacker

Remember that BYU uses 4 linebackers (see diagram above).

At Strongside linebacker, the Cougs have Jordan Pendleton.  The 6'2" 228lb sophomore moved from defensive back in the spring, where he made 3 tackles last year.  He's very important as he will be asked to replace the departed All-Conference David Nixon, the MWC's all-time leader in tackles for loss.  Nixon was pretty good.  The other option here is Junior Grant Nelson (6'3" 226), but he is currently injured.  Whoever wins the job, expect a dropoff.  BYU doesn't have the talent to simply plug in someone for the conference's all-time leader in tackles for loss and not miss a beat.

At Middle Linebacker (they use two), is Senior Matt Bauman.  He's scrappy and ultra productive.  Started 14 games in his career, and he's very mentally mature, having graduated high school in 2005, which makes him 22).  He was 2nd team All-Conference last season.  He is regarded as the 29th best draft eligible inside linebacker by NFL Draft Express. 

At "BCB" (the other middle linebacker position), the Cougars have Senior Shawn Doman, who started 10 games last year.  The 6'2" 232lb Senior is a decent player, but he isn't very athletic and can be exploited in coverage.  There is some chance that Terrance Hooks beats our Doman.

At Weakside linebacker is Coleby Clawson, a 6'2" 234lb Senior.  Clawson started 11 games last year after coming from junior college, and registered 55 tackles (11 for loss).  He has to be the cougar's disruptive pass rusher.

Providing depth will be the loser of the Doman-Hooks battle and Vic So'oto, a former tight end who can play defensive end or outside linebacker.  

This is an experienced linebacker unit.  They are assignment sound.  If you're looking for some perspective on their talent level, I'd say they will be somewhere in the middle of the the linebacker units FSU will face.  They will definitely play some games and FSU's offensive line must be alert, as this is a cohesive unit. 

A problem of size

When looking at BYU's front 7, something really jumps out:  they are tiny. 

LE 84 Jan Jorgensen, 6-3, 259, Sr.
NT 71 Russel Tiavaela, 6-3, 286, Sr.
RE 92 Brett Denney, 6-4, 260, Sr.
SLB 1 Jordan Pendleton, 6-2, 228, Soph.
MLB 35 Matt Bauman, 6-1, 229, Sr.
BLB 42 Shawn Doman, 6-2, 232, Sr.
WLB 41 Coleby Clawson, 6-3, 234, Sr.

That's 1728lbs combined in their front 7.  Why does this matter?  For reference, BYU's front 7 is extremely tiny.  TCU outweighs them by 155lbs.

Second, FSU's run game destroys small front 7's.

There are two ways to stop FSU's running game and not get burned by the bubble screen (a pass FSU throws exceptionally well)  Essentially, the bubble screen is a tool to make sure that the offense plays 7 in the box and not 8.  If the defense cheats and brings extra men against the run, we throw the bubble to keep them honest. : 

  1. The first is to have a huge, disciplined front 7, that is difficult to cut block.  One that takes good angles and doesn't allow cutbacks.  This allows teams to play straight upon the receivers, also maintaining deep coverage.  Or...
  2. Play 8 in the box and play zero coverage-press man against each receiver.  Virginia Tech did this and they were eventually burned deep.  This requires excellent athletes in the secondary,

As we'll see in a second, BYU does not have the option to play number two.  They have to hope their front-7 can stop the run.  What did other front 7's do against FSU's run game?

Boston College 1918lbs, 23 rushes, 82 yards.  FSU had the youngest line in the country and they couldn't muster any push against these guys.  The bubble was useless as BC did not need to cheat to stop the run.  They are huge and thankfully their two all-world tackles graduated (1st and 2nd round draft choces)

Wake 1838lbs, 27 rushes for 103 yards.  Wake was very big.They were able to play the bubble straight up, which worked very well.  They also had 4 seniors on defense drafted in the first 4 rounds.

Florida 1835lbs, 29 rushes for 137  Big and supremely talented, our rushing success came primarily in garbage time.

Miami 1785lbs, 54 rushes, 281 yards.  There is a pretty big drop off from UF to Miami (55lbs).  Remember here that our rushing success came primarily on reverses and Ponder running, most of which was a result of Miami's idiotic plan to defense our attack.  We bubbled them to death when they went 8 or 9 in the box.

Georgia Tech 1772lbs (I think they were lighter because of major injuries, correct?).  31 rushes, 228 yards.  Remember that GTech was missing 2 key linebackers and a safety.  Still, this is a big drop in weight from the 3 schools over 1835lbs.

Virginia Tech 1766lbs, 34 rushes, 123 yards.  Poor numbers.  Explanation?  Yes.  VT played 8 in the box and manned up on the wide receivers.  If you're puzzled, remember what happened:  the only thing open was the deep ball.  They saturated the running lanes and pressed FSU's wideouts. Eventually, FSU burned them deep.

Clemson 1760lbs, 34 rushes, 281 yards  Light front 7?  Check.  Depending solely on speed to stop the run?  Check.  Cutbacks?  Check.

NC State 1757lbs, 42 rushes, 162 yards  These numbers aren't amazing, but much of this game was us trying to control the clock while battling holding penalties.  They also include lost sack yardage (which isn't a run play).  Light front 7?  Check.  Depending solely on speed to stop the run?  Check.  Cutbacks?  Check.

Maryland 1755lbs, 41 rushes, 172 yards  Maryland struggled all game in choosing to defend the bubble or the run.

Colorado 1755lbs, 45 rushes, 259 yards  The smallest front we played AND they decided to stop the bubble.  Running wild was the obvious result.

BYU is 27lbs lighter than any front-7 FSU played last season.  Every offensive linemen is back for FSU, and three are All-America candidates (even if 'Nole fans know ther center is overrated).  The 'Nole line is extremely quick and very intelligent.  They will not struggle to block BYU's tiny front -7.  That's important, because some teams do struggle with a 3-4 scheme, but FSU handled it very well last year when Maryland and Colorado went 3-4.  FSU is good against that because their linemen are athletes, not maulers.  They are excellent blockers on the 2nd level (where the linebackers are). 

Expect BYU to start out being patient.  FSU will be able to run the ball on them, and BYU will begin to creep up their safeties and go man coverage with their corners.  That should be interesting...

 

Secondary 

And here come the questions.  I won't sugar coat this.  BYU's front-7 should be above average.  BYU needs them to be elite, becaus their secondary is a mess.  They must replace 3 starters and their best cover-corner, expected to start, quit the team this off-season.

At Field Corner, BYU has Robbie Buckner and Brian Logan.    Logan is a 5'8" senior who didn't start a game last year, and Buckner is a 5'10" redshirt freshman.  Buckner is probably the better athlete. **Update: Corby Eason, a JC transfer, has actually passed Brian Logan on the depth chart at field corner. Highlights of Eason here. Thanks to sroufe for the info**

At Boundary Corner, BYU has Brandon Bradley.  He's 6'0" 200, a very good athlete, but also very raw.  The Junior made 40 tackles last year, which isn't really something you want to see out of a cornerback.  He's their de-facto best cornerback after Brandon Howard (very good cover corner and a senior) left the team this off-season. 

At Free Safety, BYU has a "returning" starter in Scott Johnson, who actually played corner last year.  The 5'11" 188lb Senior has good range, though he is new to the position.  He was a 10 game starter last season at corner.  BYU is very inexperienced in the secondary, so Johnson will be called upon to be the leader. 

At Strong Safety/ KAT, is 6'3" 215lb Junior Andrew Rich. He did start 3 games last year, registering 26 tackles.  Because BYU's front-7 is so tiny, they have to heavily involve their Strong Safety in the run game.  Rich isn't a special athlete and he's basically a linebacker.  When BYU begins to involve him in the run defense (and they will after FSU runs on the front-7), look for FSU to attack him in coverage.  BYU can't simulate FSU's speed in practice, so that should be interesting.  

BYU's secondary was already quite bad and should take a step back this season.  It's completely reasonable to say that FSU's 2nd-team secondary is better than BYU's starters.  That bodes well for the 'Noles as they practice against their second team.

 

Final Analysis

BYU's defense isn't very talented.  Their front-7 is experienced, but not deep.  Will they get worn out by FSU's supremely conditioned, talented, and athletic offensive line?  It's doubtful they can stop the run with their front 7, but if they use their big strong safety, they can slow the run.  Then the fun starts.  BYU's 215lb strong safety is obviously not a cover guy.  Will they commit their alignment to stop the run and the bubble screen- leaving their green secondary on an island with FSU's future NFL wideouts, or will they commit their alignment to stop the run and the deep ball, leaving the bubble wide open?  History suggests it is the latter.  BYU's defense is very conservative.  They rarely blitz and try to make the offense move the ball down the field in small chunks.  That didn't work last year, but it's very unlikely that BYU will put their corners on an island unless they get very desperate (which they might).  BYU's defense will probably be a tad better than 81st nationally this year, but there doesn't seem to be many reasons to expect major improvement. 

 

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One question

Who is the 3rd all-american candidate on the OL? Datko?

http://today.sportingnews.com/sportingnewstoday/20081229/?pg=2

by tdchrisdavis on Aug 14, 2009 12:35 PM EDT reply actions  

One more actually

What was Miami’s idiotic defensive plan vs us last year? Were they staying in their man cover 2, leaving the QB with plenty of room to run?

http://today.sportingnews.com/sportingnewstoday/20081229/?pg=2

by tdchrisdavis on Aug 14, 2009 12:36 PM EDT reply actions  

Considerably worse on defense.

I normally don’t write stuff that says “this team sucks”, but this defense was worse than Duke.

by Bud Elliott on Aug 14, 2009 12:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

I'm really hoping to make it up (and over) for this game.

I don’t get “scared” about our opponents. Sometimes I feel we’re overmatched, but I don’t get “scared”. Many people are “scared” of this game, and I understand why (potent offense, long travel, early in the season, possibly overlooked), but I like our chances A LOT.
What’s the early guess at the over/under for this contest?

by The K-Man on Aug 14, 2009 12:39 PM EDT reply actions  

Can't wait for this game

I am fully expecting a win.

http://today.sportingnews.com/sportingnewstoday/20081229/?pg=2

by tdchrisdavis on Aug 14, 2009 12:40 PM EDT reply actions  

Didn't read all that... just gonna tell you right now.

When I first saw how long it was, I thought either they are reallly good or they are as a good as the Temple B-Team.

Looks like it’s the latter… I’ll get around to reading this later. Looks like some good analysis.

Thanks.

by coonhound on Aug 14, 2009 12:46 PM EDT reply actions  

My question

With the strong safety coming up to defend the run like he’ll have to, does that mean our Z wideout, Goodman, should be expected to have the big game since he’ll be the beneficiary of single coverage all day?

Swagger, Intensity, Execution

by DKfromVA on Aug 14, 2009 12:48 PM EDT reply actions  

So why all the national hype around BYU?

A) Mainstream media hasn’t actually watched a BYU game?

2) Media looking at Offense only, and disregarding the quality of opponent?

D) Everybody loves a BCS buster from the MWC?

I mean Andre Ware picked them to beat OK, SI has them as a real test for us (and I believe has them beating us since they predict us to go 9-3, 7-1 in conference..which means losing 2 non-conf games: UF and ? BYU would be my guess)

by jasonole59 on Aug 14, 2009 1:25 PM EDT reply actions  

I know....

but only to an extent. Didn’t matter enough to get Utah in the BCS championship game.

by jasonole59 on Aug 14, 2009 1:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

This

seems to be an exaggeration:

“They don’t play anyone.”

You can ask the Alabama Crimson Tide about the Utes last season. Or Boise State about TCU. Say what you want about the weak PAC-10 teams BYU has played, but at least they were scheduled trying to find “bigger” opponents.

by sroufe on Aug 14, 2009 3:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

E game. Body of work. Small conf elite teams done have the attrition the big boys face. They pull their starters early, not subjecting them to injury.

by Bud Elliott on Aug 14, 2009 3:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

Following the trend

For whatever reason, probably remembering the “glory days”, a lot of the media picked BYU as the #2 team in the MWC instead of TCU. So with Utah losing so much, and the MWC being seen as better than the Big East and at least equal to the Pac 10 by some of the media, then whoever is picked to win the conference must be pretty good in a lot of people’s minds. Last season several MWC fans on ESPN’s blog network invaded the ACC section with their delusions of grandeur.

The truth is that even in this age of parity the difference between the true haves and have nots is the ability to constantly reload instead of having to wait until you get a team full of quality upper classmen. The only MWC team IMO that has a shot at doing that is TCU because Texas has so much talent. BYU has lost a lot and can’t recruit at the level needed to replace what they lost or at least off set it. I wish we could play them before OU though. If they get crushed in the first game winning over them won’t have the same shine.

by osceolafan850 on Aug 14, 2009 1:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

Hmmm rethink that last bit...

Check your sources on recruiting. While in the past BYU cannot recruit at the same level of the “Florida” teams, their recruiting classes seem to be improving and in fact, are top 15. Check out the recruiting class rankings for 2010 on scout.com

I’m a BYU fan, and while I don’t agree with everything written in this article, in regards to last years team, you’re probably right. I would count our defense out too soon, though. If FSU comes in with a “we will stomp these guys” attitude, they might be in for some surprises. Execution can make up for some poor team speed (not all of it, but some).

Good luck to both teams.

by DPG on Aug 15, 2009 10:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

Are you kidding?

BYU is top 15 because they have 24 commits. They’re classs has room for 1 more person, the cycle isnt even close to over. We are #24 with 11! recruits.

You were #40 in 2009, and #57 in 2008 on Scout.com.

It would have taken you 3 minutes and a little intelligence to not look like a moron.

by SWFLNole. on Aug 15, 2009 10:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

Wow, settle down there

If you took 3 minutes to actually read my post, no where was I saying that we compete with Florida for recruits or have the same talent level. I was only making a point that it is improving, which you yourself pointed out by stating we went from #57 in ’08 to #40 in ’09 and ’10 looks to be even better (should finish AT LEAST in the top 30).

Now who’s the moron again?

Again, this just seems to show just how much some Florida fans have the blinders on and think their school is invincible. This game should be a lot of fun, no matter what the outcome.

by DPG on Aug 17, 2009 2:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

Reason

Their offense is one of the best in the nation and can hang our outscore most teams. To be honest I feel the FSU game is a toss up because BYU has won 18 straight at home and is very, very good there. Again the hype is on the offense which is real good. I would not be surprised if either team won the game but the edge has to be at BYU because they are at home, and the past few years BYU has been better then Florida State

by Jeremy Mauss on Aug 14, 2009 1:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

yeah, I gave the offense props...

It seems that most of the negativity I see about BYU’s offense (as I’ve been searching) comes from BYU fans. Many don’t seem to be happy with Max Hall for whatever reason.

by jasonole59 on Aug 14, 2009 1:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

Maybe because

he threw 5 interceptions against the arch-rivals last season in Salt Lake…

Vanquish the Foe, a BYU Cougars blog at SB Nation

by sroufe on Aug 14, 2009 3:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

but...

He is still a good QB and BYU fans should not complain about him. Also, we all know the reason for the picks is because the coaching staff is stubborn and did not continue running Harvey Unga in the Utah game where he was averaging 5+ yards a carry.

by Jeremy Mauss on Aug 14, 2009 6:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

Against WHO?

http://i29.tinypic.com/2ziwoar.jpg

Espn do you think maybe we could get someone to cover the ACC that wears big boy pants?

TEBOW IS A GAY ROBOT

by stevegrizzle on Aug 14, 2009 1:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

oops, meant to do this.........

While I “respect” your “opinion”, It seems that you are placing WAY too much emphasis on Home Field Advantage and it also seems you have commented without reading the Article.
GL, I hope you arent betting on the game:)

Espn do you think maybe we could get someone to cover the ACC that wears big boy pants?

TEBOW IS A GAY ROBOT

by stevegrizzle on Aug 14, 2009 1:50 PM EDT up reply actions  

Record wise, I agree

but BYU simply doesn’t play anyone. They rack up easy win after easy win.

by Bud Elliott on Aug 14, 2009 1:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

According to this

their defense is absolutely laughable!! If our offense is as good as advertised in practice these guys are gonna have a LONG LONG day. But really if our offense is as good as a year ago they’d be in a long day too. I’m not one to make predictions but I think we put up 40 if we come to play.

by truenole87 on Aug 14, 2009 1:40 PM EDT reply actions  

maybe

FSU fans should not get too sure in thinking this is a sure win. The past few years FSU has not been great while BYU has come off of 3 straight 10 win seasons. Now I give FSU a real chance to win but to call this a sure thing for either squad is laughable. BYU I think is 1-17 or around there in the past 10 years against ranked non-conference opponents. Sure win not a chance

by Jeremy Mauss on Aug 14, 2009 1:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

I understand that BYU has won 10 in 3 straight seasons

But I always take competition into consideration. Numbers don’t lie, the teams they play are weak and most teams that are decent can beat a weak team. I’ve learned in the sobering post dynasty years that nothing is a sure win, but BYU hasn’t been tested very often and when they are tested they tend to lose as you just illustrated with their non-conference record against ranked opponents.

by truenole87 on Aug 14, 2009 1:49 PM EDT up reply actions  

12-0? 11-1?

IMO… I do not believe the 2008 ‘Noles could have beat Utah in Salt Lake City or TCU in Fort Worth. The Washington game in Seattle with a healthy Jake Locker is debatable as well. I’m also not sure FSU beats Arizona in Las Vegas but I think it would have been a much better game than what the Cougars provided. I think FSU goes 11-2 or 10-3 (BYU’s record) against BYU’s 2008 schedule.

by sroufe on Aug 14, 2009 2:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

BYU hasn’t beaten a ranked bcs team since joining the MWC. FSU played 9 bowl teams lst year and went 6-4 against them, 6 of whom were ranked.

BYU’s schedule is a joke. FSU would win 8 of the games on that schedule by 40+. I think BYU loses to wisconsin and maryland.

BYU just doesn’t have the talent to beat good teams. Put another way, BYU wwouldnt be bowl eligible with FSU’s schedule. BYU would be the 2nd worst team FSU played.

by Bud Elliott on Aug 14, 2009 2:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

Nice...

I love the “we will kill these guys” mentality that is brewing here. I seem to recall a #1 ranked Miami team had a similar attitude. While I agree 100% that FSU clearly has more talented athletes, I will dispute the fact that they execute as well as BYU. On paper, FSU should pound BYU, but I wouldn’t count them out so quickly.

by DPG on Aug 15, 2009 10:41 PM EDT up reply actions  

Washington?

You don’t think FSU could have beaten a team that did not win a single game? A team that got blown out in most of its games except for against WSU, Stanford and yep BYU. I think FSU would have rolled Washington easily.

"No, like I said, Woo peed on my rug" - The Dude

by Surfanole on Aug 14, 2009 3:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

There is no way you will convince another teams fan they are wrong.

I know everyone here is thinking that the BYU fans are delusional for thinking they are our equals but thats what makes them fans. I would expect nothing less.

I look at it this way. We will visit their home (which is spectacular in terms of natural beauty of the mountains). We will bring our team, our philosophy and our confidence and they will bring theirs. Let the best man win!!!

by diablonole on Aug 14, 2009 3:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

No, I agree...

That’s why I said FSU would possibly still have an 11-2 record. I think FSU would have beaten Washington. What I’m saying is it could have been closer than might you think. Seattle is a very tough place to play – ask USC. Jake Locker is a phenomenal athlete but missed most of 2008 and that is a major reason why they were terrible and Willingham lost his job.

Vanquish the Foe, a BYU Cougars blog at SB Nation

by sroufe on Aug 14, 2009 5:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

10 win

I’m not arguing that some of their opponents the past couple of years have been less than stellar (particularly in conference play), however, they have at least scheduled games against programs in historically successful/bigger conferences.

2008 – @Washington (W), UCLA (W);
2007 – Arizona (W), @UCLA (L);
2006 – @Arizona (L), @ Boston College (L – OT)

TCU and Utah have also been very strong in the MWC this decade. Give Bronco Mendenhall and the post-Gary Crowton Cougars a bit of credit. Think of the disaster that was inherited in 2005. I would argue that winning 10 games, in three straight seasons is difficult no matter what conference you’re playing in. Some contributors here/elsewhere speak about the missionary factor as if it’s a huge benefit – but imagine trying to step on the field with D1 players after not having touched a football for two years spent in Japan getting doors slammed in your face 300 times a day.

Not trying to pick a fight, just illustrate a point that 10 wins can be impressive even if you have Wyoming and San Diego State on your schedule each year.

by sroufe on Aug 14, 2009 3:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think what BYU has done is impressiveand I really want to give them credit for scheduling this year.

But the nonSconf games they scheduled were agaonst teams which were down, though probably unintentional.

Whichever team wants to step up to the plate to put the mwc into the elite needs to play 5 or 6 against bcs conference bowl teams and win them. Wins in BCS games won’t get it done because they don’t have the resume to be there. They don’t face the attrition teams with real schedules to

by Bud Elliott on Aug 14, 2009 3:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

The scheduled

games against UCLA, Arizona and Washington were unintentionally weak. More was expected of those programs – UCLA most of all but the other two as well with their “name” coaches (Stoops and Willingham).

Vanquish the Foe, a BYU Cougars blog at SB Nation

by sroufe on Aug 14, 2009 5:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

Come on, man.

Gotta bring something more to the table than that.

This isn’t Warchant.

by Fire Machine on Aug 14, 2009 2:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

we can

as long as the team and coaches don’t.

And they won’t.

FSU has struggled this decade, to be sure. Our new O staff is into the second year of the transformation, including team conditiioning. From everything I’ve read, this young team is talented, in shape, mad, and ready to explode on the nation— beginning this year but especially the next.

This will be a statement game on national TV, so we won’t come out flat. As for the altitude, we pasted Colorado, at home, at ~1000 ft higher altitude, and we were the stronger team at the end of the game. We’re way ahead of the 2007 team in terms of conditioning. I just don’t think home field will be much of an advantage, especially if I decide to fly up. :)

by FiestaNole on Aug 14, 2009 3:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

Your article could be much more shorter and be less time consuming by saying attack the secondary that is weak and the corners play eight yards off the line. Run up the middle because the Cougs are weak at NT with departures, and the only player is Jan Jorgensen who is really good but can not do it all himself.

by Jeremy Mauss on Aug 14, 2009 1:45 PM EDT reply actions  

But it will be a close game?

You seem to contradict yourself here unless this is sarcasm…..

Espn do you think maybe we could get someone to cover the ACC that wears big boy pants?

TEBOW IS A GAY ROBOT

by stevegrizzle on Aug 14, 2009 1:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

Exactly

The information TN puts up is pretty much objective all the time because they understand that lying to the fans isn’t going to increase FSU’s chances of winning. If BYU’s defense were great, that’s exactly what would have been presented in this article.

by truenole87 on Aug 14, 2009 2:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think it's OK for them to come and make unsupported comments.

Just refer back to what was in the article so they actually have to read it.
Then, even if they don’t believe it will happen now, they at least understand why what is happening is happening when it unfolds on the field.

by Aussierat on Aug 14, 2009 2:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

Exactly x2

I would be happy to start up a site that has the following break down:

2009 FSU vs BYU Offensive and Defensive Preview!
BYU sucks, FSU wins big.
The end.

At least 10000 hits a day on a quality site like that. The stats ENHANCE the average joe’s (like me) understanding of the game. Keep’em Comin’.

Not an alcoholic, just an FSU grad.

by onebarrelrum on Aug 14, 2009 2:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

I just don't see our team losing

to a team who’s defense is as bad as BYU’s. Facts are facts and BYU has taken a step back on an already terrible defense. When this article says that BYU has a weaker defense than any we faced last season, its not even CLOSE. Couple that with the fact that our offense is expected to be greatly improved from a season ago and it just doesn’t look good for BYU. Home field advantage is a plus and your offense can be good but the quick remedy to that is FSU taking the clock management route. Running the ball down the cougars’ throats and eating up the clock will suck the life out of their defense and their crowd while keeping the ball out of their offense’s hands. Running the ball is something we’ll be perfectly capable of doing and something BYU has a hard time stopping. Mind you its not a forgone conclusion that our defense can’t stop their offense. If we can, it’ll remove the need for clock management.

by truenole87 on Aug 14, 2009 1:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

BYU's Secondary

Corby Eason, a JC transfer, has actually passed Brian Logan on the depth chart at field corner. Highlights of Eason here.

Another name that could get major playing time against the ‘Noles is JC transfer Lee Aguirre. Aguirre Brandon Bradley’s backup at boundary corner. Highlights of Aguirre are here.

While I agree that BYU’s secondary isn’t go to be anything special, I do disagree with this:

“BYU’s secondary was already quite bad and should take a step back this season.”

I don’t think the secondary will be worse than last year with these JC transfers and freshman Craig Bills providing depth. I also expect Rich to be solid at safety.

by sroufe on Aug 14, 2009 2:33 PM EDT reply actions  

DB

It will be very difficult for their secondary to be as bad as last year, but they will not be real good.

by Jeremy Mauss on Aug 14, 2009 6:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

lil off topic

but my friend is a gaytor fan and he sent me this link that has videos and ect from their practices, thought it might be some good insight.

www.coachurbanmeyer.com

by jfree on Aug 14, 2009 3:01 PM EDT reply actions  

I’m so sorry I clicked on that link…. I have to go clean up my mess

by NoleRaised on Aug 15, 2009 11:41 AM EDT up reply actions  

So could we compare this Def to something like the First 2 games we played last year.

Also Small front 7 and in a 3-4 that means they only have 3 big(not that big though) on the line and 4 smaller (all about 220) how fast are then. We could run right at them with this new H-back look and just stretch them out and down there throat.

Why is the sky blue? Because, God Loves the Infantry

by Desman on Aug 14, 2009 5:28 PM EDT reply actions  

I think we win this game BUT.......

It seems that everyone here is forgetting that BYU plays the type of ball FSU struggles to contain. An NFL TE is like kryptonite to our defense. A big running back running right at the heart of our defense, that has always been a problem for us. A QB that throws on timing (ala Wuerffel) has caused us nightmares.

I am in no way saying that BYU is an elite team but if we get into a scoring battle with them, who knows what could happen. And with the early rash of injuries we are having, you never know what team we take out there.

Again, I think we win because I think on paper we are better and I am a die-hard Nole. But FSU has consistently as of late let teams stay with us when we should have beat them handily.

by diablonole on Aug 14, 2009 6:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

just watched CFL and they talked about BYU going 9-3 and winning the Mout W.

This team has just lost to much on the O-line and if there Def is as bad as this report says I dont see them with 5L this year. Thats not good for them but at least we get them up frount before they are kicked off the top 25 and could help our ranks.

Why is the sky blue? Because, God Loves the Infantry

by Desman on Aug 14, 2009 8:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

Just 1 gripe

I read the offense report and thought it was great. The defense report, yeah, ok, or defense sucks. I’ll admit that. I do think BYU will turn out to be a better game than most of you believe, but hey, we’re all fans. That’s what we do.
Actually I’ve been pretty impressed the the reporting I read here. Well done.

Anyway, there’s only one thing I’d say the whole “somehow” there was a snafu was a bit of a jab. Tialavea basically signed up to serve his mission and was asked to report in Nov. The fans were all kind of up in the air about what was going on, but it turned out they (Tialavea and the coaches) asked for him to be able to report after the end of the season rather than in Nov so it got moved back to Dec 31. That’s what this snafu was.

by Gidgidonihah on Aug 14, 2009 8:16 PM EDT reply actions  

you know what, I didnt know about all the mission work.

I think thats awasom. I have to say I would love to pull for you guys in every game other than the FSU one. Its cool how they do good work like this and still get all 4 years and a R shirt. what religion is the School.

Why is the sky blue? Because, God Loves the Infantry

by Desman on Aug 14, 2009 8:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

This is excellent stuff

way to go FSUn. My football IQ goes up a few points every time I read one of your stories.

by missourinole on Aug 14, 2009 9:39 PM EDT reply actions  

FSU way too overconfident

A few flaws from the above analysis. FSU will not be playing BYU’s 2008 defense. This year with 3 Juco transfers, BYU finally has some symbolance of a real secondary with adequate speed to cover. The Cougars should be more closer to their 2006 and 2007 defense which was more than servicable and no team even came close to running them out of the stadium.
In addition, if Fla State is so much better than BYU, then why didn’t the Noles put up 50 pts on BYU in 2000 when they last played. That was a poorous 6-6 BYU team with no offense that kept the Noles under 30 while playing in J’ville -essentially a FSU home game. No way FSU gets over 24 pts this year in Provo.
Finally, I see FSU getting careless with the ball in front of 65,000 screaming LDS faithful which should be good for 21 easy points for BYU in addition to the methodical drives we will have. Final score BYU 42 FSU 24 and BYU’s home winning streak extends to 19.
Sorry, I know you guys in Tallahassee are quickly becoming worried. But you will have your patsy game against Duke later in the year to give you a chance to rediscover your manhood. Good night now!!!!

by 84Coug on Aug 15, 2009 3:10 AM EDT reply actions  

Altitude will be BYU's best Defense

First off – these BYU articles have been great! While having some FSU-slant (which is expected) – they are very well researched and written.

Now – for the main factor that will determine the outcome of the game – Altitude. At sea level, oxygen makes up 20.9% of every breath you take. In Provo, at 4500 feet elevation you get approximately a 20% drop in pressure, reducing effective oxygen intake to just 17% per breath. Regardless of how FSU conditions for the BYU game, it is nearly impossible for teams to acclimate within the 2-3 days that they are at elevation prior to gametime. By the end of the 3rd quarter, most of FSU’s 2-deep will be gassed. FSU will need to be up 28 points at the end of the 3rd to win the game, and I just don’t think that will happen.

As a BYU fan, having watched Miami and aTm meltdown in 4th quarters in Provo – I think that altitude will be BYU’s best friend and make our ‘below-average’ D better against your potent O and make our outstanding O better against FSU’s slowed-down D.

Just as a footnote to altitude being a great defense, BYU has to play @ Wyoming this year in Laramie – elevation 7200 feet above sea level – with a further 10% drop in effective oxygen available compared to Provo (or 28% drop from sea level). If you look at BYU’s record in Laramie, there have been some crazy games up there in the past because BYU players get fatigued by the end of the 3rd up there (and from dodging the urine bombs the Cowboys fans throw during pre-game – but that’s another story).

by m4t4d0r on Aug 15, 2009 10:00 AM EDT reply actions  

Urine Bombs?

>-----:----:------>Spear 'em then Scalp 'em

by FrankDNole on Aug 15, 2009 11:36 AM EDT up reply actions  

cougar fan regards

I’d have to say the analysis is excellent. I have us going 9-3 this year with losses to OU, FSU and one MWC loss. In general, I don’t think Cougar fans give FSU the credit they deserve. But I watched the Wisconsin game last year and a young FSU team that returns ALL of their skill players dominated the Badgers.

by kiyoshige on Aug 15, 2009 11:38 AM EDT reply actions  

Do you know how scared FSU fans would be if BYU beats OU.

Also how would that make the BCS go. Then if we won how that would look for us. That could throw a big wrench in the wheels.

Why is the sky blue? Because, God Loves the Infantry

by Desman on Aug 15, 2009 9:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

This article

Ah….. interesting analysis. Funny, ESPN.com says the cougar D will be a top 20 if not top 10 D with a Great front 7. As for the ACC, the bottom teams were a little better than the bottom MWC teams. I wouldn’t get too excited about how “good” FSU was last year though. 4 losses. Almost shut out by a weak Wake team (right, don’t say they were #18 at the time) they also play teams like ELON and lose to Navy. That’s a powerhouse. And you lost to G.T. Again don’t fool yourself into thinking they were that good. Hey, but its good to be optimistic before the season.

by cougs1 on Aug 15, 2009 12:55 PM EDT reply actions  

Weak Wake team?

That Wake defense had 4 top 4 round draft picks…

GT or Wake would win the MWC. Please. Talent. BYU doesn’t have it.

by Bud Elliott on Aug 15, 2009 3:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

BYU game

I’d agree with the content of the analysis for this game…I love BYU, love to see them win big games, especially against the “better” talented teams, like OU and FSU, Washington, UCLA, etc., and in fact, on a couple of occasions they actually have one a couple of those gams, over the years past, in fact, they’ve actually played and beat OK before…mid ’90’s, so, it’s not out of the question, however, this is 2009. BYU has lost, to injuries to date, two starting linemen, and that has to hurt. As to their size, being on the light side, I find that interesting, especially when you look at the girth around the middle of many of these OL, and DL…as to altitude…well, from experience, running around there in Provo, or Colorado, or Wyoming, it is very hard, and that’s without pads, etc., my hat is off to anyteam that comes to Provo to play football, or any sport for that matter, it is hard, I know I couldn’t have done in the day. Anyway, FSU has great players, size and most important speed. The analysis was very good and interesting. Have a good trip to Provo and don’t beat up on our guys to much, we want them in tact to beat TCU and Utah for sure!

by YCoug on Aug 15, 2009 1:11 PM EDT reply actions  

Just wondering. . .

I think from the article on BYU’s offense as well as this, we can sum it up into saying, “FSU is way out of BYU’s league, and will beat them easily”. I remember Oregon’s coach with precisely the same attitude before his team lost in the Las Vegas Bowl to BYU 38-8, and his tone after the loss was defiantly the same. I’m wondering if you will be man enough to accept reality if BYU beats FSU. I’m guessing not.

by Cougar Passion on Aug 15, 2009 7:44 PM EDT reply actions  

re: Why so defensive?

I’m not disputing that, in particular. If you have seen my comment about the article on the offense as well, you will understand what I am saying. Let’s put it this way: I read a similar analysis from a writer for Oklahoma (who we play our first game at a “neutral” site in the heart of Big 12 country) that was much more respectful in tone. Did this writer think BYU was going to beat Oklahoma? I highly doubt it. On paper, Oklahoma is easily a superior team. Yet he acknowledged the possibility that BYU could give his Sooners trouble. I don’t know—maybe it’s because his Sooners actually lost to a team from a weak conference that plays a weak schedule. You remember Boise State, I’m guessing? No one gave Boise State a chance against mighty Oklahoma. No one gave Utah a chance against Alabama in SEC territory. My point is this: Sure, do an analysis of the opponent, but why not do it with respect? Oregon’s coach wouldn’t respect BYU, even after his team got crushed. You can either be man enough to show an opponent proper respect, or not. What’s wrong with the former?

And yes, I see BYU beating FSU in Provo.

by Cougar Passion on Aug 15, 2009 8:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

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