Florida State Spring Football Position Preview: Secondary
This is the 9th and final in a multi-part series covering the various position groups as Florida State begins Spring practice today. So far we've looked at Quarterback, Running Back, Wide Receiver, Offensive Line, Tight End/ H-Back, Defensive End, Defensive Tackle, and linebacker. There is no way to sugarcoat how bad FSU's defense was last season. Straight by the raw numbers, FSU was 108th out of 120 teams nationally. Common sense, however, says that to go solely by aggregate yardage allowed is silly as it doesn't adjust for competition level. The advanced metrics account for opponent quality and they say FSU's defense was somewhere between 80th to 92nd out of 120. Of the 66 major conference teams, FSU was on the level (or worse than) only Louisville, Kansas, Indiana, Duke, Stanford, Kansas State, Iowa State, Illinois, and of course, Washington State. The last defenses to be this bad in ACC play were some of the mid-decade Duke teams. If you want more comparisons and perspective, check out Closing The Book On The 2009 FSU Defense.
To me, there were two groups on FSU's defense that played at or around an average level: cornerbacks and defensive tackles. Defensive Ends, Linebackers, and Safeties played horribly. But both corners and safeties are coached by the same man and I'll address them together. Everyone knows about Mickey Andrews' tragic family issues and that his focus was obviously not on the team. Enter Mark Stoops, the decorated defensive coordinator from Arizona. He will coach defensive backs and coordinate the defense. Stoops comes highly recommended from multiple Jimbo Fisher contacts, most notably Will Muschamp of Texas.
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| Defensive Coordinator and Secondary Coach Mark Stoops |
Stoops recently met with the media. He's quite a bit different than Mickey Andrews. Andrews was very southern. Stoops is extremely midwestern. But like Andrews in his prime, Stoops consistently has his defense performing at a very high level. Expect articles this off-season on Stoops schematic concepts, but for now just know that FSU is going to be playing a lot more zone. That is a needed change as FSU's schemes were stale and were quite vulnerable even if FSU had the most elite of talent, which it did not. The talent is quite good, though young, and Stoops is excited to again work with elite athletes like he had at Miami in the early part of the last decade.
The most important changes will be stressing assignment football and attention to detail. Teams exploited FSU's lack of attention to detail and lack of discipline. It is not about making plays. It is about executing your assignment with championship discipline and technique. It's good to force turnovers by putting the offense into a negative leverage down, pressuring the quarterback, and forcing him into a bad throw. It's not good to attempt to force turnovers by gambling and playing recklessly. While FSU forced a lot of turnovers last year, the turnovers were often a result of poor process. And that poor process was exposed on a mind-boggling number of big plays given up. Stoops will not tell his guys to go make plays. He will tell them to go play their assignment and let the turnovers come to them. That change, along with the new zone schemes, will present a major adjustment for FSU's defensive backs. FSU's defensive backs are going to have to leverage the hash, pattern read, squeeze routes, pass off receivers, etc. Importantly, Stoops will fit this system to the players better than we saw over the past few years. It will not be easy and the whole process will probably not show until 2011. Before proficiency comes competency and competency is the goal for the 2010 defense.
FSU loses its best defender in cornerback Patrick Robinson. Robinson played very well last season but was exposed a few times as the scheme put him in an untenable position. Can FSU's secondary get better despite losing one of the top corners in the country? Definitely, and part of that is because of other losses. Florida State thankfully is rid of #22 Korey Mangum, a safety who was terrible. The 'Noles also lose Jamie Robinson, the free safety who played somewhere between average and below average. Losing Mangum is a huge gain for the 'Noles. FSU was effectively playing 10-on-11 with him on the field. Please note that both Robinson and Mangum were great 'Noles who didn't slack. My evaluation of their play is not a reflection of their person. Who will step up?
Cornerback
I said above that I think the corners played a lot better than the safeties. There's a lot of room for improvement but FSU doesn't need miracles here.
Ochuko Jenije is likely to have one corner spot locked up. The 5'11" 195 lb Redshirt Senior from Tallahassee (4* recruit) played well at times last year and received some unwarranted criticism that should have rightfully been strewn upon Mangum. Jenijie can be a tremendous zone corner. His skill-set was not all that well suited for Andrews' man-heavy coverage schemes. Jenijie is smart, strong, and a good tackler. He started most of the games last year and had a few interceptions. I am fairly sure Jenijie will be a draft pick next April based solely on his physical skills. He's my bet for surprise player of the year (if I can pick a returning senior starter, haha) as I think he'll quickly grasp Stoops' scheme. Jenijie had graduated and is now in grad school.
Inside, you'll find breakdowns of the other 10 DBs.
Next is the much-heralded Greg Reid. I like the 5'8" 174 lb sophomore a lot-- as a kick and punt returner. Reid is the best return man in the country. His vision in the open field is incredible. But as a corner Greg did not play well last year. He did make some highlight interceptions, but those interceptions and interception attempts highlighted what I talked about above. Greg didn't make his interceptions as a result of playing his assignment. He got them by freelancing. And as a result of that freelancing, he was burnt a ton. He either didn't know or refused to play his assignment and hurt the defense. Additionally, Greg didn't tackle well. Everyone is assuming that Reid will start, and every FSU fan wants to see his natural playmaking skills on display, but he has a ton of work to do. Reid must know his assignments and pay attention to the details. He absolutely cannot freelance. And he must tackle. He must avoid the sophomore slump. If he doesn't, we'll be left to watch Greg on special teams and spot duty as the 3rd corner.
I'm excited about Redshirt Freshman Xavier Rhodes. The 6'1" 209 lb Miami native had people buzzing last year. He has a great skill set to play in this new zone-heavy scheme. While we haven't seen much of his ball skills, but Rhodes is very physical and loves to compete. Someone told me that if he could have one DB in a street fight, it would be Rhodes. Rhodes is tough. If he can understand what he is asked to do in the new scheme, he could really excel. I am excited to see him re-route receivers and squeeze them down. His height and considerable size should also help him. Rhodes was hampered by thumb surgery last year and I'm glad he was redshirted. It would not surprise me if Rhodes played a lot and maybe even start.
Dionte Allen is quite the unknown. Rated the 40th best overall player in the country in 2007, Allen definitely has ability. But injuries have hampered the 5'11" 183 lb Michigan native. He redshirted in 2007 while battling injuries, battled injuries again in 2008, and played sparingly last season. Foot and ankle injuries are a tricky thing and there's a big question as to how much those injuries have robbed of his ability. He also had surgery on his hand or thumb (can't remember). Allen is likely playing for his scholarship this year as FSU could take up to 6 defensive back recruits and there won't be much room for many bench-warming seniors in 2011. I don't want to say that Allen can or can't play, because he just hasn't played very much. Let's see what he does. New schemes have a way of re-energizing players and highlighting previously unseen skills.
Avis Commack was moved to defensive back and I've heard conflicting reports as to where he would line up. I'm not going to address him, however, because he broke his femur and is trying to make it back in time for Fall camp.
There are some impressive freshmen coming in but I would be shocked if any of them start. JUCO corner Mike Harris will immediately be in the mix for a starting job, but like the freshmen, he doesn't arrive until June. This is a Spring preview.
Safety
The safeties are a great concern to me, but Stoops has been a miracle worker with safeties at previous stops and if he can get two guys to play at an average level this season it will be a huge coup. Nobody knows what to expect from this group. Whatever safety best demonstrates his grasp of the new scheme will play, regardless of play-making ability. Under no circumstances can FSU have it's centerfielder playing a guessing game. Stoops will ask these guys not to get burnt deep and to know their assignment on each play. Safeties will almost always be asked to play pass first, run second.
The most known commodity here is Nick Moody. The 6'2" 226 lb sophomore from Pennsylvania has de-bulked in the 4th-quarter program as FSU wants him to gain more flexibility, losing about 4 lbs of muscle. Moody should have played over Korey Mangum last season at the strong safety position, and Andrews refusal to play him illustrated the problem of having lame-duck coaches. The proper move would be to play the young kid, provided he was about as good as the older player, particularly when both have a similar amount of experience. But the interests of a lame duck coach are adverse to the interests of the program. There is no incentive for that outgoing coach to act in the best interest of the program and develop the younger player! Moody is a big hitter and a solid tackler. There was some thought that Moody would move to linebacker, but his weight loss probably signals that he will stay at safety. He could be a nice fit in the cover-3 sky:
But Moody has some serious work to do in the football classroom. I'm told he performed poorly on the coverage tests last season. That won't fly under Stoops. The defense needs to be solid, and it can be solid by having lesser athletes execute their assignments. Nick has a long way to go, but he is a really nice fit at Strong Safety provided he is willing to put in the work to understand his role within the scheme.
Teamwork is very important while playing zone defense. Zone defense where everyone simply goes to their zone is not good zone defense. Zone defense where everyone is using their step advantage (positioning off tendencies, motion, etc), leveraging percentages to the hilt, passing off receivers, etc. That is good zone defense. And that can't happen until everyone first knows and perfects their individual assignment.
Next up is Terrance Parks. The 6'2" 212 lb Junior safety is very talented. But he is lazy in practice. That's not acceptable and the coaches are loathe to play someone who is willing to work hard in a game and not in practice. There's some thought that Parks may have faked injuries in the past in order to get out of difficult drills, then acted healthy when it came time to scrimmage. Everyone gets a clean slate under the new staff and this is his opportunity to start off on the right foot. Parks has great range and good size. In a perfect world, he would start at free safety and patrol the deep third of the field. Parks needs to make sure his career doesn't go up in smoke. If it does, he could be out after this season, under the "senior non-starters who aren't team leaders or serious contributors won't be welcome" idea. Oh, and he also has some of the Nick Moody know the play problems. Stoops needs to be able to trust Parks if Parks is to be the free safety. He'll have to earn that trust. But if he does, look out, because he has a ton of ability.
I am impressed with Redshirt Freshman Gerald Demps. The 5'11" 206 lb Demps was Greg Reid's secondary mate for Lowndes Co. HS (Valdosta, GA). He is unquestionably the lesser known of the two. Demps has a fair amount of ability and has really embraced the new strength and conditioning program, bulking up to 206 lbs. Demps plays smart on his high school film. I think he needs a dose of confidence, as he really got down on himself last year, but his work in the off-season program is encouraging. It would not surprise me if he starts.
Jajuan Harley is a bit of an enigma. He's easily the most athletic safety and checks in at 6'2" 210 lbs. The former 4* recruit played mostly on special teams last season, and I'm eager to see what he can do as a sophomore. But there are concerns here. Harley had a concussion last season and sometimes those injuries are funny. He never really came back right from the concussion, and on top of that he lost some weight with what I seem to remember being a viral infection. He also had a head injury in high school. Every FSU fan hopes that Harley can get right in the head. Because if he can get right, his Athleticism is head and shoulders above all the other DBs. I think he's a bit overrated, though, more of the "great athlete not great football player" mold, at least from his high school film.
I don't think Redshirt Sophomore Ed Imeokparia or Redshirt Freshman Justin Bright will figure into the equation. It's unlikely either player would have been recruited by the new staff had they had the chance. Imeokparia is 6'0" 196 lbs and isn't profiled in the Spring guide, nor listed in the Secondary section. He tore his ACL prior to the 2008 season and redshirted while recovering. I'd bet money that he's not on the 2011 roster. Bright was recruited to lure the 2010 Byrnes high school kids to Florida State (which did not happen). He's not very athletic and looks like a womens soccer player in his recent photo with the pony tail. He's bulked up to 6'0" 185 from 180 lbs. Bright has a very outside chance to start at safety if (and really only if due to his lack of ability) the other safeties screw around and don't take their football studying seriously. If that happens FSU has a serious problem. FSU is bringing in some serious stud recruits at safety this year and Bright could (should) be part of the attrition crunch after this season or next unless he makes huge strides.
Expect a lot of mistakes from this group and potentially an ugly Spring game. By Fall though, they should make enough strides to have FSU's defense in the top half of BCS conference teams.
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Errr, that would be the 'sophomore slump'
by Thurman Gillespy on Mar 16, 2010 1:19 PM EDT reply actions
And in one play
he managed to make the play and then give up 15 yards on the unsportsmanlike conduct. I think it was the UMD game but can’t remember.
"You play to WIN the GAME"
Mangum was horrible but he did the best he could – so as we critize him we should add the following phrase to the end of a comment :“bless his heart” so an appropriate comment would be: “Mangum clearly had the least amount of athletic ability and the lowest football I.Q. of a Seminole player since Jeffery was in uniform, bless his heart.”
Mangum
If this kid worked hard and gave it his best, we should leave him alone. The real criticism should be directed at the coach who evaluated him as a high school player and thought he could play at FSU and at the coaches that could not recruit or coach up any kids behind him and thus put him on the bench.. Mangum is a symptom of the larger disease. Let’s ease up on him.
by Big Boss Mann on Mar 16, 2010 4:20 PM EDT up reply actions
Congratulating him I can see, but thanking him, not so much.
He had his Scholarship which should be thanks enough considering FSU did him a favor by keeping him the game.
"I am the way, the truth, and the life...no one gets to the Father but through Me"
Mangum was better as a boundary corner behind P. Rob his junior year. His assignment was in a smaller area and it worked with his aggressive style. Moving to safety put him at a disadvantage having to cover a larger area with more responsibility.
by RattlnSpear on Mar 17, 2010 1:15 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I think this Spring will be horrific....
We will get to see Jimbo’s well oiled Viper line up against Stoop’s rusty Dodge charger….With some time, effort, and polish that Charger will be something special….
"You play to WIN the GAME"
I think it's safe to say our defense was worse off than 10-on-11 with #22 last year.
When a hockey team is killing a Power Play, they adjust their remaining 4 skaters to compensate for the numerical disadvantage. This allows NHL teams to succeed in over 80% of shorthanded situations.
No imagine a team skating at full strength with assignments, but one player has flip-flops and a pool cue instead of a hockey stick. If the other 4 defenders play as instructed and do not adjust, the 5th skater will get exploited time after time.
This is what happened often with #22 on the field.
I doubt we see that poor of a defense ever again at Florida State, which is why I’m optimistic this year.
Based on high school film alone, I agree that Demps could be more productive than Harley over time. Everyone drooled over JaJuan’s 40 time and impressive broad jump, but I’ve seen little if any examples of football instincts, a willingness to bring the lumber, or textbook tackling technique. He’s only a true sophomore, but his clock is ticking this offseason.
Give me a coached-up Demps or Chad Abram and our Mangum/R. Williams nightmares should be squarely in the rearview mirror.
by The K-Man on Mar 16, 2010 1:54 PM EDT via mobile reply actions 4 recs
I just laughed really hard.
No imagine a team skating at full strength with assignments, but one player has flip-flops and a pool cue instead of a hockey stick. If the other 4 defenders play as instructed and do not adjust, the 5th skater will get exploited time after time.
This is what happened often with #22 on the field.
Brilliant.
i think the Bobby Bowden situation is kinda similar to the situation with
Craig Patrick at the end of his run with the Pittsburgh Penguins. Patrick was absolutely a legend, and built the team from the ground up.. but the game had obviously passed him by at the end of his career. As much as it hurt to see him go, it was time. The Pens brought in new blood that made some great personnel decisions, hired competent coaches and voila! a few years later they went on to win the cup. Let’s hope Jimbo is our Ray Shero.
by ArsonistSavior on Mar 16, 2010 6:42 PM EDT up reply actions
Hey!
Where else am I going to talk about FSU Hockey?
"Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable."
"But How will I know limits from lies, if I never try."
by geoffissiffoeg on Mar 16, 2010 8:55 PM EDT up reply actions
Hockey comments are allowed
Hockey is nearly as physical as football but more dangerous.
If the comments were men’s gymnastics then yes they should be ban. j/k
Go Noles!!
awesome
No imagine a team skating at full strength with assignments, but one player has flip-flops and a pool cue instead of a hockey stick.
this is far and away the funniest thing i’ve ever read on this site.. i’m still laughing
by ArsonistSavior on Mar 16, 2010 2:26 PM EDT up reply actions
K-man, as a huge hockey fan...
I love that analogy. And you. … No homo.
"Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable."
"But How will I know limits from lies, if I never try."
by geoffissiffoeg on Mar 16, 2010 8:53 PM EDT up reply actions
Is chuck amato on the bench, screaming at him to dive at the puck to make a play?
by NorthernHaze on Mar 17, 2010 12:57 AM EDT up reply actions
Excellent work Bud
I just read this, then read the cornerback preview another site wrote and laughed. Put them to shame.
Speak softly, and carry a big Spear
Great Artcile once again!
I really like Moody at SS and Parks or Harley at FS. Parks has a ton of talent that needs to be tapped into. Harely as a #2 Safety is a good problem to have
Not so much...
a non demps fan, but more of a Moody and Parks fan. I think we have 4 guys really battle it out between now and Fall. That can only be good. I too am not sure if Harley is startable at FS- but he’s a great #2 guy if we can teach him. Demps is a player who I feel is athletically inferior to Parks. Would not shock me to see Demps get quality PT in spring if Parks makes excuses or cannot be on the fireld- grown ass men!
While a certain minimum amount of athleticism is of course required
often a slower 40-time type player will play faster because he has better recognition skills or does not take false steps. That superior speed can only be used once the direction where the player must go is known. Can’t false-step in a 40-yard dash because, obviously, the direction is known.
I think Chad Abrams will be our best safety from this class because he understands the game.
by Bud Elliott on Mar 16, 2010 2:48 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
It's really hard to be a fan of any of the safeties after last year...
and I haven’t seen Demps or Bright play, so who knows.
I'm pumped about Demps!
High Footbal IQ. His HS coach said that his teammate G.Reid had more talent but Demps was a better football player. I’m so pumped about our LB & DB potential! Our DB classes from 09,10 & the one we are setting up in 11. Just wow. On paper we have the best DB core group from those 3 classes combined of anyone in the nation. I realize that paper doesn’t mean anything & that the 11 class is not signed but still I like how it look as of today. Good Luck to Demps & all our DB’s
GO NOLES!!! SCALP EM!
Ugh!
Thank for the reminder of how poor our safety recruiting has been. But I am definitely looking forward to seeing safeties act like safeties again.
I don't know if the recruiting has been bad.
We have 2 4*’s and 3 3*’s. I do think the development has been poor.
Great preview as always i love this site!
Please tell me we won’t play a lot of cover 3 sanches just killed penn state’s cover 3
We will play a ton of cover-3
It’s a great coverage. Many of the top defenses in the country play a ton of it, including Bama. Who is sanches?
Oh
Well I think it is ridiculous to make a value judgment off of one game, particularly when that judgment is of an NFL QB playing what is essentially a home game against an overmatched team. Cover-3 is a great coverage.
That’s like denouncing the Bucs’ cover-2 after Manning beat it on Monday night.
There are of course good and bad cover-3 teams, good and bad cover-2 teams, etc
And even the good ones have bad days.
Stoops didn’t have great players at Zona, but he did have good defenses. To me, that’s scheme and player development.
Cover-3
Are you expecting to see a lot of Cover 3 period, or are you expecting it to be the call on obvious passing downs?
by osceolafan850 on Mar 16, 2010 3:05 PM EDT up reply actions
That's a great example
BC consistently a top 10 defense. Oklahoma works as well. As does Bama. UF plays lots of cover-3 when they ZB
Spaziani really knows what he's doing
Gotta think Kuechly was able to make so many plays as a frosh because of the educated unit play of their defense.
Bud, how convinced are you that Dent stays at WR?
I remember hearing rumblings that most like him better at Safety.
Agreed
WR- and I think a darn good one come 2011!
I like Shaw, Dent and C. Green for the next 3 years!!!
Throw in Haulstead for some of those!!!
USC's 2010 WR class was better
Prater, Woods, and Ambles
by westcoastnolefan on Mar 16, 2010 5:23 PM EDT up reply actions
Then you're dead on there
I love our wideout class myself. All five of them have different styles of play
by westcoastnolefan on Mar 16, 2010 5:51 PM EDT up reply actions
What about
P. Warrick, Randy Moss, Laverneus Coles? I know they never played a game together but neither has this WR class.
Coles wasn't apart of the same class
He arrived a year later
by westcoastnolefan on Mar 17, 2010 11:37 AM EDT up reply actions
Bud
Im just glad to see you throw my boy a bone im so looking forward to seeing Rhodes and Jenije in a scheme this year that will take advantage of their abilities. We have the potential to have some big corners on the field next year Harris Jenjie and Rhodes all good sized kids.
Im glad the coaches are allowing Moody to stay at safety in a zone based scheme he will be just fine and its going to end up being an advantage for us having him out there.
I have this feeling that Rhodes beats out Greg and Seminole nation has a meltdown
until they see that Rhodes fits quite well.
Nothing is better than having options
It shows that we are adding talented depth and not just extra bodies because I think Reid has a great skillset.
by Jamil Dawson on Mar 16, 2010 2:49 PM EDT up reply actions
Oh I agree...
I’m just envisioning a situation where our 2 marquee recruits G5 & LJ aren’t seeing the field, but if they aren’t the best, they don’t play.
I think Harris...
beats them both out and starts with Jenjie. Then Rhodes potentially beats out Jenjie- I like Reid as a returner and playmaking nickel back!
Bud great write up
do you think Demps plays SS or FS?
I would love to see Demps at FS with Moody at SS to start the season. I have been high on Demps ever since watching his HS tape. I think he develops into a great safety for us under Stoops. I hope Moody does what he needs to do to get acclimated with the new system because it would be really nice to have a punishing SS like him to kill the receivers who dare come across the middle on our D. I think he could benefit tremendously on not having to cover slot receivers / TE / or Backs 1 on 1 anymore and be able to drop back read the play and go make a hit.
Also love the fact that Jenije/ Rhodes / Harris all have good size for CBs and could excel in a Zone heavy scheme if they can grasp their assignments. I think GR5 will remain in the nickel or even dime for this year, love the kids ability but he still has a lot to learn in coverage. We will get plenty of GR5 highlights on the return game though.
Demps is the guy who could play either really
Moody is definitely an SS, while Parks and Harley are more of the FS variety.
I think he could benefit tremendously on not having to cover slot receivers / TE / or Backs 1 on 1 anymore and be able to drop back read the play and go make a hit.
Agree a million times.
Awesome work Bud
Really excited about opposing WR & RB getting lit up by Rhodes, with fans across Doak doing the X
"I got a PBS mind in an MTV world"...Jimmy Buffett
by The Ryno and I Know on Mar 16, 2010 2:36 PM EDT reply actions
Zone
I had this discussion on FSUs D with my father, who also happens to have coached the secondary on college and high school levels. I asked him how hard he thought it is to transition from man to zone in the secondary. His answer surprised me. He said it depends on the group of kids you have playing back there. When I asked him to explain more in depth he told me that when it comes to zone, you have to have a group that can work together as a unit. The concepts of zone are very simple to understand and carry out but if your group out there can not communicate with each other then the zone will fall apart each and every time. He said since most schools in high school are running spreads now, many high schools are running zones, the problem with this is most high school secondary coaches have no clue how to properly teach zone coverage so many kids come out with a disadvantage. (guess this is why when he went to a camp at UT to help the secondary coach up there had him teach the high school kids the proper way to play zone in the secondary). He finished the conversation with this “If the players are coach-able like my teammates and I were back in the day, they will be able to pick up zone with no problem. Of course they will have speed bumps along the way, but even seasoned teams have this problem” It’s nice having a father who has 40+ years of playing and coaching experience and just so happened to be one of the original FSU to UNA pipeline players!
forgot to add
Another key he said besides group communication was you have to have a smart Free Safety. One who understands everything and each position in the secondary. Guess that’s why he had me play free in high school(grew up breaking down film with him before I could pee on my own)
Good thoughts.
I completely agree. With the exception of some of the “simple” comments, because some of this stuff is quite complicated. We’ll see our big leap in 2011 when I expect a top 15 type defense.
I think the base scheme is fairly simple...the wrinkles when added in full make it even more complicated than man.
If Stoops holds to his plan to give them Base only until they can handle it and then add slowly (which Jimbo has already refuted) then a solid D is possible this year, and better atheletes CAN start. If not you may be right that others pass the “better” atheletes by.
Yeah, right!
Yeah I have to say they are throwing everything at them at once
Which is goo and bad. Good if they pick it up. Bad if they don’t. Good to weed out the guys who aren’t serious about working.
Of coarse these may simply be a teaching method like Fisher on offense...
spring EVERYTHING and scare the poop out of them.
Then install peice by peice as they are able in the fall.
Then call what they can actually run in the season.
Yeah, right!
Nice work! I've a coach in the family connected with FSU claims Andrews tells him that The kids on last years secondary were among the mentally slowest he's coached.
I realize that Andrews was a lame duck and that the scheme was rediculous. But He’s not a total coaching idot, so the thought that these guys might not be that bright scarse the bigeezus out of me.
Thoughts?
Yeah, right!
Terrifies me as well
Which is why I think Demps has a really nice shot to get PT. Andrews scheme wasn’t ridiculous in his prime. Not changing it for 20 years is as much a product of his great success. I think he might have lost some measure of ability to relate to the kids.
I know it's spring but Harris is running a Zone heavy scheme in JuCo already...he may just start after all when he arrives.
Yeah, right!
His film shows a lot of "multiple" looks in zone, then occassional man, and a lot of disguising looks as man then running zone.
I think He’s got a head start on the others… they better learn fast! IMO
Yeah, right!
I think that attracted him during recruiting
He mentioned that he was very comfortable with the type of system that Stoops runs. In fact, if I remember right he was the first recruit that Stoops signed at FSU.
Moody vs Mangum
In one sentence you say Moody should’ve started over Mangum. And in another sentence you say that Moody didn’t know the coverages. Wouldn’t you want to start a guy who may not have the athletic ability but knows the coverages? I agree that Moody is a lot more talented than Mangum, but is it possible that Moody could have played worse than Mangum since he didn’t know the plays?
You're assuming that Mangum did know them.
Which from his play, I do not believe is the case. If the difference in coverage understanding was vast, I’d want to start the guy who knew his stuff.
Let Me Rephrase
You’re right Bud, I am assuming Mangum knew the coverages. If they were about equal in knowing their coverage assignments, then of course Moody should’ve started. But let’s say Mangum knew a considerable amount more than Moody, then what do you do?
Then I play Mangum if and until
he proves that he can’t cover. There may be an issue of test anxiety here. Some guys are just not good on a chalk board but can play pretty well. If Mangum aced his written coverage quiz but had no idea what he was doing on the field, as might have been the case, then I can’t play him either.
Covering an ineligible receiver would be one of those "proves his knowledge does not translate to the field" events
Something else I saw more than once last year for the first time in my 23 years of watching FSU football.
On multiple plays inside the 6 yard line, the strong safety (not gonna name names) unsuccessfully trying to catch the ball carrier FROM BEHIND on a rush straight between the hashes.
That’s deplorable, unfathomable, improbable.
Had this guy been our AD we would have been cleared of all charges of acedimic fraud...
and then been given two wins automatically for our trouble….UF and MIA
of coarse Amato Cramer would have flubbed it up and lost the whole deel.
Yeah, right!
"You put the blitz on? Who told you to put the blitz on? I didn't tell you to put the blitz on. Why'd you put the blitz on?"
by The K-Man on Mar 16, 2010 4:30 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
I can totally hear Amato sunshades and red shoes sliding then hitting the locked door the HC's office.
Yeah, right!
by truecolors on Mar 16, 2010 4:32 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
"By the way.....that defense was broke when you gave it to me......."
We could alley oop Seinfold quotes all day.
Hahahahahahaha
K-Man, where were you for the Sue Ellen Mishke-Chuck Amato comparison???
“Of course a bra’s not going to fit on over a leotard. A bra’s got to fit right up against a person’s skin…like a glove!”
"I got a PBS mind in an MTV world"...Jimmy Buffett
by The Ryno and I Know on Mar 16, 2010 5:16 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Did you seriously just ask if anyone could play WORSE than Mangum?
I don’t think that is reasonably possible. I think my 2 year old daughter could play better than Mangum. And i don’t even have a daughter yet : )
LOL it was a legit wording ? though.
Best facial expression of the year …. was P-Rob after running down Noel Divine (because he forced him inside only to discover for some unfathomable reason Mangum ran to the other side of the field) He cut his eyes at Mangum as if to say… seriously!? you still don’t get it!?
Yeah, right!
fair question I just couldn't help myself
I’m done bashing #22 or the old regime though. At least that’s what I am telling myself.
Ever since the bowl game, my comp's background has been PRob catching Devine while Mangum falls 5yds back
Microcosm of the past 4 years.
“picture worth a thousand words” comes into play here.
http://www.palmbeachpost.com/multimedia/dynamic/00080/93468693_80724c.jpg
I like this last overall statement...
By Fall though, they should make enough strides to have FSU’s defense in the top half of BCS conference teams.
Not sure I can take another reality check like last years preview bracing us for the worst FSU Defense in a very long time.
the thing that gives me hope
Last year everyone at Tomahawk Nation said, “this defense is gonna be bad”. We knew it was gonna happen…and it was bad.
Now, I’m no football expert, but I am obsessed with TN. If they say we’re gonna be in the top half of the BCS in defense, I believe them. And I’m pumped
Doubtful
Jimbo is a great OC. And after Jimbo’s first year (2007) FSU was only #80 in Total Offense; then 54 in 2008. I think it’ll take at least 2 years to be in the top half of BCS team defenses.
Nothing can stop us....
Defense has better talent than offense at similar positions
whole program has improved.
And I am not talking about total offense. Terrible measure. Doesn’t account for opponent or pace.
I know
the TN folk don’t like non-FEI stats, but typically they’re approx +/- 10 from FEI. (I’ll use FEI from now on.) Also, although I haven’t run the data, I wonder if it’s easier (read: statistically more likely) for D to improve than O???
Nothing can stop us....
Love these preview write-ups, thank you Bud
But now I don’t have anymore to look forward to. What’s next, spring practice updates? I need something to read during lunch breaks. cheers.
seriously
this can’t be over yet I need more crack, errr info. What else am I going to waste countless hours of work doing? College Basketball? I think not
He will gladly ReDo a complete breakdown for the summer which includes but is not limited to...
MattD spying on the kids when they visit home to see how things are going/cover up any moral misteps
FrankD using ninja technique to scale the lights at doak and video practices
FSUn getting yet another GA planted inside the coaching staff.
Yeah, right!
Hey Bud Elliot.....
Do you know whats the plan for Tuesday and Thursday spring practices, will it be classroom type stuff……. Monday, Wed, and Friday are on the field practices….
Robenson Therezie's Fan Club!
Appreciate the effort......
I was just wondering when looking at the practice schedule, except for today , that Tuesday and Thursday wasn’t on there…..just wondering were those days designated for classroom, film, or conditioning( probably is year round)………
Damn I feel stalkerish………LOL
Robenson Therezie's Fan Club!
Spring Schedule
Tues,March 16…………..Shorts
Wed, March 17…………..Shorts
Fri, March 19…………..Shells
Sat, March 20…………..Shells
Mon,March 22…………..Full Pads/Shells
Wed, March 24…………..Full Pads/Shells
Fri, March 26…………..Full Pads/Shells
Sat, March 27…………..Scrimmage
Mon,March 29…………..Full Pads/Shells
Wed, March 31…………..Full Pads/Shells
Fri, April 2…………..Full Pads/Shells
Sat, April 3…………..Scrimmage
Mon,April 5…………..Full Pads/Shells
Wed, April 7…………..Full Pads/Shells
Sat, April 10…………..Spring Game…. 5pm
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And the days where....
Full Pads/Shells……I wonder if that will be 2-a-days
Robenson Therezie's Fan Club!
Don't think we can have 2-adays in Spring due to class
It’s pads or shells.
Seems to me we only get 15 practices and want to space them out as much as possible to let the new stuff sink in.
That makes sense about
the 2adays……mostly for summer practices I assume…..I can understand the days off/the field for helping it marinate and to get some studing in……
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If that's what they're doing, that's a great idea.
Gives the players as much time as possible to learn the new stuff to decrease the likelihood that they’ll become overwhelmed with the information and also more time for the new coaches to build chemistry with each other. Spacing the practices out also keeps the players legs fresher.
Yes they are probably meeting
When I was in spring practice all days were meeting days so ya most likely they will be in some kind of film and class room work.
As long as you don't know how many gold teeth or tatoos each player has, your all cool.
too much cafine!!!!
Yeah, right!
Great analysis, as usual
… but, isn’t it time we got beyond the Mangum-bashing? The kid worked hard, never got in trouble, and did everything he was asked to do. He was not as talented as many others, but certainly more talented than any of us tapping on our keyboards. He is a member of the Seminole family, and we should wish him nothing but the best.
He might not have gotten into legal trouble of any kind
but he was a complete clown. I don’t know if I had a class with a more disruptive, obnoxious kid in my four years in college.
by SeminoleSkins87 on Mar 16, 2010 4:47 PM EDT up reply actions
It'll take me a while ...
to get past the hard-hitting writing style (e.g., “good to get rid of Mangum” sounds really harsh). Maybe something like – “Korey Mangum, bless his heart, was an honest trier, but ….”
:-)!!
Cool
I appreciate the analysis. I am a huge, huge fan of Coach Andrews and will miss his presence on the sidelines. But, I look forward to great things from the new staff.
Thanks for all these pieces Bud.
They have all been great to read. I am with you about Jenije, I think he has the chance to shine in the new scheme Stoops brings. He played well in zone last year at times.
Enjoyed the read as always
Here’s hoping Mark Stoops was a big reason for E.Reed’s/S Taylor’s/P Buchanon/(A. Rolle’s?) success and will do the same here.
The secondary I'd like to see provided these kids pick up the schemes and play to their ability in camp
CB 1 Harris
2 Reid
CB 1 Rhodes
2 Jenije
FS 1 Harley
2 Parks
SS 1 Demps
2 Moody
Demps is an unproven commodity but hell, everyone here is. Glad to see he put his RS year to good use by bulking up. If he is truly a smart and instinctive player then he should be deligent at studying film as well. It should help him adapt to the zone system much quicker. Moody would be a good fallback option but his purported lack of football IQ bothers me since were going to a coverage system he has no familiarity with (Even though I could see him doing well in a cover 1 or cover 3 and supporting the run). I hope Harley can flash his potential because Parks has done nothing in two years (we may now know why). If seeing his former HS teammate (Eric Berry) collect millions in the draft doesn’t help light a fire under his rear, I have no idea what would.
To me, the upside at corner is greater with Rhodes than it is with Jenije (sorry mods) and if Harris cannot start for us, I wonder why Stoops recruited him so hard (Even while still at Arizona). He has good size, will support the run, and seems to have the makeup speed required to compensate for any false steps. If Jenije was really the victim of scheme last year, we will find out soon people. Reid may be the fan favorite but probably isn’t ready to be a lockdown guy on the outside just yet. But with his ballskills he could make a impact in the zone scheme. I hope Stoops can put him in a position to read patterns and drive on the ball and make plays Asante style. JMHO.
Seems like we have a high upside secondary for sure. That I like
by westcoastnolefan on Mar 16, 2010 6:27 PM EDT reply actions
If I remember correctly, Dionte Allen had thumb surgery last season and had some pins inserted and wore a cast for most of the 2nd half.
If I also remember correctly, Xavier Rhodes also had a thumb injury at about the same.
One of these 2 players hurt his thumb during some stupid locker room horseplay, but I don’t remember which one or the exact details.
I am afraid that since we no longer have a Executive Head Coach in charge of Discipline, the horseplay will only get worse and the locker room could resemble the Delta Tau Chi (ΔΤΧ) frat house during rush week and we will be looking at many players suffering season ending injuries. ;-)
Seriously though, I agree and really think Rhodes is going to surprise everyone, I have very high expectations for him and would not be surprised if he is a starter come fall.
>-----:----:------>Spear 'em then Scalp 'em
Bud,
Not trying to call you out or anything, but I noticed up above you say you expect a lot of cover 3. You also say you like Rhodes as a CB. Do you think Rhodes would be a much better cover 2 corner? I feel like his skill set is very well suited to play a lot of cover 2 but he may not be ready to be in a cover 3-heavy scheme. The same may be said for Jenije but I think his skill set makes him a bit more versatile. Obviously, it won’t be exclusively cover 2 or exclusively cover 3 but just curious to get your thoughts.
Don't be afraid to ask questions!
I do think they would do well in a cover2 zone scheme. Not sure about much better. Remember that about half the time one corner in a cov3 scheme will be taking the flat.
by Bud Elliott on Mar 16, 2010 7:37 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I think Monte Kiffin would have a field day with Rhodes (if he was coaching here)
That kind of build gets me giddy in a CB. Admittedly, I have not seen much of Rhodes so you have a better idea of his complete skill set but a guy that big is ideal to lock down the flats. I have the thought in my head that Rhodes is a bit stiff and not very fluid. Harris is of similar build no? From what I have seen of Harris he is very fluid though.
in a long distant past
I seem to remember a jedi named Deon who was pretty lame at tackling….liked to freelance…….but worked out nicely with a stud DL…….Ried should be fine with the new staff/scheme…..work he must,,,,,work he will
Deion is as close to a true
“One of a Kind” as you will ever get. Right there with Bo Jackson as the greatest American born “athlete” of all times.
No mention of our prized recruit
What about Lamarcus
He's not enrolled at FSU right now
Bud’s only addressing the guys around for spring ball in these pieces. I’m sure we’ll have a lot to get excited about with Joyner once he starts practicing in the summer. And as good as he will likely end up becoming, we shouldn’t overlook some of these kids we already have in the program who just had bad coaching until now, which I think is one of the points Bud is trying to emphasize here.
by SeminoleSkins87 on Mar 16, 2010 8:24 PM EDT up reply actions
Zone coverage
The article mentions “leveraging percentages to the hilt” as a principle of zone coverage. I have a decent understanding of zone coverage, but I’m not familiar with this concept. Can you explain this?
Bud, I completely agree about G Reid
I don’t think the coaching staff should rush G Reid into a starting position based solely on athletic ability. I’d like to see them use him the way UM used Antrel Rolle against us in 2004: put him in the nickel spot and use in a blitz package. He seemed to do a lot of damage last year when improvising so I think he’ll be better suited to a Nickel role for now.

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