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Around SBN: Terry Collins, David Wright, And The Mets/Brewers Kerfuffle

Seminoles Baseball Narrowly Avoids Embarrassing Sweep

The Florida State Seminoles hosted the Virginia Tech Hokies this past Easter weekend in Tallahassee and if it wasn't for a certain head coach putting his team's pride and personal gain ahead of a player's health the ‘Noles might have been swept. 

Florida State got off to a rough start in Game 1 with Sean Gilmartin having his worse outing of his collegiate career.  The lefty sophomore lasted only 4+ innings and left the Seminoles in a 8-0 hole.  That was more than enough for the Hokies as they went on to win by a final of 10-5. Gilmartin's struggles against a mediocre Tech lineup continue to cause concern for the future of the perceived staff ace.  The average fan can be fooled by the freakish numbers put up in out of conference games against inferior opponents but the true test of a pitcher is how they fare in ACC games.

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Looking at his numbers when compared to other Friday starters you get a good idea of what an ace should be.  We will monitor Gilmartin throughout the rest of the season and see if he continues to regress in his sophomore campaign.

With much of the focus on the lack of a Sunday starter for the ‘Noles John Gast's terrible 2010 season has been able to fly relatively low under the radar.  The lefty sophomore managed to pitch his longest ACC outing of the season, unfortunately for FSU it was only 4 2/3 innings in where he allowed 8 earned runs including 3 homeruns by Hokie hitters. FSU managed a small rally late in the game but ended up losing 8-7.

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ACC opponents have been teeing off on Gast this season with a ridiculous BAA of .500. It is unsure how much longer Gast will stay in a starting role but I am not sure how much more effective he would be anywhere else.

Game 3 played out as expected, Geoff Parker pitched ineffectively for 3 innings and was pulled for the ‘Noles best pitcher in Brian Busch.  The big lefty came in and against the first batter faced he violently twisted his knee in an attempt to cover the bag at first immediately dropping to the ground in agonizing pain.  Busch faced another 18 batters and despite obvious discomfort in his knee which affected his delivery and control head coach Mike Martin left him out there in order to keep the Hokies from adding to their lead.  As expected Jesse Hahn pitched great against the ‘Noles but ran into a wall in the 6th inning, he was clearly out of gas but with zero options in the bullpen he was left to pitch and allowed a game tying homerun to Parker Brunelle.  Manny Martir came in for Virginia Tech and the Seminoles took full advantage of it lighting him up for 5 runs in 1 2/3 innings to avoid the sweep. Final - FSU 9-6.

This series just further highlighted the poor starting pitching that has plagued Florida State for years and will continue to do so as long as Jamie Shouppe is continued to be employed by FSU.

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Does that really look like a staff that can get this team to Omaha?  Mike Martin said that the coaching staff is going to look at film and evaluate the rotation for future series but to tell you the truth I am unsure what more they can do at this point.

Mike Martin Quote of the Week: When asked during the 5th inning of Sunday's game what he thought about this Virginia Tech team.

This is a Top 20, probably Top 15 ball club we are facing this weekend.

A team who is 60 games under .500 in ACC play over the past 4 years and only ACC wins in 2010 have come against consistent bottom dwellers in Maryland and Wake Forest is not a Top 15 team.

It took almost 10 years of underperforming to make changes to Florida State football.  The baseball program has made it to Omaha only twice in the last decade and is in no place to make a run this year.  It is time to make changes with this baseball program, there is too much talent being wasted at the hands of those in the dugouts.

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But Mike Martin has earned the right...

No, seriously. The pitching woes in conference play are very troubling. This month was supposed to be the cake walk section of the schedule. Disastrous, so far.

>>---l>

by DKfromVA on Apr 5, 2010 9:58 AM EDT reply actions  

The problem is

They are going to destroy Wake next weekend and everyone is going to say, “I told you so”

It's a beautiful day in Tallahassee

by RaysnNoles on Apr 5, 2010 10:00 AM EDT up reply actions  

Watched Texas, LSU, & FLA on TV this weekend

and our starting pitching really looks poor when compared to the guys they were rolling out there. Unfortunately, I dont know that we have many other viable options. I agree that Busch should be in the rotation, but beyond that, there are no sure fire options. Maybe Sitz, Scantling, or Benincasa, but I wouldn’t bet the farm on any of those guys right now.
I am not feeling real “warm and fuzzy” about our chances of getting past the regional/super regional hurdles this year.

by Mogan on Apr 5, 2010 10:05 AM EDT reply actions  

Not arguing that VT IS a Top Team but,
A team who is 60 games under .500 in ACC play over the past 4 years and only ACC wins in 2010 have come against consistent bottom dwellers in Maryland and Wake Forest is not a Top 15 team.

What does history have to do with the current Hokies? Especially in college baseball, guys are coming and going all the time. The team 4 years ago has nothing to do with the present team.

CEO of ScalpEm.com

by NoleCC on Apr 5, 2010 10:14 AM EDT reply actions  

I agree to an extent

But teams don’t magically go from the the bottom of the ACC to Top in the country over the course of 1 season

It's a beautiful day in Tallahassee

by RaysnNoles on Apr 5, 2010 10:20 AM EDT up reply actions  

Agreed

That was just Martin trying to make himself feel better about a poor showing all weekend by the team.

CEO of ScalpEm.com

by NoleCC on Apr 5, 2010 10:24 AM EDT up reply actions  

It IS the same.

Acting like your opponent magically pulled a great game out of their a** while facing you or that they are actually a great team that just wasn’t playing great prior to facing you to avoid acknowledging that there is a problem.

MiNDSET? SWAG-ER-ISM!!!
---------------------------------------------------------
"Trick is right."
"Wherever you are, Trick, you are wise, indeed."

by tricknole on Apr 5, 2010 4:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

I would call not call VT's lineup mediocre

they do hit very well for average at 4th in the conference, and are #1 in doubles, and #4 in HRs, they also dont strikeout that much

by DrB on Apr 5, 2010 10:17 AM EDT reply actions  

Maybe average is a better term

Average holds little clout with me, they are 5th in doubles (that stat also means very little), they don’t strikeout much but they also don’t walk much (6th in BB:K)

It's a beautiful day in Tallahassee

by RaysnNoles on Apr 5, 2010 10:46 AM EDT up reply actions  

5th in conference-play only, 1st overall

Team BA in conference play is the same as yours, and most of their key offensive and pitching statistics are basically the same as FSU’s in conference play.

by DrB on Apr 5, 2010 10:54 AM EDT up reply actions  

We are playing at the level of VT

Which is not good

It's a beautiful day in Tallahassee

by RaysnNoles on Apr 5, 2010 10:57 AM EDT up reply actions  

There is some minor concern with our offense


We have faced solid pitching so far and I think they will improve as the season goes on and MM stays with a lineup that works.

It's a beautiful day in Tallahassee

by RaysnNoles on Apr 5, 2010 11:08 AM EDT up reply actions  

You're basing those numbers off of...?

This weekend? Where they tore our pitching apart?

In ACC play they were 6th in AVG, 8th in OBP and 9th in SLG prior to our series.

MiNDSET? SWAG-ER-ISM!!!
---------------------------------------------------------
"Trick is right."
"Wherever you are, Trick, you are wise, indeed."

by tricknole on Apr 5, 2010 4:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

Correctamundo on this

Chris Roberts former Seminole All American and pitching coach at NCSU should be given a look. It is always best to look at a former pitcher as a college coach as it all starts with pitching in college ball and FSU has never been up to par in this area. FSU will continue to spin it’s wheels as long as MM is there.

" Fisher’s approach to building a winner is lifted from Saban’s playbook. Right down to the terminology such as becoming more "process oriented" as opposed to "results oriented."

" Nick and I are friends," he said. "That guy is one of the best football coaches I’ve ever been around. God knows he’s brilliant. … A lot of the things he believes are a lot of things I believe. We’re very similar!

The process begins!

by DocHoliday2 on Apr 5, 2010 10:33 AM EDT reply actions  

Oh

Does anyone realize what FSU baseball was before Mike Martin? Fred Hatfield was taking them to the college world series quite consistently.

What are we going to hear next, “I don’t listen to those ebayers or play station all Americans?” It must be parity!

" Fisher’s approach to building a winner is lifted from Saban’s playbook. Right down to the terminology such as becoming more "process oriented" as opposed to "results oriented."

" Nick and I are friends," he said. "That guy is one of the best football coaches I’ve ever been around. God knows he’s brilliant. … A lot of the things he believes are a lot of things I believe. We’re very similar!

The process begins!

by DocHoliday2 on Apr 5, 2010 10:42 AM EDT reply actions  

Dadgumit...

Half the teams lose everytime the game is played. Don’t ya know that.

And I prefer baseball on the Wii system.

:oP

by Diablo_2 on Apr 5, 2010 12:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

While 11 certainly isn't an elite coach,

his teams have never been mediocre like Bobby’s last several. Until we are a 3 seed or a 4 seed in someone’s regional, we haven’t yet hit the low the football team saw. Not that I’m advocating for Martin. I’d be perfectly fine if we asked him to retire at the end of the season if we hired a great coach in his place (and assuming a miracle doesn’t happen and we don’t win the CWS this year).

MiNDSET? SWAG-ER-ISM!!!
---------------------------------------------------------
"Trick is right."
"Wherever you are, Trick, you are wise, indeed."

by tricknole on Apr 5, 2010 4:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

UH-OH!!

If you keep posting articles like this one questioning the perfection that is #11 then Madcow and Seminole64 are gonna BAN you from….wait, never mind.

I was just having an unfortunate WarChant flash-back. ;oP

by Diablo_2 on Apr 5, 2010 11:57 AM EDT reply actions  

Is 8 like the magic number

before a starter gets pulled? That seems like a lot of runs getting scored before yanking the pitcher. I know the bullpen doesn’t seem to be that great either but if your starters not doing well you have to put someone in before you give up 8!

by KnoxNole on Apr 5, 2010 1:25 PM EDT reply actions  

That 8 is just a coincidence

Our bullpen has actually been somewhat of a bright spot for us

It's a beautiful day in Tallahassee

by RaysnNoles on Apr 5, 2010 1:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah, I was just commenting that

it seemed to take Eleven a little long to yank the starter.

by KnoxNole on Apr 5, 2010 2:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

That's not an uncommon occurence.

MiNDSET? SWAG-ER-ISM!!!
---------------------------------------------------------
"Trick is right."
"Wherever you are, Trick, you are wise, indeed."

by tricknole on Apr 5, 2010 4:42 PM EDT up reply actions  

Virginia Tech Sweeps ACC’s Weekly Baseball Honors

VT also moved to #25 in BA rankings further proving that polls/rankings in college baseball are very reactionary and do not reflect the true talent of a team

It's a beautiful day in Tallahassee

by RaysnNoles on Apr 5, 2010 1:55 PM EDT reply actions  

How much longer does MM have in him?

BB would have coached to the grave. Does Mike Martin want to retire at some point? I assume he’ll want his son to replace him, which from what I’ve heard, would not be such a bad thing. If Spetman told MM that he wanted to move on and put his son in the HC role, how much would MM resist?

Team Gold

by basaltrock on Apr 5, 2010 4:01 PM EDT reply actions  

A coach retiring only because the admin promised to promote his son

There are so many things wrong with that and in no way should that ever be an option.

It's a beautiful day in Tallahassee

by RaysnNoles on Apr 5, 2010 4:15 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

Deja vu all over again

The head coach can’t bequeath the program to his son, because he doesn’t own the program. FSU baseball was big time long before Mike Martin, and the fanbase/ climate/ facilities provide a terrific advantage for whoever is the coach. Maybe his son can coach at the top level, but he should prove it elsewhere.

Bobby deserved credit for turning a weak program into a model, but then he insisted on a decade of nepotism and cronyism. That road leads nowhere.

by madridbend on Apr 5, 2010 6:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

Hiring Meat would be a horrible move.

Not sure why you don’t think it “would not be such a bad thing”, and not sure why you’d prefer that over “a good thing”.

MiNDSET? SWAG-ER-ISM!!!
---------------------------------------------------------
"Trick is right."
"Wherever you are, Trick, you are wise, indeed."

by tricknole on Apr 5, 2010 4:50 PM EDT up reply actions  

Granted I am not as knowledgable about FSU baseball as other sports

But from what I’ve heard and read, isn’t Meat considered a fairly progressive and skilled coach? If he would actually be one of the best options out there to replace MM (extra points added since he knows the system and recruiting grounds), I see no problem with the situation. We’re all so jaded by the Jeffy situation. Had he been one of the top offensive minds in 2000, and kept our football team at the top echelon of the college landscape, would we be so against the move today?

Team Gold

by basaltrock on Apr 5, 2010 5:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

That's the thing.

I have no idea how good of a coach meat is. Our program was great before he arrived. Our hitting must’ve been, too, since he came on board in the mid/late 90’s, during the midst of our annual Omaha trips. Has our hitting declined? No, I don’t think so. Has the program improved? No, I don’t think so. (Has actually probably regressed a little, but I’m in no position to say who’s fault that is.) He hasn’t proven anything, to me, other than he’s a capable coach that can be put into a great situation and not screw it up.

I’d argue the same for Fisher when we hired him. I was opposed to him being hciw. I was opposed even up to the early part of last season. Obviously last season’s offense won me over. But the point is, Fisher went some place that was in need of fixing and fixed it. He proved he was a facilitator of change. Meat hasn’t proven that to me. I was hoping last year (or the year before?) he’d get hired by Wake Forest. Either he’d suck as a coach and we’d learn not to hire him as head coach (and drag Wake even further down as a program), or he’d excel there and in 5 years or so when his dad retired he would be one of the several at the top of our list.

He just hasn’t proven anything.

MiNDSET? SWAG-ER-ISM!!!
---------------------------------------------------------
"Trick is right."
"Wherever you are, Trick, you are wise, indeed."

by tricknole on Apr 5, 2010 6:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

Would I be against the move of Fredo if it worked, no.

Would I necessarily be for Fredo being named head coach if it had worked, no.

Much the same as I wouldn’t want to just offer Derrick Brooks a position as lb coach, or Deion as cb coach, and why I didn’t like just handing the position to Colzie or Buckley. I’m glad it worked out with Haggins (although the past few years have been pretty rough), but it failed miserably with Carter. Obviously a small sample size, but a 50% success rate isn’t success at all.

MiNDSET? SWAG-ER-ISM!!!
---------------------------------------------------------
"Trick is right."
"Wherever you are, Trick, you are wise, indeed."

by tricknole on Apr 5, 2010 6:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

I don't think that's an accurate comparison though

Brooks hasn’t been in the program for quite a while and has never coached at FSU. A more apt comparison would be if Dawsey rose through the ranks, to OC and then HC, after showing a talent for coaching.

Team Gold

by basaltrock on Apr 5, 2010 7:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

I don't think you understood what I was meaning.

I’m against just handing someone a coaching job. Prove yourself first. FSU is not the place you prove you can coach. You want to be FSU’s OL coach? Cool. Go be a good one somewhere else and then call me.

You want to be FSU’s baseball coach? Great. Do it well somewhere else first.

MiNDSET? SWAG-ER-ISM!!!
---------------------------------------------------------
"Trick is right."
"Wherever you are, Trick, you are wise, indeed."

by tricknole on Apr 5, 2010 7:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

That is why I'm against Brooks, Colzie, Deion and Buckley being first time coaches here.

It’s why I was against Fisher being head coach until midway through last season (and still think we could’ve lured away a high profile coach).

It’s why I’m against just handing the gig over to Meat.

MiNDSET? SWAG-ER-ISM!!!
---------------------------------------------------------
"Trick is right."
"Wherever you are, Trick, you are wise, indeed."

by tricknole on Apr 5, 2010 7:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

There is a good possibility Fisher is going to be a high profile coach soon

Now some of the best assistants in the country have flocked in his direction without batting an eye. They just might consider fisher a high profile coach already.

It is always good when the head coach is an offensive guru also. Saban is good but he is a defensive guy. Meyer has been very successful but frankly I still believe Mullen was the engine but we will find out this year.

Which high profile coach would you have rather had than say Fisher?

" Fisher’s approach to building a winner is lifted from Saban’s playbook. Right down to the terminology such as becoming more "process oriented" as opposed to "results oriented."

" Nick and I are friends," he said. "That guy is one of the best football coaches I’ve ever been around. God knows he’s brilliant. … A lot of the things he believes are a lot of things I believe. We’re very similar!

The process begins!

by DocHoliday2 on Apr 6, 2010 12:39 AM EDT up reply actions  

Most any successful HEAD coach.

Not sure why you’re continuing this conversation though. Mentioning Fisher was merely an example to explain my thoughts, not the subject of my comments.

MiNDSET? SWAG-ER-ISM!!!
---------------------------------------------------------
"Trick is right."
"Wherever you are, Trick, you are wise, indeed."

by tricknole on Apr 6, 2010 2:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

That is why there are supposed to be nepotism laws

You don’t even want to be wondering if some deal took place so a coach slide his son into a position. As I have said before you could look at this program and wonder if Martin doesn’t hire a top flight pitching coach because he might turn out too good. So good that he becomes the next head coach and MM’s son is not considered. Now we don’t know that but we cannot prove it might not be true also.

That is the problem with making a college program a family affair. Most colleges stay away from this but FSU had to go down this road in two sports. I really don’t think it would ever happen again though after the Bowden fiasco.

I also found it perfect timing that MM threw a public hissy and made public statements over how he thought BB was being unfairly criticized about Fredo. Was he padding his own turf for the possibility of his son taking over at FSU? You see we don’t know that for sure but the perception is there. Nepotism is a bad idea. It is against the law and FSU should have never gotten themselves in such a position.

" Fisher’s approach to building a winner is lifted from Saban’s playbook. Right down to the terminology such as becoming more "process oriented" as opposed to "results oriented."

" Nick and I are friends," he said. "That guy is one of the best football coaches I’ve ever been around. God knows he’s brilliant. … A lot of the things he believes are a lot of things I believe. We’re very similar!

The process begins!

by DocHoliday2 on Apr 6, 2010 12:31 AM EDT up reply actions  

Agree...

BB did the same thing, surrounded JB with questionable talent IMO, or at least nobody who would ever be considered to jump over him.

Meat may be a great coach, but go prove it elsewhere and then earn the right to come back, I always worry about handing the program over like that and then the son thinking there is some kind of entitlement being the previous legendary coaches son, and then there is that reluctance to fire the legendary coaches son if he’s not living up to expectations, just not a good situation IMO.

ALSO there is a good chance Shoupe would be retained!

by karmanole on Apr 6, 2010 2:13 PM EDT reply actions  

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